Forum V: Archive
Compiled: Fri, Jun 16, 2000 at 11:13:17 (GMT)
From: Jun 06, 2000 To: Jun 14, 2000 Page: 4 Of: 5


Elan Vital -:- Propagation Meeting reminder -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:56:40 (GMT)
__ Joe -:- Are you strip searched before they let you in? -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:26:58 (GMT)
__ __ SB -:- Elan Vital offers DONATIONS opportunity!! -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 02:13:34 (GMT)
__ __ me -:- Are you strip searched before they let you in? -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:09:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ Joe -:- What I want to know... -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 23:12:16 (GMT)

Gregg -:- Am I In a Cult, redux -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 18:46:54 (GMT)
__ Helen -:- Am I In a Cult, redux -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 23:06:05 (GMT)
__ Elaine -:- NM -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:03:07 (GMT)
__ __ Monmot -:- NM -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 02:47:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ Elaine -:- NM -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 14:59:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Monmot -:- NM--Thanks, Sounds Great nt -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:53:54 (GMT)
__ __ Robyn -:- NM -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:12:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ Elaine -:- NM -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 14:39:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Robyn -:- NM -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:03:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Elaine -:- NM -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:14:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Robyn -:- NM -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:39:56 (GMT)
__ Selene -:- New Mexico does that to you -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:44:36 (GMT)

john D -:- Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:29:25 (GMT)
__ Jethro -:- Vedpraktanand -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 18:31:42 (GMT)
__ __ john d -:- Vedpraktanand -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 12:06:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ cq -:- Is Mahatma Adharanand still around? -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 17:44:20 (GMT)
__ Nigel -:- Question -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 14:31:00 (GMT)
__ __ JOHN D -:- RE:TO QUESTION -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 12:49:17 (GMT)
__ Loaf -:- Perhaps you know what a brayner is ? -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 05:25:49 (GMT)
__ __ JOHND -:- SORRY DUNNO WHAT IS THE BRAYNOR AND I KNOW A LOT -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 13:16:37 (GMT)
__ __ Elaine -:- Perhaps you know what a brayner is ?ROFL -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:35:24 (GMT)
__ (Sir) David -:- But he's God's brother -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 03:26:19 (GMT)
__ __ JOHN D -:- NOTEWORTHY REPLY -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:22:53 (GMT)
__ __ gerry -:- Oh brother, he's god? -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:48:10 (GMT)
__ __ __ JOHN D -:- OOH, THAT'S A TOPPER! -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:58:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ Elaine -:- That is sum ugly stuff... nt -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:48:51 (GMT)
__ Powerman -:- Barf bag please... -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:32:30 (GMT)
__ __ JOHND -:- DONT EAT WHAT YOU BARF -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 13:45:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ Powerman -:- What a stupid person you are, JohnD (nt) -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 19:42:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ john d -:- Look up some Howard Stern sites; have some fun!!! -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 13:10:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ Elaine -:- To John D. -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:13:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ JOHN D -:- YOU SEEM NICE AFTER ALL -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:45:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Way -:- Thanks for the responses -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 15:17:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ John d -:- Thanks for the responses -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 12:25:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Elaine -:- Good one again, Way -interesting guy,eh? nt -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 15:35:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Elaine -:- YOU SEEM NICE AFTER ALL -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 15:02:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ john D -:- who to ask? -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 12:38:17 (GMT)
__ Joe -:- Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 18:10:29 (GMT)
__ __ John D. -:- Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 10:33:16 (GMT)
__ Way -:- Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:49:40 (GMT)
__ __ JohnD -:- Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 11:35:16 (GMT)
__ __ Elaine -:- Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:53:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ JOHN D -:- Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 11:56:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Elaine -:- Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 13:30:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ John D -:- How's Lindsey? -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 13:35:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Elaine -:- How's Lindsey? -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 14:57:11 (GMT)
__ __ Coach -:- Gota Be A Joke -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:56:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ JOHN D -:- WHAT ELSE DO YOU READ? -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 15:03:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Coach -:- An' you follow an idiot -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 18:28:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- YOU SHOULD READ THE GURU PAPERS, JOHN D -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 16:04:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ John D. -:- are they posted here? -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 12:49:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- What kind of fool are you? -:- Sun, Jun 11, 2000 at 00:48:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ cq -:- I know you're posting all the way from India, but -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:21:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ john D -:- How could you copy that monster type??? -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 13:00:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Just press the Caps Lock, Einstein. (nt) -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 14:10:02 (GMT)

ET -:- The Light Technique -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 15:15:10 (GMT)
__ Person With Knowledge -:- The Light Technique -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:41:56 (GMT)
__ __ Robyn -:- Make water...pee pee...piss -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 10:19:45 (GMT)
__ Joe -:- Meditation 'Techniques' -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:20:56 (GMT)
__ __ ham -:- Meditation 'Techniques' -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 19:08:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ Joe -:- What has hormones to do with it? -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:05:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ ham -:- Everything I would have thought -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 09:44:21 (GMT)
__ __ ET -:- Meditation 'Techniques' -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 14:52:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ Robyn -:- Meditation 'Techniques' -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:48:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ red butler -:- love vapors -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 16:35:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- love bites love stings -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 05:10:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ red butler -:- love bites love stings -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 18:10:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- and dies -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 06:52:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Robyn -:- love vapors -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 16:54:29 (GMT)
__ Robyn -:- The Light Technique -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:11:17 (GMT)
__ __ Elaine -:- Thousand Petaled Lotus Flower.... -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:11:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ Mili -:- Thousand Petaled Lotus Flower.... -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 21:07:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Elaine -:- Thank you, Big smile. -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 00:37:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ cq -:- more innervisions ... -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 21:02:57 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Elaine -:- more innervisions ... -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:02:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ ET -:- What a wonderful attitude towards God! (nt) -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:08:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Elaine -:- What a wonderful attitude towards God! -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:29:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- omigod ... oh ... it's that great white ... -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:55:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Elaine -:- Didn't realize we were connected in 1st place (nt -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 21:55:10 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- it's that great white ... whale? (ot) -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 18:24:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- what makes the world go round? ... (ot) -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 19:59:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ hamzen -:- the brain and consciousness and chemikals, yummy -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 21:49:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Magnets?Cocktails?where's me Carlsberg special?(nt -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:57:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- et tu bru? -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 18:19:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ ham -:- And you a special bru man, -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 09:52:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- to hamzen, re: 'chemicals' -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 01:11:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ ham -:- to hamzen, re: 'chemicals' -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 10:05:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ Robyn -:- Thousand Petaled Lotus Flower.... -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:44:44 (GMT)
__ hamzen -:- The Light Technique -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:29:37 (GMT)
__ __ Stonor -:- Light 'Technique' or what? -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 03:28:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ Robyn -:- Light 'Technique' or what? -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 11:18:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Light 'Technique' or what? -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 12:56:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- PS to Robyn and thanks all -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 23:42:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Robyn -:- PS to Robyn and thanks all -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 00:26:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ Mili -:- Light 'Technique' or what? -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 09:16:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Dr. Jekyll, I presume. (nt) -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 23:23:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Mili -:- Ms. Hyde, I presume. (nt) -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 00:43:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Excuse me, but I think you're confusing me with -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 01:22:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- To Mili, with Love -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 02:49:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ cq -:- Blue dot=bindu? Mili? someone's been there B4?(nt) -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 20:11:01 (GMT)
__ __ Keith -:- The Light Technique -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:17:58 (GMT)
__ __ Jerry -:- The Light Technique -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:23:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ ham -:- Groovy I guess, yeah, groove is in the heart -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:43:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Robyn -:- Groovy I guess, yeah, groove is in the heart -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 10:21:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ ham -:- Not bad Robyn, but you forgot the 'e's, Deee-Lite -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 18:50:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Robyn -:- Not bad Robyn, but you forgot the 'e's, Deee-Lite -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 20:21:24 (GMT)
__ Elaine -:- The Light Technique -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 15:47:35 (GMT)
__ __ Jerry -:- The Light Technique -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 16:39:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ Elaine -:- The Light Technique -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 21:47:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ raina -:- Lady Kir...and........ -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 01:06:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ hamzen -:- 'You Don't Even Know Me' - you're starter for ten -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 20:16:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Robyn -:- Lady Kir...and........ -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 10:24:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ raina -:- Lady Kir...and........ -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 22:16:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Elaine -:- Welcome back ... -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 23:45:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jerry -:- The Light Technique -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:06:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Elaine -:- Light Tech or First Tech... -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:25:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ hamzen -:- I might be the exception that proves your rule -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 18:23:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Elaine -:- I might be the exception -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 20:50:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ ham -:- Sorry to be so pedantic but -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 11:51:33 (GMT)

Just the Facts -:- The 5 Commandments -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 12:04:45 (GMT)
__ Joe -:- Slight Correction -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:21:06 (GMT)
__ __ ham -:- If it wasn't it might as well have been -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:36:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ sam -:- If it wasn't it might as well have been -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:56:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ hamzen -:- GM's lineage thing is all bollox -:- Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 09:23:14 (GMT)
__ __ Just the Facts -:- Slight Correction or Variation? -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:42:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ Joe -:- Slight Correction or Variation? -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:20:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ Selene -:- I was handed Joe's version -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 18:14:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Just the Facts -:- I was handed Joe's version/Irrelevant-So what -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:59:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ selene -:- fuck you -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:01:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Just the Facts -:- fuck you-No Thanks -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:36:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- you WISH -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:47:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Monmot -:- E. 83rd St. Ashram? (nt) -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 18:29:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- was it a 5 or 6 story walk up brownstone type? -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:38:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Monmot -:- Sounds like it... -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:17:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- Anne Bancroft is the best -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:23:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Monmot -:- Bancroft keeps on ticking... -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:30:00 (GMT)
__ poet -:- peace -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:10:53 (GMT)
__ __ gerry -:- peace be unto you, Oh Poet -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:17:46 (GMT)
__ __ gerry -:- peace -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:26:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ poet -:- peace -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:00:45 (GMT)
__ jondon -:- Why post that again?....little bit of doubt?..(nt) -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 12:07:51 (GMT)
__ __ Joey -:- To jondon, from below re: Steve Hassan (ot) -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 14:00:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ jondon -:- Thanx, will call in again (nt) -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 14:25:17 (GMT)
__ __ Just the Facts -:- The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 13:54:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ Han -:- The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:52:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Pauline Premie -:- The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:38:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Han -:- The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 23:19:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Dr. Crane -:- The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 05:53:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Han -:- The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:41:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Niles -:- The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji -:- Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:04:45 (GMT)

bonnejovi -:- R there any 'hippies' or ex-'hippies' -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 10:14:55 (GMT)
__ Zelda -:- ...titter -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 05:44:24 (GMT)
__ Love Child -:- Lots. Why? (nt) -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 14:15:45 (GMT)
__ Jethro Tulias -:- R there any 'hippies' or ex-'hippies' -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 10:24:30 (GMT)
__ __ hamzen -:- Haha, you mean are there any non-hippies here, -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:08:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ Selene -:- but ham we ARE non hippies -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:15:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ ham -:- Yes but Bon Jovi was asking about hippie roots, -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:35:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- yeah, with tattoos and bad teeth -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 02:58:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ ham -:- Don't apologize, love your detours (nt) -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 21:52:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- detours good word for it! -:- Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 23:08:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Joe -:- but ham we ARE non hippies -:- Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:32:24 (GMT)


Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:56:40 (GMT)
From: Elan Vital
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Propagation Meeting reminder
Message:
As reported earlier, tonight is the night for the propagation meeting with Raja Ji, Yoram Weiss, Dave Cohen, and Linda Pasciotto at the Marina Beach Marriott Hotel in Marina Del Rey (Los Angeles), 7:30 pm.
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:26:58 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Elan Vital
Subject: Are you strip searched before they let you in?
Message:
This must be about fundraising and Maharaji's plans in the physical world, and how everyone with gratitude can help by contributing cash or credit. I hope someone who still can masquerade as a premie will attend and report back to everyone. Take good notes.
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 02:13:34 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Elan Vital offers DONATIONS opportunity!!
Message:
Hi Joe,

I read an Elan Vital confirmation faxed to a premie I know for the next programe in Toronto, next week, and EV offers there 'an incredible deal' regarding donations; any donation of $100 or more will be matched by other generous contributors!!! Time to donate!! Also, there is said few times -three pages long confirmation sheet: ROFL!!-that there is not enough money to pay for the costs of the event, that contributions are welcome...He's SO POOR...MAHARAJI IS A GREEDY BASTARD!!

Also, for the ones wanting to go seE Lardman, to get the pass at the event you must show your confirmation fax received. The circle is closing: What's next? Underground...

sb

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:09:03 (GMT)
From: me
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Are you strip searched before they let you in?
Message:
What do you want to know?
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 23:12:16 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: me
Subject: What I want to know...
Message:
M is so secretive about everything, and things are so withheld from aspirants and the public, I'd like to know:

What he is raising money for, THIS TIME,
How they are describing 'propogation' in the west, how it is supposed to be done, how M and K are to be presented, and how they explain why so few people want to get involved.
Wonder if they mention what the ex-premies are saying, that aspirants have become disillusioned because they are reading on the Internet things they aren't told about by the instructors or M, and general stuff like that.

I'm just curious as to how it's all presented and packaged now. It all seems so contradictory and disjointed.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 18:46:54 (GMT)
From: Gregg
Email: binduesque@yahoo.com
To: Everyone
Subject: Am I In a Cult, redux
Message:
I appreciate all the responses y'all posted in the Am I in a Cult thread below, about my involvement with a small Tantric group in New Mexico. The posts far outstripped what I expected in terms of insight and thoughtfulness.

My primary reason for starting the thread was to use my story as a stimulus for some rethinking about what a 'cult' really was, and I hope there were a few aspirants and agya-defying premies lurking, because there were some illuminating points made.

Of course, if I believed I was in a destructive cult, I would leave, so obviously my answer to the question was 'No, I'm not in a cult.' But, although I state in my Journeys entry that DLM involvement innoculated me against further cult involvement, I also know that I am capable of self-deception; my involvement with DLM proves as much, and it also proves that I'm the type to join a cult. So I'll keep your caveats in mind as my spiritual practice continues.

Thanks.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 23:06:05 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Gregg
Subject: Am I In a Cult, redux
Message:
Have you ever noticed that when someone asks for advice here we all get right on it, like ticks on a dog? (Me the queen advice-giver too) HA HA. Glad it helped....

I personally think you should blah blah blah because clearly you have tendencies to blah blah blah and everyone knows that blah blah blah therefore RIGHT NOW I suggest that you shave your head, get a doctorate and start breeding canteloupe because everyone knows blah blah blah blah blah

ANyway. Seriously it is good that you know your own tendencies. I definitely am still on the gullible side myself also. So I am careful too. But I am still a sucker now and then.Anyway discussions here have had an innoculating effect in a good way, on that tendency towards 'magical thinking' which seems to be part of our generation and is not always a bad thing.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:03:07 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Gregg
Subject: NM
Message:
New Mexico,eh?
I have some artwork in a gallery there.
Just in Ojo Caliente - not Sante Fe or anything.
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 02:47:37 (GMT)
From: Monmot
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: NM
Message:
Where's Ojo Caliente (great name)? I'm off to Sante Fe tomorrow, and perhaps I can take a cruise to Ojo if my friend's game. What's the name of the gallery? and the name of your artwork? (If you don't mind my asking.)
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 14:59:00 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Monmot
Subject: NM
Message:
Ojo Caliente Fine Arts - it's in an old Convent on your way to the Hot Springs off Rt 285. Wish I could give you my free passes to a day at the spa. Any religious work you see ---that would be mine. :) If I was more ambitious -I'd have my work in some smaller galleries around that whole area....I think I may have talked myself into a little trip/vacation.
You can go anywhere with a good air-conditioner,you know.
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:53:54 (GMT)
From: Monmot
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: NM--Thanks, Sounds Great nt
Message:
bb
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:12:18 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: NM
Message:
Dear Elaine,
Anything on the net we could see?
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 14:39:23 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: NM
Message:
No not now - wanted to put some things on E-bay - took the digital pictures and all - but, actually have sold too much locally to be bothered.
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:03:29 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: NM
Message:
Dear Elaine,
I'd love to see some pics of your stuff. If you have the digitals. I'll show you mine if you show me yours. :) Mine are jewelry.
If you don't want to, no problem but if you do, my email:
sundogs@hotmail.com
Glad you are doing well locally though.
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:14:27 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: NM
Message:
Robyn- I'm not real computer savvy - I'd have to get help & ask a friend that knows how to send stuff. Next time I go to his place - will be awhile,tho. I'll take your address along with me.
He took the pics,originally.
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:39:56 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: NM
Message:
Dear Elaine,
Thanks! :) Then when I get your email I'll reply and send you the pics of my jewelry. No rush but I'll be looking forward to it.
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:44:36 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Gregg
Subject: New Mexico does that to you
Message:
It beats the arizona new age thing.
I love New Mexico. The New Age thing doesn't feel so 'new age'
there. as here.
less phony. just an editorial opinion. Tantric? oh oh.
I didn't read the other thread. I'd better stop now :)
I do know what you mean about never quite trusting your trusting side again.
but that has it's compensations. life works that way.

just call me 'Miss Bleach Blonde Party Girl Forum 5 2000'
with nothing whatsoever of value to say. killing time til
I go try to break through the lines at the abortion clinic to help out a friend.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:29:25 (GMT)
From: john D
Email: johndriscoll144@hotmail
To: Everyone
Subject: Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family
Message:
Dear friends good to hear you express you disillusionment, albeit 20-30 yrs too late--well Joan Apter, you won't be the first on this bandwagon--we, the few followers of Shri Satpal Maharaj, understood from the time we knew he was in a drunken state at the astrodome, that he was not up to snuff. Unfortunately, truth took a back seat, with the full unenlightened participation of you!!---Putting aside the satirical references towards the Hans Family(yes, we will have to wear the black spot of Balyogeshwar for a long time), I wish to give you correct info from our side: Maharaj Ji(Satyapal)through hard work and excellent display of character, has built /opened more tham 1000 ashrams in India and 3 in the west. With his resources he was elected to Parliament and was appointed minister of railways which he computerized, and, as State Minister of finance recieved accollades for his work--yes, in elections you have to get all types to get out and vote for you! The last 2 were lost; you could say it is the BJP's time.Just for the record,beginning his term he accepted no salary and took his oath in Sanskrit. He has 2 sons; both of excellent behavior and consideration. He continues his work throughout India, NSEW, is well-known and respected . and, yes, we can draw a crowd of up to 100K--the festivals are split up to accomodatethe districts' demands.Objectively, these are now very'indian' oriented, in Hindi. Shri Bhole Ji has been married since 1974, and aside from his ministerial duties, he is involved in the India music industry.The reference to him driving/owning taxis simply ain't true, although when we first moved to NYC from LA(anybody know why?) the newly incorporated ashram bought a NYCtaxi medallion--bought36K-sold59K. Yes, you've missed a lot, including true satsang from great souls who won't be around anymore. I cannot say what everyone's existence will turn out to be as the workings of karma aren't all known, but I wish you all the best in working it out. But please remember it is up to you to find knowledge though other souls, no matterwhat it may be, and to walk away from it if you must,if you don't agree.----One more thing for the record,the Hans family are Hindus, not Sikhs. the middle name, Singh, is of Rajput origin. And one more thing, do stop by Prem Nagar when you pass thru Haridwar.For more than 10 yrsDLM followers have come by still thinking it was in ______'s posession!They were so brainwashed!!!So before you criticize everything about everything: If you were there in 74-76, remember you ate it up like the sheep you is!!!!! The Best Always, John D
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 18:31:42 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: john D
Subject: Vedpraktanand
Message:
In late 1974 a certain Mahatma by the name of Vesprktanand was sent back to India for abusing his position(i.e. the fondling of breasts during k sessions). He susequently joined with Mata Ji and Satpal.
Can you inform us how this person was disciplined, as I would hope that neither Mata Ji or Satpal would condone such behaviour?
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 12:06:23 (GMT)
From: john d
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Vedpraktanand
Message:
persons are forgiven if they admit thier faults in the ashram unless it might be heinous..VPanand was seen as overly-intellectual due to his extensive training in sanskrit and went off on his own to teach either as a sadhu or in a university
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 17:44:20 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: john d
Subject: Is Mahatma Adharanand still around?
Message:
Boy, was he a comic! (famed for his backwards-guitar playing).

Ahh... the memories.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 14:31:00 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: john D
Subject: Question
Message:
Thanks for the Satpal update, John. I am curious: do Satpal's (post-1974) followers know that their Master used to bow down at the lotus feet of his younger brother - or is it brushed under the carpet?

If not, don't you think they should be told?

And what about you? - how would you explain this curious change in Satpal's status?

Did he first become the Lord in the mid-seventies?
Was he always the Lord without knowing it?
Did he always know it but felt it part of his own lila to keep quiet about it?
Or did he merely seize the moment of DLM's ruin in the West to usurp the crown for personal glory and perpetuate the family business elsewhere?

I hope you will agree there are no other possible explanations. (I favour the latter interpretation.)

Final question: do you think that Satpal's own foundation (whatever name it goes by) might still own the copyright on some of the early pictures of Prem which are the subject of legal threats to ISP's from his lawyers?

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 12:49:17 (GMT)
From: JOHN D
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: RE:TO QUESTION
Message:
HELLO NAGEL; MY 2ND NOTE(IM IN INDIA THERE ARE NET PROBLEMS EVEN AT THE ISDN PLACES) HAVING TYPED SEVERAL REPLIES I'M NOT AS FRESH AS BEFORE.('BOWING TOPIC--SEE PREVIOUS LETTER- '-BLACK SPOT') sHRI SATPAL MAHARAJ SINCE HIS BIRTH WAS REGARDED AS AN INCARNATION BY HI FATHER/GURU. PREM PAL WAS REGARDED AS SANT TUKARAM.ORIGINALLY EMPHASIS WAS PLACED ON THE ENTIRE HOLY FAMILY, AND THRU THE WILES OF SAMPURNANAND AND OTHERS THE REST WAS HISTORY(SATPAL MAHARAJ EXPRESSED NO OBJECTION AT THE TIME, AS HE HAD TO FINISH SCHOOL).GUESS YOU HAD TO BE THERE, AS IT DOES GET COMPLICATED AND THEY WERE STILL GRIEVING OVER THIER RECENT LOSS. IN SHORT,THERE WAS NO INTENTION AT THE TIME TO EMPHASIZE ANY ONE FAMILY MEMBER SO, IN SHORT, IF (WE) HAD NO OBJECTION TO THE VENERATION OF SANT JI, THEREFORE WHY SHOULD HE (SANT JI) HAVE BECOME JEALOUS OVER EMPHASIS ON OTHER FAMILY MEMBERS?--YES IT GETS WEIRD--(SEE BLACK SPOT--OPENING LETTER) MORE IMPORTANTLY, WE SPOKE THE TRUTH AT THE TIME BUT THANKS TO BOB MISHLER'S PROPOGANDA MACHINE, ESPECIALLY IN THE UK, THE DOORS WERE SHUT TO THE TRUTH. BUT AT THAT TIME WE GAVE ALL OF YOU WARNINGS OVER THE MEDIA; IT WAS A HOT TOPIC AT THE TIME,'SMATTAFACT, IT WAS THE LAST TIME THE MEDIA PAID ATTENTION TO THE BOY WONDER.. SO WHERE WERE YOU? JUST FOR THE RECORD HIS DISPOSAL REUNIFIED THE MAHATMAS(SANYASIS) WHOM HE WAS READY TO THROW OUT IF THEY COULD NOT CONFORM TO HIS AGYA MACHINE OF UNRIGHTEOUSNESS. i MUST SAY sHRI SATPAL MAHARAJ WAS REGARDED IN A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE AT ALL TIMES, BUT THIS EMPHASIS WAS DISREGARDED, IN THE WEST DUE TO THE MACHINE WHICH WAS OUT OF CONTROL. NOBODY THOUGHT IT OUT ON THIER OWN!!!! WHAT THEY ARE LEFT WITH IS A SAD WASTE OF GOOD MONEY. aS I MAY HAVE SAID EARLIER IT WOULD BE HARD TO CONVINCE A JADED AUDIENCE WHO ARE DEFINITELY ENTITLED TO THIER BITTERNESS. BELIEVE IT OR NOT THERE ARE POSSIBIITIES TO REACH THE TRANSCENDENTAL, AND LIKE MOST OTHER ITEMS IN OUR LIFE THEY HAVE TO BE CONSIDERED AND SCRUTINIZED..AND A TRUE GURU IS AN IMPORTANT CHOICE..MORE IMPORTANTLY, ONE OF THOSE PERSONS WHO PREACHES RIGHTEOUSNESS AN PRACTICES THE WAY OF THE UN-TRANSCENDENTAL SHOULD BE DISMISSED--BOY WONDER--READ THIS; DRINK MORE!!!!NAGEL DONT BLAME US--WE WERE THR FIRST TO POINTOUT HIS SHORTCOMINGS WHEN HE FINALLY WENT OUTOF CONTROL. ANOTHER THING --WE'RE NOT REALLY LOOKING FOR CONVERTS IN THE WEST AS WE ARE TOO BUSY IN INDIA WITH NUMEROUS BUT WELL MANAGED WORKS, WHICH INCLUDE RELIEF PROJECTS.---YOUR QUESTION ABOUT THE PHOTOS--MOST OF THE WORKS OF MR OM PRAKASH(GENIUS PHOTOGRAPHER) ARE STILL IN HIS POSSESSION, ALTHOUGH 1/3 OF THEM WERE TAKEN BY THE MISSION AND NOT RETURNED(73)HIS HABIT WAS TO TAKE 3 SHOTS OF EACH POSE HE IS NOW RETIRED AND HARD TO FIND BEST REGARDS, JOHN D
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 05:25:49 (GMT)
From: Loaf
Email: Loafji@yahoo.com
To: john D
Subject: Perhaps you know what a brayner is ?
Message:
Some time ago a Mr C.L. Tondon emailed me from India at Satpal's request.

He said in that email :

'He is the word made flesh. He is brayner to you. Infact he is your very spirit'.

What is a brayner ? If it means (for example)'someone who will make a fool out of you' then I need to know !

Blessings from my house.

Loaf of Life

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 13:16:37 (GMT)
From: JOHND
Email: None
To: Loaf
Subject: SORRY DUNNO WHAT IS THE BRAYNOR AND I KNOW A LOT
Message:
HEY LOAF, I WOULD HAVE TO SEE THE LETTER, BUT MR TANDEN USUALLY WRITES VERY INTELLIGENTLY--VOT CAN I SHAY?
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:35:24 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Loaf
Subject: Perhaps you know what a brayner is ?ROFL
Message:
That 'subject sentence' was probably the funniest I've ever read,Loaf.ROFL
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 03:26:19 (GMT)
From: (Sir) David
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: john D
Subject: But he's God's brother
Message:
I have a web page dedicated to all current incarnations of God and your Satpal is on it.

Click here to see God in his different manifestations

Take your pick. Which incarnation of God do you prefer. I think Bubba Free John is a no go for a start. I'll go for Mataji since she exudes kundalini vibrations as proven in the photograph of her.

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:22:53 (GMT)
From: JOHN D
Email: None
To: (Sir) David
Subject: NOTEWORTHY REPLY
Message:
hELLO SIR!
I DONT RECALL SEEING YOU IN HARIDWAR AT THE TIME; I WAS THERE; TOOKS LOTS OF PHOTOS OF THE KUMBH SORT OF CHECKED YOUR SITE; CAN'T BRING MYSELF TO LOOK AT BUBBA!AND YOU AND I BOTH KNOW THAT WEREN'T NO SHAKTI; JUST LIGHTS.AGAIN IT WILL BE HARD TO MOVE YOUR SET VIEWS, HOWEVER THIS'VENERATION THING' IS WIDELY ACCEPTED IN INDIA--IT WON'T NECESSARILY STOP YOU FROM GETTING ELECTED!!! AND IT IS SAID 'WITH CHEATS, GOD IS A CHEAT' AND AT EVERYTIME IN HISTORY THERE HAVE BEEN TRUE AND FALSE GURUS. AT THE TIME OF CHRIST THERE WERE ENOUGH TO INCREASE HIS PROBLEMS-YES? MANY DECRIED RAMAKRISHNA PARAMHANS, WHO WAS LOVEABLE BUT VERY PECULIAR. BUT IF YIU TRULY BELIEVE IN THE HIGHER SPIRIT AND SUPERCONCIOUSNESS, WHAT WILL YOU SEEK? OR WILL YOU JUST THINK ABOUT IT FROM TIME TO TIME? FOR THE RECORD TIBETAN LAMAS ARE BY FAR THE WORST, WITH INFRACTIONS ADDING UP ALL THE TIME ANYONE REMEMBER MAKHTANANDA? HE LIKED 'EM YOUNG. AFTER THE SQUABBLE WHICH FOLLOWED HIS GOOD RIDDANCE, HIS PEOPLE GOT A NEW GURU WITHOUT A THOUGHT TO ALL THE ROT! I CAN TELL SHRI SATPAL MAHARAJ IS VERY KIND(PERSONAL LEVEL) AND EVEN FUN TO TRAVEL WITH. AND,IF YOU GET THE TIME HAS AMAZING ANSWERS TO NEARLY EVERYTHING.MOST IMPORTANTLY, HE HAS THE PROPER CONDUCT NECESSARY FOR HIS POSITION, AND WOULD NOT HAVE KEPT HIS SUCCESS AS HE HAS ALWAYS STRONG IN ITS ADVOCATION(BEEN ANSWERING E-MAILS FOR AWHILE; RUNNIN OUT OF BIG WORDS). IT'S BEEN AN AMAZING JOURNEY FOR ME PLEASE GO OVER MY OTHER REPLIES FOR MORE CONTENT. AT THIS TIME YOU WOULD WANT PROOF'OF AN INCARNATION'. BUT FOR THE MEANTIME HIS ACTIONS SPEAK AND HIS ENERGY LEVEL IS AMAZING.TO QUOTE RAJIV GHANDI--'LISTEN TO MAHARAJji!! THE SITUATION IN INDIA WILL GET WORSE; YOU MAY YET SEE A SURPRISING EMERGENCE--GOOD TIME FOR AN INCARNATION!!! BEST REGARDS, jOHN D
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:48:10 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: (Sir) David
Subject: Oh brother, he's god?
Message:
Here's a link to a story about one of the incarnations, Sai Baba.

(Warning: this is a graphic description of sexual abuse.)

I'm at a loss as to title this link...

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:58:03 (GMT)
From: JOHN D
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: OOH, THAT'S A TOPPER!
Message:
GERRY, TO QUOTE AL PACINO(SCARFACE)'I NEVER LIKED HIM' NO, SAI BABA AIN'T MY CUP OF TEA, BUT YOUR STORY DOESN'T MENTION HIM USING VIRGIN'S BLOOD(YOU CAN FIND THEM IN INDIA) IN RITUALS.MUKTANANDA WAS UNSTOPPABLE!! HARDLY DIFFERENT FROM THE PRIESTS IN HARIDWAR WHO VISIT JWALAPUR TO ENJOY MEAT&BOOZE.
HOPE I REACHED EVERYONE TODAY.GOTTA GO--JOHN D
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:48:51 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: That is sum ugly stuff... nt
Message:
om
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:32:30 (GMT)
From: Powerman
Email: None
To: john D
Subject: Barf bag please...
Message:
What is this garbage? Maharaj Ji(Satyapal)through hard work and excellent display of character... and He has 2 sons; both of excellent behavior and consideration...

Do you really include this crap in your diet? It's the Indian equivalent of 'Winston Tastes Good Like a Cigarette Should'.

Listen pal, if you want to come around here and offer some tasty treats, you better make sure they're cooked properly because if not, you'll be sent packing, right along with your half-baked idiot Satyapal.

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 13:45:23 (GMT)
From: JOHND
Email: None
To: Powerman
Subject: DONT EAT WHAT YOU BARF
Message:
POWERMAN, PLEASE REMEMBER NOT EVERYONE THINKS SAME AS YOU OR CARES TO. YOU DONT SAY WHO YOU ARE OR HOW YOU GOT BURNED, BUT IM SENDINGY OU SOME USEFULL INFO. YOU MUST BE THE PERSON WHO DELETES THE UNSAVORIES. AS FOR YOUR CORRECTION ON MY EXPRESSION I OBVIOUSLY TOLD YOU ALL YOU NEED TO KNOW; FAMILIES ARE PRIVATE. SOUND LIKE A CONTRDICTION?--WELL THE WHOLE WORLD IS FULL OF IT, CRAMMED INTO EVERY COMPARTMENT. SO YOU DONT NEED A GURU- NOW YOU HAVE A SUPPORT GROUP----! MAY I SUGGEST INTEGRAL YOGA SOCIETY?--NICE FOLKS-- AGAIN I HAVE NO TO CARE FOR THE WHEREABOUTS OF OLD MISSION EXECS OR SO- CALLED MAHATMAS AGAIN YOU ARE ON A TOPIC NOT KNOWN TO YOU. I HOPE YOU SPEND NO MORE THAN 10 MINS DAILY ON THIS PROJECT; GRADUALLY WEAN YOURSELF ---jOHN D
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 19:42:21 (GMT)
From: Powerman
Email: None
To: JOHND
Subject: What a stupid person you are, JohnD (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 13:10:32 (GMT)
From: john d
Email: None
To: Powerman
Subject: Look up some Howard Stern sites; have some fun!!!
Message:
Baba Booey!!Baba Booey!!!
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:13:33 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: JOHND
Subject: To John D.
Message:
Thanks for Intregal Yoga suggestion and love Vivekananda - will read him again.
Do you know of any quotes in particular where he speaks of the necessity of a guru?? Thank you.

BTW, what nationality are you? Just curious.

Elaine

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:45:24 (GMT)
From: JOHN D
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: YOU SEEM NICE AFTER ALL
Message:
HELLO ELAINE --VIVEKANANDA HAD A GURU--THAT REALLY SAYS AT ALL BUT HE DID SAY,,WHEN THE DISCIPLE IS READY THE GURU WILL APPEAR,AND LISTED QUALIFICATIONS
gURU NANAK SAID: MAKE NO MISTAKE THERE IS NO SALVATION WITHOUT A GURU'. FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE RADHA SAOMIS HE MADE IT EXPLICILY CLEAR THERE WOULD BE ONLY 10(TEN) SATGURUS IN THIER LINE..ANY MORE GOOD NEWS?
i AM FROM NYNY, AND HAVE SPENT THIS YEAR IN INDIA. I AM EVEN NOTORIUS IN SOME CIRCLES--I PASSED OUT FLYERS FOR MAHATMA SATYANAND DURING THE SPLIT(BY MAIL) IN'75 RUMORED JAGDEO(HAVEN'T USED THAT FOOL'S NAME FOR YEARS)RECIEVED SEVERAL OF THEM IN EVERY CITY HE VISITED, IN BOTH LANGUAGES. HERE IN INDIA, THE PROGRAMS ARE MORE HINDI- ORIENTED, AND OUR GURU COULD BE BUSY EVRYDAY OF THE YEAR , IF IT WERE POSSIBLE, IN INDIA OR NEPAL.WE ALL WENT THRU MANY YEARS OF HARD WORK AND LITTLE MONEY. NOW THERE IS MUCH TO SHOW FOR IN INDIA--TO DO THIS WORK IN THE WEST YOU HAVE TO CONFORM TO THE COMMERCIAL NORMS AND/OR DO LOTS OF DAMAGE CONTROL!!TAKE A BREAK FROM THE UK AND COME TO INDIA; YOU CAN E-MAIL HERE TOO--SORT OF--lATER, JOHN D
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 15:17:54 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: JOHN D
Subject: Thanks for the responses
Message:
John D,

Thank you for responding to all the posts. I really thought you might be some kind of imposter.

If you do not want to correspond with us much more, I would understand. But if you do, I think that mutual respect would be in order, despite our great differences.

If you would like to know more about myself and the other ex-premies that have posted to you, many of us have posted our stories on the 'journeys' section of this website. Most of us tell much of our history with Maharaji. So it would be helpful to know more about your history, as well. For istance, I am not British, but American. And you? Are you a Westerner, and how did you first get involved? Where are the three Western ashrams located? You are aware of the very large following Prem Pal Rawat still has in India, are you not? And you know of his compound near Delhi, do you not?

There are several issues that we could discuss more fully as time permits: how the four techniques have evolved with Prem Pal and how they are possibly very different from the techniques you now practice under Satpal. The supposed Master lineage from Sri Swarupanand to Shri Hans (or did it go to Varaganand). The history of the Radhasoami guru line. Shri Hans' first wife and daughter. The pedophilia of Jagdeo. The experiences that you have as a devotee of Satpal, why you kiss his feet and consider him a divine master, or do you? You might also be in a better position, since you are in India, to keep us informed about the downfall of Sai Baba because of the sex offenses - does he still have a hugh following? And many more such issues...

We are of couse united in our objections against Prem Pal Rawat's cult in the West. But we remain opposed in regard to the validity of Satpal as guru, and in regard to the value of following any guru for the sake of personal fulfillment and self-realization, which is the personal responsibility of every human individual. The flow of God's grace does not deflect itself though a third party, but goes directly to each person. Another topic, eh?

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 12:25:44 (GMT)
From: John d
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Thanks for the responses
Message:
Greetings, way volume of questions ther, many tied with senstive traditions that have no comfortable meeting point. I can only tell you sure if one had the persistence, he could attain the highest jnana -yoga under Shri Satpal Maharaj. Read Swami Vivekananda's book on the topic and we will surpass it!!! There are some fine teachers in India, but recently even the Shankaracharya threw dust in the face of religion with his participation in reconversions. Sorry can't go with the cult- chasing thing though Ithink my contempt has been expressed clearly enough..By the way I'm sure you have a multifaceted life!!..Time will tell,,reply to: volume later.. JJohn D
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 15:35:21 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Good one again, Way -interesting guy,eh? nt
Message:
om
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 15:02:46 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: JOHN D
Subject: YOU SEEM NICE AFTER ALL
Message:
Yes, 'Nice' is my middle name.

Forgot about Guru Nanak and Kabir.

Yes, to need a Guru or not.
That is a question this site has made me aware of. I have never really empowered Maharaji like others have. But, I must admit - when I have gone into 'unchartered' territories in meditation - that would normally have scared me to death ---- all sorts of things like leaving my body and soaring out into the universe faster and faster and --- well, I digress again -----what kept me from stopping the experience and continuing boldly where I had never been before ----was the presence /'feeling' that I was able to 'hang onto his hand' ----I knew nothing could harm me and that my fear was illusion - bec I could feel his 'protection'.

Now, others here will probably want to give me feedback on this - and that's ok. But, the protection of the master felt needed. Could I have just asked Jesus?
That was an option I didn't explore at the time.

Regards,
Elaine

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 12:38:17 (GMT)
From: john D
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: who to ask?
Message:
Elaine is there a goddess of karma?Many poor souls in india found freedom from caste & oppressionby joining up with christianity or islam. It isn't forced(see Vivekananda--'inspired talks) whereas there is still much resentment overmedicines for conversions.Jesus rates very high among hindus politically and otherwise. remember previous to Buddha, history is murky..not so many soul-stabbin questions today!!!! John D
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 18:10:29 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: john D
Subject: Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family
Message:
Thanks for the information.

How many follows does Sat Pal have in the west, and does he ever speak of his younger brother, who also claims to be the Perfect Master, or at least did?

Did you leave Maharaji after the Millennium Festival at the Astrodome? (Sophia Collier in her book also recounts about how Maharaji was smashed on alcohol in between speaking engagements at that Festival.) Or did you leave when Mahararji married Marilyn Johnson and he had the break with his Mother and Bal Bahgwan Ji?

Another question: Does Sat Pal ever discuss how he used to claim to be a devotee of his brother, and some of the stuff he said at the Millennium Festival, about aliens attending, about the Pope receiving knowledge, about M's dog becomming a vegetarian through a miracle and other such ridiculous stuff? Does he write it off as the stupidity of youth?

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 10:33:16 (GMT)
From: John D.
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family
Message:
Joe, greetings. first of all keep in mind that many re marks made in jest can come back in strange ways. 1) I left in 74 after going to India against so- called 'sacred agya' to find out what happened, where much to my surprise, I was well recieved by Shri Mata Ji and Maharaj ji..Shri Bhole Ji was fending off harrassment from the dlm security faction in LA. Since I had become quite at home with the philosophy and the meditation , I thought I ought to know more. I found out that Bob Mishler had launched a misinformation campaign Himmler would have been proud of (. Bob, All the actions in your life were self- serving!)I also had the priveledge to work with Mahatma Satyanand, gaining many of the more fine-tuned points of our essential(Satyanand was a Jivan Mukti; strain your brain and look it up) philosophy,and was allowed to see up close how hard everyone worked to undo the damage. Today we are influential in relief work across India and in the Garwahl State(Himalayas), and have many Productive Ashrams across the country. It wasn't so easy for a long time , raising money by legitamate means! But now money and facilities for most projects is available.I can't help but think, why did everyone believe the misinformation trail so easily back then ... I don't see the point in dwelling on it; haven't thought aboutthe other 2 for a long time.If you'll never have another 'spiritual leader'again please get on with your life and understand it any way you can. To keep that repugnant face in your mind that some people will actually fly somewhere to see makes no sense; like fawning over an ugly girl!! If you're in India, do come by Prem Nagar and portray yourself honestly as we will for you. best regards, J.D.
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:49:40 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: john D
Subject: Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family
Message:
John D,

Are you for real?

I've read Satpal's website and have seen no mention of that number of ashrams or attendees at programs. Amazing, if true! Where are the three Western ashrams?

Please supply more info about yourself if you wish to continue a dialogue here. And thanks for the news about Bhole Ji, he's been a complete mystery.

Any inside info on Prem Pal is most appreciated. Why wouldn't you even mention his name in your post? Does your master forbid it?!?

Also of interest is your understanding why Prem was chosen over Satpal in the first place.

And how do you like our nickname for your Lord - Bubblegumji?

Do you pranam?

Tell me this is a joke!

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 11:35:16 (GMT)
From: JohnD
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family
Message:
Hello wAY,(TYPO ERRORS; i'M IN iNDIA)!(1) i DON'T KNOW MUCH ABOUT YOU EITHER, BUT i WILL TRY TO ANSWER SOME OF YOUR QUESTIONS IN PROPER PERSPECTIVE.(2) YES i DO pRANAM; OUR gURU IS WORTHY!! i ASSUME YOU ARE IN THE u.K.WHERE TO SAY THE LEAST, TRUE FACTS HAVE BEEN CONSTRICTED ON THIS TOPIC. sOME OF THE 'SUCCESSION OF.. i ANSWERED TO jOE AND i'M NOT SURE MY REPLY TO NAGEL WENT OVER THE NET.(2)yES THE NAME MAHARAJ HAS BEEN DRAGGED DOWN BY BAYOGESWAR.. IT IS A TITLE, TO BE SUPPORTED BY TRUE ACTIONS AND CAPABILITIES.THE ONLY THING YOU CAN FIND AT FAULT WITH SHRI SATPAL MAHARAJ IS THAT HE ONE TIME ALLOWED THE BOY WONDER TO BE GURU!!!HIS ACTIONS AND CAPABILITIES SPEAK WELL FOR HIM, AND YOU DON'T SEE OUR WORK IN INDIA. THE FAULT PLACED BY THE UPPER CRUSTIES OF HINDU SOCIETY(POWERFUL PRIESTS) IS THAT THERE ARE TOO MANY LOWER- CASTES AT OUR FESTIVALS.tHIS IS WHY I AM RELUCTANT TO MENTION THE NAME OF A PERSON WHO HAS BROUGHT THE NAME'DHARMA' TO A NEW LOW. AGAIN , YOU COULD AT LEAST HALF-TONE THAT PIC AT THE TOP RIGHT!!! i ACKNOWLEDGE THAT IT WOULD BE VERY HARD TO CONVINCE ANYONE AT YOUR WEB SITE THE ITEMS I'VE MENTIONED ARE NOTEWORTHY, AS YOU HAVE BEEN TURNED OFF TO ALL THE POSSIBILITIES..sHRI HANS JI MAHARAJ WAS VERY CONSERVATIVE BY NATURE AND INTOLERANT OF EVEN SMALL ENFRACTIONS i DON' THINK GOING OUT INTO THE MARKET TO EAT NICE ROASTED MEAT WITH bEHAR sINGH WOULD HAVE BEEN ALLOWED!!!i MUST TELL YOU WE HAVE STANDARDS THE HIGHEST ANYWHERE..TOO MUCH FOR ME, MATTERAFACT.. FOR THOSE WHO WISH TO EVOLVE IN THIS WORLD WITHOUT THE HELP OF A GURU PLEASE READ THE BOOKS/ESSAYS OF VIVEKANANDA; WHO KNOWS; MAYBE YOU'LL BE BACK!! (3) iHAVE BEEN WITH THE HOLY FAMILY SINCE THE 70'S AND HAVE TOURED THE US AND INDIA FREQUENTLY WITH THEM. WHICH YEARS DID YOU BOTHER WITHpp? IF IT WAS AFTER 74--YES YOU CERTAINLY WASTED YOUR TIME!!! BUT FOR YOU TO BE PROPERLY CONVINCED YOU'LL HAVE TO COME ON OUR TURF. AND TO THE FELLOW WHO SNEAKED A RECORDER TO THE PROGRAM IN THE U.K.--RECORDERS ARE ALLOWED!!!!BALYOGESHWAR IS MERELY JOKED ABOUT EVERYWHERE--AT LEAST IN THE USA OR INDIA--THE BITTERNESS OF THE QUESTIONS I AM FIELDING HERE WOULD HAVE BEEN BETTER SERVED WITH LESS CYNICISM--CONSIDERING I'M THE ONLY ONE HERE WHO CAN ANSWER THE QUESTIONS FAIRLY. REMEMBER, THERE WAS SOMETHING REAL IN THE PHILOSOPHY THAT DREW YOU THERE--NO JOKE--BEST REGARDS, JOHN D
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:53:27 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family
Message:
My bet is we won't hear fr John D. again
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 11:56:52 (GMT)
From: JOHN D
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family
Message:
yES ELAINE I'M STILL HERE, BUT YOU DIDN'T GIMME NO MEAT TO CHEW ON! HOWEVER I PROBABLY WON'T DWELL ON THIS SITE. I HAVE OTHER STUFF TO DO, BUT I FEEL YOU SITE IS JUSTIFIED(TYPO PROBLEMS; TYPING IN CAPS) I THINK YOU ARE SENDING FROM THE UK,,WHERE THERE DAMN WELL OUGHT TO BE BACKLASH. AGAIN HE IS A JOKE HERE(INDIA-USA),BUT FOR HIS FOREIGN MONEY. AND WE BEHIND THE ORGANIZATION(MANAV UTTHAN SEVA SAMITI)HARDLY GIVE HIM A THOUGHT(READ:LOOK BACK PISSED) EVEN THE OLD LAWSUITS WHICH WENT ON FOR A LONG TIME ARE SETTLED. DID YOU KNOW HIS ELDER BROTHER WAS INSTRUMENTAL IN PREVENTING MORE LEGAL COMPLICATIONS FOR HIM HERE? THERE'S A LONG LIST. I COULD GIVE YOU MANY EXAMPLES ABOUT THE FINE CHARACTERISTICS OF MAHARAJ JI(SATPAL), BUT, BELIEVE ME I KNOW WHY YOU ARE CONSIGNED TO BITTERNESS. IN THE WORDS OF SHRI MATA JI, 'I DON'T EAT WHAT I'VE SPIT OUT!!! I WILL REPLY TO SOME MORE MESSAGES, BUT ANYONE,PLEASE STATE WHICH YRS YOU WERE WITH THE MISSION BEST REGARDS, jOHN D
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 13:30:26 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: JOHN D
Subject: Re:Shri Satyapal Maharaj and Family
Message:
PS - I'm not bitter - never was never will be. And not all here are. Each person has their individual issues.

Saw Satyapal in a Hotel rm in NYC in 77 or '78. Back then that was a no-no. Even then I was a rebel. Joe Lopez was there.It was interesting. Nothing to report tho.
Rec K - '73.

Why 'give you meat to chew on?' - go in peace, Bro.

Elaine

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 13:35:11 (GMT)
From: John D
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: How's Lindsey?
Message:
Elaine you may have seen him in the Ansonia(ashram)in 76 Joe left the next year; sorry, the double entendre won't work..ahh..Joe and his WPC..Joe you are a silly goose..always had to have his own followers..yes leave us if you must but why go back there?(mission?--for the perks) Joe was gone soon after our move to L.I.--he wasn't being let in on all the secrets There's a rumor he planted advanced electronic devices(for the time, anyway they had transistors back then) into the brains of his lieutenants!!!!! and Sir David leave the slit the throat guy alone! he must be trying to get on with his life!!!!See you, Gail! John D
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 14:57:11 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: John D
Subject: How's Lindsey?
Message:
JohnD,
I'm afraid you're posts are becoming a mystery to me.
I'm a very simple person - riddles waste my time.

Bye,
Elaine

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:56:43 (GMT)
From: Coach
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Gota Be A Joke
Message:
W,

Bhole Ji was mentally sub-normal. Would never have bin a minister.

Betchya,

Coach

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 15:03:36 (GMT)
From: JOHN D
Email: None
To: Coach
Subject: WHAT ELSE DO YOU READ?
Message:
THOSE WHO CAN'T DO, TEACH.THOSE WHO CAN'T TEACH, TEACH GYM CLASS
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 18:28:34 (GMT)
From: Coach
Email: None
To: JOHN D
Subject: An' you follow an idiot
Message:
No matter what cryptic and stupid remarks you post it still doesn't negate the fact that Bhole ji was a fool and incapable of holding any job down let alone that of a minister of state.

In short, you're lyin' through your teeth.

Also he was a crap musician. Crap as in C..R..A..P.

.

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 16:04:59 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: JOHN D
Subject: YOU SHOULD READ THE GURU PAPERS, JOHN D
Message:
And you should quit shouting in caps. I don't care how spiritual you are, can't you tell that it's hard to read? Anyway, your story's interesting for sure. But the idea that you can't see through all this family business shit and still find some justification for revering any Rawat, make that any man, is astounding. Who the hell cares what 'good works' your organization's doing? You use that fact, if it is a fact, as a very transparent device to splash some legitimacy on a very bogus enterprise. Yes, it's funny the way you do that. Like a guy running up to a girl and saying 'Hey, honey, I just got a brand new car. Want to go out with me?' [slap!]

Your so-called guru is as much a cheat and liar as fatboy. More than Maharaji himself, he was repsonsible for the Millenium debacle and, if it's possible for a man to sqaunder a lifetime's credibility in a month or two, he did it then. I'm appalled that you could be so willfully blind to the obvious truth about that that you just dismiss it all as something that happened a long time ago. No wonder you're hiding in India. Tell me, are there many spiritual Peter Pans there?

Anyway, if you're online and have some tentative connection to the outside planet where every other day is not necessarily some garish festival for elephant gods, cow gods, monkey gods and little boy blue gods, you should track down the book and read it. You've been had, John. Never to late to do the right thing, you know? Good luck.

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 12:49:20 (GMT)
From: John D.
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: are they posted here?
Message:
Jim believe it or not many of those words were said by Sishyapal in the Mahabharata!High brow joke there...If you ever work for a charitable organization make sure the numbers are right. sorry about the caps it was the machine...bitter stuff, jim
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Date: Sun, Jun 11, 2000 at 00:48:26 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: John D.
Subject: What kind of fool are you?
Message:
I'm jsut curious, who're you going to follow when Satpal dies? One of his kids? Are you nuts or something?
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:21:56 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: john D
Subject: I know you're posting all the way from India, but
Message:
I know you're posting all the way from India, but -

DO YOU HAVE TO SHOUT ALL THE TIME?

[wELL NEARLY ALL THE tIME?]

Here's your new mantra, swami:

Toggle, toggle, toggle, tog ... to goolto goolto goolto gool ... toocool toocool toocool togool.... too ghoultoo ghoultoo ghoultoo ...

(Well it's Friday night, innit?)

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 13:00:00 (GMT)
From: john D
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: How could you copy that monster type???
Message:
...I couldn' make it go away...remember, we don't practice mantras,,already apologized for the typo. which is about all you'll ever get!!!! don't drink over the weekend; it is no escape!!! really, I'm a fun guy too---John D
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 14:10:02 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: john D
Subject: Just press the Caps Lock, Einstein. (nt)
Message:
Just press the Caps Lock, Einstein.

Cheers!

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 15:15:10 (GMT)
From: ET
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
I have some questions on the light technique. I tried 'light lite' and all I see is a dim red background. With Knowledge Classic, I occasianally saw swirling patterns of golden light, but mostly just nothing. Is seeing this light what is meant by 'realizing' this Knowledge? Also, how long was one supposed to press the eyes?
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:41:56 (GMT)
From: Person With Knowledge
Email: None
To: ET
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
As any person with knowledge, persons waiting to receive knowledge, and persons wanting to hear more about knowledge know, 'light technique' is correctly called 'Number One' just like the polite term for urination.
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 10:19:45 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Person With Knowledge
Subject: Make water...pee pee...piss
Message:
I would have thought urination was the polite term but I gess make water would be the most vauge if that is the goal.
So what you are saying is that m use to use the more base, nasty term, light technique when I was in the cult and now that he knows better he does better?
Christ! Is that the explination he gave or have you come up with that one on your own.
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:20:56 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: ET
Subject: Meditation 'Techniques'
Message:
Meditation techniques are nothing more than something to focus your attention on, and if you do they can slow down your thinking/brain activity, and the experience of that can be nice. End of story. There is nothing in any sense cosmic, spiritual or anything else about it.

I saw lots of light sometimes when I did the light technique as a premie over the almost 10 years I did meditation twice a day. Big deal. The reason it could be pleasant, and usually it was just amazingly boring, was because concentration and slowing down can give you a feeling of well being -- which some people call love, but it isn't love at all. TM, Buddhist meditation, and various relaxation techniques do the same thing.

I got the very same feeling running after about 5 miles, sometimes biking, often during sex, sometimes rock climbing -- anything that requires concentration on something or makes your mind slow down, and with running it was my breath. Drugs sometimes do it too. Ever have nitrous oxide? Is that love? No, but it might feel like it.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 19:08:24 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Meditation 'Techniques'
Message:
'Meditation techniques are nothing more than something to focus your attention on, and if you do they can slow down your thinking/brain activity, and the experience of that can be nice. End of story.'

Joe you can't mean that any activity that stimulates hormones and other mind expanding drugs, effects everyone the same, surely not?
because what is meditation, if it's not just another activity.

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:05:23 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: What has hormones to do with it?
Message:
No, I said anything that slows down or stops the thinking process can give the same type of experience. But of course, Maharaji sells the big lie that 'meditation' has some kind of spiritual significance, which it doesn't. Many Western kids, like me, attracted by the exotic, 'spiritual' nature of meditation as a spiritual practice, fell for it.
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 09:44:21 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Everything I would have thought
Message:
Joe, not talking about 'spiritual' stuff because I'm pretty clear that it's just a bio-feedback mechanism that involves triggering internal chemikals, gm is a complete irrelevance as we know, but why do you assume the experiences to be had are just peaceful? If anything they were, and still are, dynamic, not passive for me. The peace effect have always been because of the dynamic changes ie aftereffects, and those changes always felt chemikal to me even back in the day
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 14:52:50 (GMT)
From: ET
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Meditation 'Techniques'
Message:
I practice TM. And yes, I have tried nirous oxide. Both lead to other realities - at least in one's perception.

And there is a secret technique for urination ... oh, well.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:48:38 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: ET
Subject: Meditation 'Techniques'
Message:
Dear ET,
'And there is a secret technique for urination ... oh, well.'
Apparently it has been going on for eons but I've only heard about it in the last few months in an email or on AG. It was refered to as 'water sports'. :)
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 16:35:59 (GMT)
From: red butler
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: love vapors
Message:
Well, it was time. He'd put it off long enough, but christ, now it was killing him. 'The son-of-a-bitch better be clean,' he thought, as he pondered which car to drive. Not that it would make any difference. He was still gonna get filthy 'out there.' But this is one trip he'd make by himself. Christ, he couldn't have the troops ('dupes,' as he'd taken to calling them lately) know the lord of the friggin universe has a mouthful of rotten teeth...

'Nice to see you Mr Rawrat,' chirped the hygienist, 'try to relax and the doctor will be right with you.'

The little big man flinched when he heard 'Raw-rat' 'What the fuck??' he thought, 'this bitch been on the internet or somethin?' He fiddled with his tie as the mask approached his face. 'At least I can get good buzz going with the nitrous,' he thought. 'Hey maybe I could grab her boob before I go out and blame it on the drug...or maybe, maybe.... arrrgh...oohhh...ahhhhhh... '

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 05:10:35 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: red butler
Subject: love bites love stings
Message:
it's bringing him to his knees!
oh yes yes yes he is thinking of his best man in the wings

then the dumb stupid bitch has to turn on the oxygen.

'Mr. Rawrat? You did very well today. Not as much bleeding as last time. But really I do wish you would floss.'

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 18:10:04 (GMT)
From: red butler
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: love bites love stings
Message:
Are you implying Our Lord harbors a secret passion for his valet?

Patrick got up from the bed and found a towel. 'Funny how 'service' developed into all this: the mansion, the pool, everything perfect, shiny rich cars all in a row, and pretty girls...and boys.

At first it was just back rubs and things like that. Then the day the boss rolled over and I beheld his golden rod in all it's (rather modest) splendor. I gave him hand jobs for a while and then he began insisting I lick it from his belly so I knew what was 'coming' next.

I don't really have words for my life now. Well, maybe lila. That's the only way I could describe it but I'd never mention it to anyone, anywhere. Ever.'

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 06:52:45 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: red butler
Subject: and dies
Message:
=========
And yet another pretty young girl walks up to him.
Smiles that vacant smile. Moves in a little closer than nececesary for the circumstances. This was a lunch delivery to Rawrat. That is it.

It all gets tiring. He's tried several times to make himself clear. But then he isn't clear. No...... no hope of communicating
in this place. She's just another neighbor come to call.

I wonder, did he see, at any point, from the high point on the hill, where and when the wave finally broke?

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 16:54:29 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: red butler
Subject: love vapors
Message:
Dear Red,
I always think, it is Rhet(sp) Butler, when I see your name. :)
Lovely story but you know it has nothing to do with water sports don't you? I think I was the last adult on the planet to have learned about this and it has nothing to do with sex in the water which I do know about. :)
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:11:17 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: ET
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
Dear ET,
When I started meditating every day, light was just donuts, blue and green to start then violet, yellow, orange. Eventually these colors started to take shape. Symetrical patterns, like ink blots but full of color. The patterns would change, morph. Now sometimes when I am falling asleep it starts on its own. I don't ever touch my eyes at all, if I feel the need to focus, like I am really tired and it is hard to stay awake I press my finger on my 'third eye'. Sometimes now, I also have visions, pictures of flowers in a sunny field, stuff like that. Once even a very pale violet lotus flower, once, tall blue berry bushes blowing in the breeze with the sun shining through them. I don't know if you would call these light but they come on as I am falling asleep the way the colors do.
Interesting how different people's experiences are with this, eh? I think it speaks to the fact that this, all the techniques, tap into something we have the ability to do without m.
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:11:07 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Robyn et al
Subject: Thousand Petaled Lotus Flower....
Message:
Robyn,

I have those same visions also - some instructor fr India said sometimes you will see mountain ranges and on and on - and I do - that's all kinda neat and sweet.It captures my attention for awhile.

The main thing I think I'm getting fr the posts on this site about people's meditation - is that not many people seem to have experienced the 'Knock your socks off' experience - the ' Light of a thousand Suns' experience. Donuts & blue swirls are great for focusing your attention - but that leads to something else.

It's that 'something else' that to me this Kn was all about.

I don't know if anyone here even has seen 'the Thousand Petaled Lotus Flower' !!!
I think people here would think it's just all poetry and talk or something --- and it's NOT.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 21:07:16 (GMT)
From: Mili
Email: mili@cheerful.com
To: Elaine
Subject: Thousand Petaled Lotus Flower....
Message:
I've seen it, Elaine.

It was beautiful - a zillion tiny petals, seemed like they were made out of self-luminous Mother of Pearl. I was zooming into the center, and I was 'gone' after that. :o)

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 00:37:18 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Mili
Subject: Thank you, Big smile.
Message:
om
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 21:02:57 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: more innervisions ...
Message:
Hey, Elaine, have you ever had that weird vision of what I can only describe as a kind of warped checker-board effect? Black and white, but the shapes keep constantly changing?

Do you think these kinds of visions have an external reality - or are they simply side-effects of the brain in a feedback loop (or something)? Could they be a by-product of what happens when awareness observes its own awareness ...?

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:02:23 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: more innervisions ...
Message:
cq,

Yeah,come to think of it they were a very familiar part of my earlier meditations - even the first evening! - but, I think it was bec of pressing my eyeballs. It was very neat,tho - for a first time meditator.

Then at our local metaphysical store a few years ago - there was a contraption - sunglasses hooked up to something with a dial - that you could try and buy-very expensive. It was astounding to me. I put them on and right in front of your eyes - oh -you closed your eyes as I recall - lights flashed on your eyelids from the sunglasses - and it caused you to see such amazing patterns w/ multi-colors!!Checker-boards and more. It was so much like getting lost w/ visions and sights inside while doing the light tech. (My friend w/ migraines couldn't use the machine,BTW.)

I think the purpose was to change your brainwaves - to alpha probably.

These are very fun and captivating - whether w/ a machine or meditating - and I think they do change you to alpha - very neat.

But, even that experience is not the exp I'm talking about - light of ten thousand suns and all,BTW.

That Ten Thous Suns thing is what makes me grovel for more.
I don't get there unless I am a REALLY good person and all my focus is on pleasing the Lord. (Not M mind you)

That's why you usually don't see me be crude much or judge - not ever - just not much. I really am trying to please a Superior Power and have a 'Mysical ' experience. I shouldn't be trying really.
I just want to do what ever it takes to please Him. Period.

It is actually fascinating - how the more you want to please then, as He pleases he gives you 'the Gift' - 'the Prize' - 'the Amrita' - a blessing -His Grace ---whatever one calls it.

That is my goal in being a good person. Amoung other things....

But, I digressed.. Elaine

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:08:32 (GMT)
From: ET
Email: prothro@my-deja.com
To: Elaine
Subject: What a wonderful attitude towards God! (nt)
Message:
God
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 14:29:56 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: ET
Subject: What a wonderful attitude towards God!
Message:
Hi ET,
Nice thread.Thank you for starting it.

We don't always get around to reading everyone's posts so may I say again -- I do indeed feel that our attitude when we meditate ( or, of course, do anything) is so important. If we can start out knowing that we are indeed doing something that is one of the most imp things 'God' wants us to be doing - ie.,communing w/ Him,opening to Him, listening to Him,desiring only Him - well, it really prepares us for a wonderful meditation.

I think that we forget how when we sit to meditate all the universe is happy. I feel we become a funnel, a receptacle of so much 'grace'.
When I write this - often -others find objection to words such as 'God or grace' - I could use other words,but, w/ you I'll say them. :)

As I've said before - it is a Divine Romance - just as Yogananda's book title says.

(You want nooky w/ your spouse - you bring flowers.) ;)

Regards,
Elaine

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:55:03 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: omigod ... oh ... it's that great white ...
Message:

omigod ... oh ... it's that great white ...


...telephone again ...


BLLLLEEEEEUUUUUUURGGHHHHHHHHHH sssssplatttttt!


Ooh, Elaine, please don't do that.


Do what?


say things like:

'when we meditate, all the universe is happy'

(Thank GOD I'm not a premie any more)

I guess this is the parting of the ways.

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 21:55:10 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Didn't realize we were connected in 1st place (nt
Message:
aum
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 18:24:18 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: it's that great white ... whale? (ot)
Message:
Hi cq,

Oh I get it . . . 'a blower' - slang for a telephone . . . that's the opposite of a hoover, isn't it? (right, I forgot, sometimes you seem to get the ends mixed up.

And a joke especially for you! (I hope you haven't seen it yet)


An ambitious yuppie finally decided to take a vacation. He booked himself on a Caribbean cruise and proceeded to have the time of his life... until the boat sank! The man found himself swept up on the shore of an island with no other people, no supplies... Nothing. Only bananas and coconuts.

After about four months, he is lying on the beach one day when the most gorgeous woman he has ever seen rows up to him.
In disbelief he asks her: 'Where did you come from? How did you get here?'

'I rowed from the other side of the island,' she says. 'I landed here when my cruise ship sank.'

'Amazing,' he says. 'You were really lucky to have a rowboat wash up with you.'

'Oh, this?' replies the woman. 'I made the rowboat out of raw material that I found on the island; the oars were whittled from gum tree branches; I wove the bottom from palm branches; and the sides and stern came from a Eucalyptus tree.'

'But-but, that's impossible,' stutters the man. 'You had no tools or hardware. How did you manage?'

'Oh, that was no problem,' replies the woman. 'On the south side of the island, there is a very unusual strata of alluvial rock exposed. I found that if I fired it to a certain temperature in my kiln, it melted into forgeable ductile iron. I used that for tools and used the tools to make the hardware.

The guy is stunned.

'Let's row over to my place, ' she says.

After a few minutes of rowing, she docks the boat at a small wharf. As the man looks onto shore, he nearly falls out of the boat. Before him is a stone walk leading to an exquisite bungalow painted in blue and white.

While the woman ties up the rowboat with an expertly woven hemp rope, the man can only stare ahead, dumb-struck.

As they walk into the house, her beautiful breasts bouncing with each step, she says casually, 'It's not much, but I call it home. Sit down please; would you like to have a drink?'

'No thank you,' he says, still dazed. 'Can't take any more coconut juice.'

'It's not coconut juice,' the woman replies. 'I have a still. How about a Pina Colada?'

Trying to hide his continued amazement, the man accepts, and they sit down on her couch to talk.

After they have exchanged their stories, the woman announces,'I'm going to slip into something more comfortable. Would you like to take a shower and shave? There is a razor upstairs in the cabinet in the bathroom.'

No longer questioning anything, the man goes into the bathroom. There, in the cabinet, is a razor made from a bone handle. Two shells honed to a hollow ground edge are fastened onto its end, inside of a swivel mechanism.

'This woman is amazing,' he muses. 'What next?'

When he returns, she greets him wearing nothing but vines and a shell necklace-strategically positioned-and smelling faintly of gardenias.

She beckons for him to sit down next to her.

'Tell me,' she begins suggestively, slithering closer to him, 'we've been out here for a very long time. You've been lonely. I've been lonely. There's something I'm sure you really feel like doing right about now, something you've been longing for all these months? You know... ' She stares into his eyes.

He can't believe what he's hearing. His heart begins to pound. He's truly in luck: 'You mean...', he gasps, '...I can actually check my e-mail from here??'


Have a great Friday night! (And don't forget to check your e-mails!)

To the Garden!!!

Stonor

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 19:59:54 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: what makes the world go round? ... (ot)
Message:
What makes the world go round???


Nothing but love

When Whippoorwills call
And evening is nigh
I hurry to my blue heaven
I turn to the right
A little white light
Will lead you to my blue heaven

You'll see a smiling face
A fireplace, a cozy room
A little nest
That's nestled where the roses bloom

Just Molly and me
And baby makes three
We're happy in my blue heaven

You'll see a smiling face
A fireplace, a cozy room
A little nest
That's nestled where the roses bloom

Just Molly and me
And baby makes three
We're happy in my blue heaven

We're happy in my blue heaven


BTW, who's this 'Molly', WHO got her pregnant? and
why the hell wasn't I invited???

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 21:49:41 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: the brain and consciousness and chemikals, yummy
Message:
You have heard about the experiements that magnets on the brain can produce
can produce
'cosmic' & 'god' experiences?

Our body produces dmt, one of the strongest, if not the strongest psychedelic, is linked to all nerve cell communication and serotonin (ecstacy related), which are linked directly to the pineal gland, which produces melatonin which is mescalin related.
That's apart from the opiates, cannabinoids etc etc

We're just walking pharmacies

And that's without the complexities of cocktails

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:57:47 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: Magnets?Cocktails?where's me Carlsberg special?(nt
Message:
Magnets?Cocktails?where's me Carlsberg special?(nt
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 18:19:56 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: et tu bru?
Message:
Seriously though, Hamzen, (or may I call you Ham? or do you prefer to be kosher?) ...

... along with the serotonin, melatonin, mescalin, and all and sundry other pineal by-products (I'll take your word for it, - trepanning ain't my idea of a party .... though I know one person who thought it was his, but that's another story ...)

anyway, along with all those powerful chemicals that the human brain is capable of producing ...

... where was I ?...


oh yes -

this 'light of a thousand suns' that Elaine recently waxed poetic about (I was about to say 'noetic' - but ... I've forgotten what that means)

anyway ...

oh yes,

.. 'walking pharmacies' you call us

you call us? I thought I called you?

So, where the hell did I put that pipe? It was here a moment ago ...

Let me get back to you on this ....

... OK?

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 09:52:40 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: And you a special bru man,
Message:
well either your sources are a bit dodgy, or you've jumped into heavy psychedelics a bit deep, just chill out a bit, soak up the vibes, it'll all level out soon!! :)

Real old skool cyder for me tanx.

So you doin any festis this summer, my man?

I'll be the nutta by the drum & bass tent, be sure to pop by and have a spin

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 01:11:42 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: to hamzen, re: 'chemicals'
Message:
Hi ham,

Just a thought -

Could there be a parallel/correspondence between 'chemicals' that we can take to simulate 'spiritual experiences' which seem to be possible to experience through a wholistic/natural/integrated 'human/spiritual'development, and chemicals in the agricultural industry (and all their long-term ramifications)? One book I read calls it 'cheating,' and perhaps it is comparable to 'cheating' (on exams, for example), in that you get something that only provides a momentary and false sense of achievement or progress of some sort, but leads nowhere.

This thread is raising a number of interesting questions for me.

Stonor

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 10:05:41 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: to hamzen, re: 'chemicals'
Message:
Yeah I believed that for years too, but I think that's bollox too now, for me even natural routes can be dodgy and dangerous.

I forcibly stopped myself from meditating for a few years, to re-engage with the human race. Beautiful as it is in a spiritual cell, it's still a cell.

No, as with everything worthwhile, I think it's all in the timing. External drugs also break certain patterns that no other route does, that's been my experience anyway.

And the take on 'it', without elevating any higher powers or 'spiritual' message into, has definitely been expanded by my chemikal experiences.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:44:44 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: Thousand Petaled Lotus Flower....
Message:
Dear Elaine,
Didn't think to count the petals! :)
The word is the same for me...'Donuts & blue swirls are great for focusing your attention - but that leads to something else.'
Usually it is just following my breath but sometimes it has lead to a racing energy coursing through the center of my body from the base to the top chakra(sp) so even though I get a benifit from just following my breath I know it is only a way to get to the other more intense experience.
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:29:37 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: ET
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
I don't know about brighter than ten thousand suns, but still incredibly bright at times, like looking at a series of lights glaring at you in the dark, to the point of very strong flashes like looking at stobes or into light bulbs.

But for me, the light was no more than another route into the land of cosmic love pulse, which occasionally fried the negative sides of my ego, hit really deep psychologically, raised my energy levels enormously and out of all the techniques I think got me incredibly horny. It's difficult to analyse the individual effects quite as specificaly as I would like.

I write in the past tense because I don't practice so regularly now so the intensity of the experience is reduced.

When using the technique, improvise, gods not gonna mug you, do what's comfortable for you, or not, if you're into pain,
but like Elaine, I don't think the heavy technique is good for you, and someone here, Sir D I think, caused physical problems by it's use, so be careful.

Did find that it took me about 18 months to two years before it was regular/reliable.

Realizing k for me, was being in a state where the cosmic love pulse orgasm head trip affected my whole body, felt like every pore, which started to alter my whole reality perception, especially on a deep emotional level, where emotions are no longer the bog standard ones.

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 03:28:05 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: Light 'Technique' or what?
Message:
Hi hamzen,

Can you fill me in about the 'Light Technique?' Is it an actual method/ (I don't recall it being part of the k package)

I have had a number of visual experiences although I've never received k or any other form of 'initiation' from a 'guru.' As you know I do practice meditation (breath focus only - tried a few 'mantras' but i always found them 'noisy.)

I've had a number of 'visions' of nature etc., but they have always seemed to me to be comparable to the 'visions' I often have before sleeping and at other comparable times. I have also read in more than one place that these images should be ignored. As for the 'doughnut effect,' very common, even before doing any meditation, but sometimes I've seen more of a 3D blue point that has at times appeared like a tunnel of sorts (made me a bit nervous, and I lost it). Once while meditating, there was an extremely bright 'presence,' and I immediately and automatically put my forehead to the floor, and didn't know what to do. One other unusual 'vision' was of a sort of 3D psychedelic pattern of glittering diamonds moving towards me with a very faint strange kind of 'music' or vibration.

I've never meditated because I've wanted 'visions' or any other kind of experience of these sorts, and I think I'd almost prefer that they didn't happen. Believe it or not, when I have them I get nervous about meditating more.

Stonor

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 11:18:09 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Light 'Technique' or what?
Message:
Hi Stoner,
Don't be afraid of the light and visions you see! They can't hurt you as long as you aren't pressing the shit out of your eye balls! Try to relax and enjoy it and maybe it will become something you can really enjoy. Good luck.
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 12:56:04 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: Light 'Technique' or what?
Message:
Hi Robyn,

So I guess the 'Light Technique' is the one where you push on your eyelids. No, I never do that when I sit in meditation, and i have never heard of it elsewhere. In fact, the only time I see 'doughnuts' is when I rub my eyes because they're itchy - fascinated me briefly as a child, but I never thought of it as anything other than the effect of having rubbed my eyes - and my mother always told me stop rubbing my eyes, but that can be tough sometimes when you have allergies ;-)

Stonor

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 23:42:42 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: PS to Robyn and thanks all
Message:
Hi again Robyn and all,

Thought I should clarify what my 'fear' is about. I'm not 'afraid of the light and visions' I see, but more about feeling even more alienated from most people than I've already felt all my life. This is why I continue to seek people with whom I can share these kinds of thoughts and experiences with.

But at the same time as I've felt more alienated in many ways from most people I encounter in my daily life, I've felt more aware of, and connected to, humanity and life as a whole. Hmmmmm. Lots to ponder, and meditate on.

Thanks all for helping me to explore these questions and 'fears.'

And thank you for your feedback, Robyn :-) (And I didn't say I didn't enjoy meditation ;-)

Love,

StonOr

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 00:26:04 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: PS to Robyn and thanks all
Message:
Dear Stonor,
I am glad you can enjoy your meditation experiences. I am very fortunate to have friends that may think I am excentric but love me anyway! There are very few people I know in my physical life that 'get' what I'm into but I can see them stretching themselves on occassion to try to share with me, similar pieces of themselves.
That is one nice thing about my presence here and the email friendships I have that originated here. I do now have people that 'get' it, even if it isn't just the same 'it' as mine, you know. :)
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 09:16:13 (GMT)
From: Mili
Email: mili@cheerful.com
To: Stonor
Subject: Light 'Technique' or what?
Message:
Hey, it looks like you're doing pretty good there, Stonor. ;o)

The blue dot is called bindu, by the way.

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 23:23:01 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Mili
Subject: Dr. Jekyll, I presume. (nt)
Message:
Dr. Jekyll, I presume. (nt)
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 00:43:16 (GMT)
From: Mili
Email: mili@cheerful.com
To: Stonor
Subject: Ms. Hyde, I presume. (nt)
Message:
;o)
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 01:22:24 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Mili
Subject: Excuse me, but I think you're confusing me with
Message:
one of your new sidekicks :-)
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 02:49:55 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Mili
Subject: To Mili, with Love
Message:
Dear Mili,

I have realized that my, as well as others', anger comes from emotional pain and/or an inability to communicate/make oneself understood. You know quite well that I am no Jekyll/Hyde, among other things I have recently been called by you and one other. And I can tell you honestly, as I am quite sure you well know, how extremely upset I was by it all. Then you turn around again and pat me on the head and expect me to act as if nothing at all has ever happened. I have never been inconsistent or extreme with you, although I know that we have disagreed at times.

I had decided to avoid you, but no, you have to post to me again. I realize that everyone has their own issues and challenges in life, but I've been too psychologically and emotionally battered long and hard enough myself at this point to risk more. As I've said, I am trying to recover from raw wounds that need time to heal. Please understand that I have every right and with absolutely no malice, to choose to no longer communicate with someone who, unintentionally or not, hurts me, or others (which also hurts me) with too much regularity. If I don't take care of myself, I am not respecting the gift of this life that I have been given, and I run the risk of becoming another burden for others to bear, rather than being able to help carry the burdens of others. This is why I also requested the transfer to a new educational context last year, remember?

It has been and is difficult for me to become more and more aware, as I have been, of the suffering of others, when I know that I cannot help everyone, or be or give everything that people who come into contact with me might like. And it has been very hard for me to realize and accept that I must draw lines at times.

I know that your post was meant to be a friendly gesture, and I appreciate that, but apologize that I cannot respond in kind. I also apologize that I have implied anything negative about you and another individual in this thread. Please forgive me.

I truly wish you all the best in life, Mili.

Peace, and much love,

always,

Stonor

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 20:11:01 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Mili
Subject: Blue dot=bindu? Mili? someone's been there B4?(nt)
Message:
Blue dot=bindu? Mili? someone's been there B4? (nt)
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:17:58 (GMT)
From: Keith
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
My god hamzen, you are almost sounding like a new ager. Is that really you?
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:23:54 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
... cosmic love pulse orgasm head trip

Groovy.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:43:51 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Groovy I guess, yeah, groove is in the heart
Message:
Your starter for five.

The name of the band?

And do you remember the swirlies in their video for the aforementioned song?

What can I say, but my man, give us five!

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 10:21:56 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: Groovy I guess, yeah, groove is in the heart
Message:
Dear ham,
Is it Delight? God, I saw that subject and can just picture Jessica dancing to that song on MTV! It was GREAT!
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 18:50:26 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: Not bad Robyn, but you forgot the 'e's, Deee-Lite
Message:
'89-90 wasn't it? there were some great songs out in 1990,
gorgeous vibe all of 'em.

Definitely summer vibe.

Oh well, sounds like you're having the same summer as us, non-existent, with too many reminders of winter

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 20:21:24 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: Not bad Robyn, but you forgot the 'e's, Deee-Lite
Message:
Dear ham,
Ahhhhh, Deee-Lite. Jessica would have known that! :)
I started college in 1988 and graduated in 1993 and that was the only time I ever had cable and thus MTV, so yeah, probably was '89-'90.

Hey, hey, it is supposed to warm up this weekend! I haven't given up yet! Hope to be basking over the next few days! :)
Love,
Robyn

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 15:47:35 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: ET
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
You don't necessarily press the eyes. But, by holding them still -they don't 'jiggle or quiver'. You can't see the Light when your eyes are moving at all. My experience.

Just keep focusing and you'll see alot more than swirling patterns. If you 'squeeze' it's just some optic nerve firing light patterns -- that's not The Light - as in -'Blows your socks off' or 'Light of Ten-thousands Suns'.
Whole diff ball-game there.

I suppose you could say seeing 'that' Light would be a form of realizing (a part) of Kn.

Elaine

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 16:39:11 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
Elaine,

Do you really see a light brighter than ten thousand suns when you practice? Seriously? I'm cracking up, here. 'Realizing' Knowledge, in my book, is realizing that the 'light' was always there, whenever you closed your eyes, whether you were using the techniques or not. Only because you were caught up in so many concepts about it, did you fail to see it.

Now, when I first realized this, I got kind of pissed off, because it was just more of the same, nothing new. Goddam, it was reality, and that's the last thing I was interested in. Do you understand what I'm talking about? 'Realizing' Knowledge is just waking up from your fantasies and taking stock of what's there, what's right under your nose. It's about being conscious. The only problem is I get bored meditating, so I find that I'm better off focusing my awareness on things that I find more interesting, good music, good reading, movies, computer games, shapely legs, etc.... But the bottom line is it's about being conscious, alive and present. That's all.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 21:47:53 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
Yeah, 'Realizing Knowledge' - what that heck is that?

It sounded funny when I read it above - the more I see it ---it's a foreign concept to me ---haven't heard the term in like 20 years maybe.

Forget I even responded to it before.

Light of 10,000 suns - why do you think I'm the nice,new agey person - I am - my parent's influence didn't get me there.And this world didn't either.
'Fraid so - I see Light - and when I'm not I'm usually groveling to experience it again and again - as in I'll do anything.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 01:06:41 (GMT)
From: raina
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: Lady Kir...and........
Message:
after reading this thread, i feel like a little kid who's peeking under the big top tent watching the circus.....or peeking out from behind a tree watching aliens prepare for take-off?............i have NO idea what everyone is talking about, and am wondering if you're all exaggerating?

let's do number 2 now!

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 20:16:25 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: raina
Subject: 'You Don't Even Know Me' - you're starter for ten
Message:
is, can you name another another big single by the same person who produced this?

Well I don't know about anyone else in this thread, but I haven't got anything to sell or promote, except why should gm pollute what for some people can be an interesting journey.
No need to exaggerate.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 10:24:40 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: raina
Subject: Lady Kir...and........
Message:
Can't get with the numbers, they came after my time. Seems to be back peddling to go from a discriptive, simple name to a number, like some space age futuristic Star Trek meditation! :)
And are they named in order of importance or SOMETHING!
Robyn
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 22:16:59 (GMT)
From: raina
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: Lady Kir...and........
Message:
i've been trying to read a bunch of posts...and i'm falling asleep at the wheel.....
can't keep up......i hope no one thinks i'm ignoring them.....or actually fuck it! this is an orgasmatron! not the real thing!

going to bed............

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 23:45:35 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: raina
Subject: Welcome back ...
Message:
I thought you were working hard at a tiring job Mon-Fri.
Glad to see you back - alot going on - Boston - JohnD in India - it just never ends....
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:06:21 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: The Light Technique
Message:
'Fraid so - I see Light - and when I'm not I'm usually groveling to experience it again and again - as in I'll do anything.

Alright, I'll take your word for it. But you do realize that Maharaji hasn't spoken about light in years. It's now called the 'first technique'. And no reference that a light is seen doing it is ever spoken. I wonder why that is. If you're supposed to see this light while practicing the 'first technique', how come Maharaji never says so? How come there's never a word said about 'divine light'?

Very strange.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:25:48 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Light Tech or First Tech...
Message:
Jerry,
I don't know - all I could think is the usual -- don't give people high expectations.

When I talk about my meditations - it's not really a 'good' thing - I notice there is a comparisaon followed by a slight depression in old friends - I don't do it anymore.
But, here ,I felt it was important for me fr the start ----that's what got me to org. post ---was to say -I did experience a great deal - and felt that M delivered exactly what he said. That's why I'm not 'mad' at him like alot of people here.

I don't even think people here experience 'Holy Name' really. Not fr the sounds of it, I mean.

There's alot more to it than 'following your breath' !!! My God.

I can only think no wonder there are so many exes.

I don't think M is the best teacher of this Kn. He inspires me at times to go inside and meditate and all - when he's not telling dung stories for the tenth time --- but, I think he could be better.

IMO,
Elaine

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 18:23:13 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: I might be the exception that proves your rule
Message:
but I left excatly because it DID work for me.

It became so painfully obvious that he didn't care if almost nobody heard about it, just so long as he was out of the media eye living a nice lucrative lifestyle.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 20:50:40 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: I might be the exception
Message:
Well, shit --- your right if this thing is so incredible -why the hell isn't he doing something other 'than what he is' to turn people on to this thing.

It doesn't make sense. If he wants all to rec Kn - do something else....if he wants more money ----do something else.

See, he just isn't the best at what he does, is he?

I don't get it exactly ---feedback? So you're one of the ones that still meditates I gather. I forget your past posts, sorry.

Oh, and I don't have rules - too many exceptions to everything in life...

Elaine

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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 11:51:33 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: Sorry to be so pedantic but
Message:
all language use is conceptual, any ideas at all are concepts, concepts are concepts because of rules.

You might mean that you try to reduce your rule book, but you couldn't function as a human being without them.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 12:04:45 (GMT)
From: Just the Facts
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: The 5 Commandments
Message:
1)Refrain from postponing till tomorrow what can be done today
2)Always meditate on the holy name
3)Never leave room doubt in your mind
4)Never avoid attending satsang
5)Always have faith in God
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:21:06 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Just the Facts
Subject: Slight Correction
Message:
Oh dear God, why do I remember these things? Actually, the commadments are:

1. Never PUT OFF until tomorrow what you can do today.
2. CONSTANTLY meditate and remember holy name.
3. Never leave room for doubt in your mind (I agree on that one)
4. Never DELAY in attending satsang
5. Always have faith in god (right).

I always found the fifth commandment contradictory, especially because Mahararji constantly said we had to have faith, always, in Guru Maharaj Ji (him), and never said anything about having faith in god, other than in the commandment. Was this just part of equating himself with god?

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:36:38 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: If it wasn't it might as well have been
Message:
Was this just part of equating himself with god?

And hasn't he ALWAYS used the smokescreen technique so he can deny any responsibility, when he knew/knows all along how his words are interpreted?

Also wonder if the commandments are part of the radha baggage his dad knicked.

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 01:56:08 (GMT)
From: sam
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: If it wasn't it might as well have been
Message:
did his dad actually nick them as his own? what about the history (its on M's net page)of the other dudes who were masters before dad?
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Date: Sat, Jun 10, 2000 at 09:23:14 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: sam
Subject: GM's lineage thing is all bollox
Message:
Read the background material here on the site,

not only is it bollox, it's superficial bollox, less than five minutes and anyone with a quarter open mind would scratch the' perfect master lineage' concept from their concept pile.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:42:07 (GMT)
From: Just the Facts
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Slight Correction or Variation?
Message:
Yes, I heard them that way as well. However, it would be presumptious on our part to think that there was one standard version. That would imply that GMJ/DLM had their shit together. The only reason there was recruiting success at that time was because you could get it so quick-before you had time to let those doubts form. I suspect that more people received K in the west from 1971-1975 than in the 25 years since combined. Despite yet another attempt by Rawat to fire up the flock about recruiting, it will fail. I hear they are currently having workshops about communicating. I'm thinking they are going to try to teach the flock the art of salesmanship w/o them knowing they are employing sales techniques.
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:20:43 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Just the Facts
Subject: Slight Correction or Variation?
Message:
I don't know if there even WAS a 'standard version.' I suspect the commandments we were given were translations from Hindi. They sound kind of like translations. But who knows what variations they might have gone through over the years.

Do you know when the commandments were dropped as part of the Maharaji trip? They were still tacitly around when I left the cult in 1983, but not talked about as much as they had been in earlier years.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 18:14:37 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Just the Facts
Subject: I was handed Joe's version
Message:
Still have it somewhere from Manhattan, May 1972.
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:59:02 (GMT)
From: Just the Facts
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: I was handed Joe's version/Irrelevant-So what
Message:
blah,blah, blah
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:01:16 (GMT)
From: selene
Email: None
To: Just the Facts
Subject: fuck you
Message:
fuck you
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:36:59 (GMT)
From: Just the Facts
Email: None
To: selene
Subject: fuck you-No Thanks
Message:
you ugly
you ugly
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:47:18 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Just the Facts
Subject: you WISH
Message:
that would make your hate easier
I've posted pics here. and my real name
who the fuck are you. No, I'm not ugly. oh well
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 18:29:44 (GMT)
From: Monmot
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: E. 83rd St. Ashram? (nt)
Message:
mm
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:38:14 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Monmot
Subject: was it a 5 or 6 story walk up brownstone type?
Message:
got driven u pthere from Philly by some crazies. Didn't pay a lot of attention, but yet that address sounds right.
The ashram had one of the top floors set up for M.
I remember because I went in there one night, he hadn't gotten there or anything. And I sat on the bed! and just 'felt' the energy. shit I was so innocent then!
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:17:26 (GMT)
From: Monmot
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Sounds like it...
Message:
It was a brownstone type bldg. with a zillion stairs to the top floor. I got K there in November 72, so it sounds like it could be the same place. After we received the first two techniques, we had a break, and M came down and gave us darshan, and all I could think about was his shiny hair and his pointy shoes. Yeah, talk about innocence, all right. What I went through to get there. A tale to tell.

I went to a party immediately after the K session with the my old high school boyfriend who I was staying with, and people would come up to me and say, 'Are you related to Anne Bancroft?' And I'd say, 'No, but I saw God today.'

Jesu Christe big time.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:23:26 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Monmot
Subject: Anne Bancroft is the best
Message:
Seperated and working at a university. And the students like me.
oh oh. :)
It sure does sound like the same place. The premies were great.
I have nothing but fond memories of those people.

I had a wonderful time. Crazy and wild and magical.
Innocent. didn't realize what I had done, was doing. And what
M and his minions were up to.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:30:00 (GMT)
From: Monmot
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Bancroft keeps on ticking...
Message:
I have fond memories too of that time and place. It was nuts and so was (is?)I, but I had a magical time.
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 17:10:53 (GMT)
From: poet
Email: None
To: all
Subject: peace
Message:
The world is a much more peaceful place now, than in 1971, although still falling headlong into environmental destruction.

Of course those people on the wrong end of genoside, etc. might not agree with the more peaceful part or care much about the environment outside of their own skin. And who could blame them.

It is kinda nice sitting here, smug in my safe room.

Anyone who believed that a -boy- could be 'god' should look at where they were coming from. Some religion maybe?

Anyway, and this is for your bad boys on this site,anyone who was stupid enough to move into a ashram should be smart enough by now to take responsibility for it. But,then that would mean that they had stopped being so fucking stupid.

My experience of the people in the ashram, was that they had some desperate need to believe that their whole worship thing ,and devotion and great sacrafice, was what made them so right. Kinda like this whole desperate need to be right now. Right?

It is fun though,now that I am getting the feel for it, to come on this site and throw a little abuse around. Kinda theraputic.
Something good for my soul. I particuarly like the cheap shots at M.s family. Kinda makes me want to go out and fuck over my own mother and father or whoever.Right? Maybe my own little sister or someone you know.

So, you don't like the corporate guru. Welcome to America,the land of the free. Free to rape and pillage the world. Yum nothing like it,being an American. Hey, what do ya say, lets go back to Vietnam and do it all over again. I'm getting tired of this old game, let's do something that really inflicts pain.

It all makes me sick. Of course you already knew that about me.

I think gerry is really gary on that premie site. You know that sactomonious bastard that wants to know who you are. What your experience of knowledge is and who is not really just tring to give you a hard time, but is 'curios'. Nice way to start my morning. Thanks for the oppurtunity. jsca. My spelling and literacy? Arrested development. Right?

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 15:17:46 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: poet
Subject: peace be unto you, Oh Poet
Message:
Well, I'm not 'gary.' I have a couple of spoof psuedos I very occasionally use but not that one. I am, however, interested in peoples' 'experience' of nollidge, since most premies say it's an experience, not a philosophy.

How 'bout you? What's your experience of knowledge? (Just curious)

Oh and your spelling is still pretty poor, no big deal, but you are communicationg pretty well, I'd say. Better than your first post, right?

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:26:11 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: poet
Subject: peace
Message:
Is this Wm?
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:00:45 (GMT)
From: poet
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: peace
Message:
no.
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 12:07:51 (GMT)
From: jondon
Email: None
To: Just the Facts
Subject: Why post that again?....little bit of doubt?..(nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 14:00:37 (GMT)
From: Joey
Email: None
To: jondon
Subject: To jondon, from below re: Steve Hassan (ot)
Message:
I'm not sure how long you plan on staying in the Boston area, but I wanted you to have this piece of info which I just got from Steve's site.

Good luck, all the best!
******************************

June 11, 2000

Steve will be on the Matt Schaefer radio show on station WBCN (104.1 FM/Boston) at approximately 8:15pm ET.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 14:25:17 (GMT)
From: jondon
Email: None
To: Joey
Subject: Thanx, will call in again (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 13:54:32 (GMT)
From: Just the Facts
Email: None
To: jondon
Subject: The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji
Message:
Oh my Guru Maharaj Ji,
I dedicate myself to You. I am weak & ignorant and am filled with the impurities of this world. Oh Guru Maharaj Ji through Knowledge please purify me of the impurities I possess.
Reveal to me the Knowledge of all Knowledges. Strengthen me, uplift me and reveal the Truth within inside of me.
Bring me from hate to love, darkness to light, death to immortality. I will follow Your direction and will never reveal this Knowledge to anybody for any reason.
I will keep in contact with You through my devotional love, satsang, meditation and service.

Thank You.

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 22:52:32 (GMT)
From: Han
Email: None
To: Just the Facts
Subject: The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji
Message:
Thank you for posting that prayer. I had forgotten, how in any context,,it still fills the heart with love
and devotion.
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:38:45 (GMT)
From: Pauline Premie
Email: None
To: Han
Subject: The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji
Message:
It is just so blissful to see a premie admit that he is weak and ignorant and filled with the impurities of this world. Just like a sewage treatment plant we are. All the impurities flow into us and it's only by devotion and gratitude that the treatment plant makes us worthy of even washing M's rear end.

I don't know why we don't say that prayer anymore. It's just so true, but the stupid people of this world, and these stupid ex-premies would just take it, and twist it, and make it look like Maharaji is running a bizarre cult. Poor Maharaji. He is so picked on, when he is just trying to fly around in a Gulfstream IV, or drive one of his Rolls Royce limosines to an 'event' so he can remind people to be grateful to him. He is just so selfless and beautiful. Such a lotus.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 23:19:08 (GMT)
From: Han
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji
Message:
Your name hardly reflects all that
misdirected anger Ms. Premie,,, I was merely expressing
a feeling, from reading a prayer that expresses gratitude.
The fact that man wastes most of his time on this planet creating and living in his own pollution,,physical or mental,,does not negate the fact that there are a few people who from whatever denomination they may come still appreciate a simple prayer, Universal in nature,, in adoration of the higher
power that governs us all.
Lose the cynicism,,you'll have better day.

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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 05:53:18 (GMT)
From: Dr. Crane
Email: None
To: Han
Subject: The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji
Message:
Are you inspired by prayers that tell you how worthless you are? Are you inspired to surrender your life to another human being? I don't think Pauline is cynical, I think she's sane. If you think the world is in such terrible shape, perhaps you might consider trying to do something about it besides reciting worthless, self-destructive prayers.
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:41:32 (GMT)
From: Han
Email: None
To: Dr. Crane
Subject: The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji
Message:
Interesting how a prayer can cause such hostility.
The concept of Devotion is a threat to the ego,,absolutely.
It is the basis for most persecution. Even a highly educated
person would agree.....
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Date: Fri, Jun 09, 2000 at 17:04:45 (GMT)
From: Niles
Email: None
To: Dr. Crane
Subject: The early 70's K vow to Guru Maharaj Ji
Message:
Look, face it, Frazier, the world *is* in a terrible shape, and if Han needs to remind him/herself of that, then at least you're keeping yourself in business aren't you?

I mean, where would we be without our problems? And where would YOU be?

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 10:14:55 (GMT)
From: bonnejovi
Email: None
To: yone
Subject: R there any 'hippies' or ex-'hippies'
Message:
here?
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 05:44:24 (GMT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: bonnejovi
Subject: ...titter
Message:
titter
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 14:15:45 (GMT)
From: Love Child
Email: None
To: bonnejovi
Subject: Lots. Why? (nt)
Message:
lsd
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 10:24:30 (GMT)
From: Jethro Tulias
Email: None
To: bonnejovi
Subject: R there any 'hippies' or ex-'hippies'
Message:
non..well maybe..
i have an addiction to babes who do k beans.....http://
HELLLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOO.COM
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 19:08:27 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Jethro Tulias
Subject: Haha, you mean are there any non-hippies here,
Message:
if I see one I'll let you know,

most people here seem to be in mid-forties plus, and most of them took acid or were very close to the culture back in the day.

But don't start me off, this is a big 1 for me, and I still have far to many hippy traits than are good for me.

Why'd ya ask?

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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:15:37 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: but ham we ARE non hippies
Message:
at least I am. could not be futher from a hippie and have
no desire to be one.
but I do like to get high. It just has a different meaning now.
oh oh can't wait for some asshole to have a field day
with THIS post. oh well at least I know that you know what I mean.
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 00:35:44 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Yes but Bon Jovi was asking about hippie roots,
Message:
Selene, really?? no hippie roots at all??, I'd say you're in a distinct minority here.

Aside from that, what's unnatractive about hippydom?
just remembered for you, hippie=redneck back to the woods men yeah?

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 02:58:21 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: yeah, with tattoos and bad teeth
Message:
nothing like an arizona redneck hippie blend to turn you off to the 70's for life!!
OK OK I do know what you are talking about.
really shit I hate my generation always said I was born 10 years too early. I'm sure I was a mistake. Just ask anyone in my family.
can I go get high now and we can just dance sometime?
I've been picked on here today (not by you)
and I had a bad day.... did some very difficult stuff.
aside.

and.. now... I expect raina to come along
any minute and announce the inevtitable booze reference. fuck fuck fuck

sorry ham.

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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 21:52:59 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Don't apologize, love your detours (nt)
Message:
a
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Date: Thurs, Jun 08, 2000 at 23:08:08 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: detours good word for it!
Message:
feeling better today. Yesterday was a killer.
Lots of family issues that couldn't be ignored any longer.
Always fun.
thanks ham
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Date: Wed, Jun 07, 2000 at 20:32:24 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: but ham we ARE non hippies
Message:
From what I can tell from the audience at M's 'events' they all appears to be middle-aged, and wearing Calvin Klein and/or Ralph Loren clothing. They looked nothing at all like hippies. More like Republican wanna bees.
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