Forum V: Archive
Compiled: Fri, Aug 25, 2000 at 12:48:05 (GMT)
From: Aug 13, 2000 To: Aug 22, 2000 Page: 5 Of: 5


A Former Aspirant -:- My God, what a bunch of losers you premies are.... -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:55:57 (GMT)
__ Shroomananda -:- It's better to be a 'loser' with Knowledge than -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 00:00:52 (GMT)
__ __ Ex-Shroom -:- better get lost then. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 11:19:08 (GMT)
__ __ Sir David -:- You must be thick, Mushroom -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:07:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ Coach -:- Spooky or What? -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:43:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- THAT synchronisity (nt) -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:58:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ SynCoach -:- It's a synch(nt) -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:28:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- that's informal -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:53:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ Shroomananda -:- You must love denying your experience, Sir. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:42:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ G -:- How do you know? -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:17:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- How do you know when the sun is shining? -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:25:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- That's not what I asked. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:33:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ red butler -:- Punjabi shoe shine -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 15:35:06 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- If by mumbo-jumbo you mean some thing or -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:54:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- He denies being the 'Perfect Master'- how long til -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:54:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- mumbo jumbo juju magic -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:16:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- Just how stupid CAN a premie be? -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:20:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- How stupid can one be? I guess if I was -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:15:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Lard told you that, but is NOT true (nt) -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 14:32:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- You just haven't faced the music, yet, Shroom -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:28:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Well, that post wasn't too bad! But really Jim, -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:47:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- What is this? An S and M club? -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 22:26:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Excuse me Sir Dave. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:07:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ G -:- Vibhuti - Holy shit! -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 00:26:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Yes, there is a lot of (un)Holy shit flying! -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 00:47:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- effect vs affect -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:07:06 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- effect vs affect -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:24:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Let's not forget something here, Stonor. By your -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:22:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- I did NOT call you a fool, Shroom -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:33:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Why don't you find out for yourself instead of -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:44:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- You're still just assuming. And, good night :) (nt -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:48:10 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- I don't have a problem, lady. You were the one -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:53:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ sb -:- I don't have a problem, lady. You were the one -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 10:09:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- And you're not even an 'ex' Sai Baba student -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:31:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- Sai Baba's 'Knowledge' -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 15:44:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Michael -:- Make up your mind. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:14:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- The early Christians were called 'Christines'. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:30:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Nigel -:- The early Christians were called 'Christines'. -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:34:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- All I can say is that I didn't see that light -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:54:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Nigel -:- All I can say is that I didn't see that light -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 02:51:57 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- saw the light all the time as a kid -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 01:16:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- But I enjoy listening to him speak more than -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 03:13:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ TD -:- Shroo, one of the realisations I had since -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 10:46:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Yeah, I confess, I'm addicted to listening to -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 17:38:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ TD -:- Yeah, I confess, I'm addicted to taking heroin -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 00:15:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- TD you crack me up (bad pun I know) -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 01:00:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- please can you repeat what he said please? -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 07:47:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- I didn't write anything down, Selene, but why -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 17:43:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selenie the BiTcH -:- alas none of the premies will talk to me -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 18:22:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Hey, I can do better than that. I just got my own -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 20:24:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ S tHe B -:- Hey, I can do better than that. -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 21:55:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- I always seem to attract the bad girls. Must be -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 23:45:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Michael -:- I would never try to convert anyone.-Shroomananda -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 04:55:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- I thought you weren't talking to me anymore, -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 06:03:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- I thought you weren't talking to me anymore, -:- Fri, Aug 18, 2000 at 11:52:58 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- I did say a few things about my own experience, -:- Fri, Aug 18, 2000 at 19:09:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- Shroo , with a bit of practice and with loads of -:- Fri, Aug 18, 2000 at 20:56:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Michael -:- Did you tell him Maharaji's a pilot? NT -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 13:13:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- No, I didn't. I don't think that would have made -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 17:07:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Michael -:- The early Christians were called 'Christines'. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:37:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- The early Christians were called 'Christines'. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 08:57:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Michael -:- Have you been paying attention? -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 14:55:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- Have you been paying attention? -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 15:01:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Sir David -:- That really says it all, doesn't it -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:58:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Fair enough. But I wonder what your response -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:12:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- You assume a great deal Shroom, and ... -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:40:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- So did I assume wrong, Stonor, or are you a former -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:48:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- assumptions -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:02:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- for butting in ... above post to Shroom (nt) -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:08:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Sir David -:- You must love being a parrot -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:56:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- Go for a knowledge -rewiew, sir Dave. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 09:35:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- Not so and never again will I go there! -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 10:52:44 (GMT)
__ jondon -:- Well put -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:54:17 (GMT)
__ __ G -:- Amaroo and la Tierra -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:32:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ sb -:- La Tierra -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 21:00:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ G -:- Horribly disappointed -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:18:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Amaroo -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:40:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Ben Doon -:- Amaroo, 20 KLMs from Brisbane. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 12:42:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Amaroo is a Hell Hole -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:35:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Chips Rafferty -:- Amaroo is really quite comfortable. -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 02:36:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Amaroo is a cult snake pit... -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 17:32:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Zelman Cohen -:- Amaroo is a Conference Centre in the Bush -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 00:08:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Amaroo is a Conference Centre in Hell -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 00:18:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Sir Les Patterson -:- Amaroo is in the Greatest little country in the w -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 15:12:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Amaroo is Cult Encampment -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 16:41:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ A Seasoned Traveller -:- Amaroo is Cult Encampment -:- Fri, Aug 18, 2000 at 22:42:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- Amaroo/ Complaining!! -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 09:17:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ G -:- Complaining about your complaining about his ... -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 23:07:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Amaroo/ Complaining!! -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:41:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- Amaroo and premies -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 08:30:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Amaroo and premies -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:46:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- Amaroo and premies -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:55:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Amaroo and premies -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:07:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- Amaroo and premies -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:22:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Are you kidding? -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 22:37:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Oliver -:- Dairrhoea at Amaroo -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 23:16:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- The Concession Tent -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 23:25:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Oliver -:- You can get anything you want at Amaroo's Restaura -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 00:48:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Except decent food... -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 19:44:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- eating his butt, the theory behind -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 21:18:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ TD -:- This is hysterical. Former aspirant - you are ... -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 10:26:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ A Former Aspirant -:- Thanks, but it wasn't so funny at the time -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 20:35:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Oliver who is not Fmr Asp -:- Well written TD,....... -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 12:45:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ TD -:- Hi Oliver and Fmr Asp (sorry it looked like I .... -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 00:54:58 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- Amaroo - I can sympathise -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:17:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ TD -:- He can make more money if people stay at Amaroo -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:33:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- Amaroo's a money scam -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:49:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ TD -:- Amaroo's a money scam -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 06:04:45 (GMT)
__ Pauline Premie -:- You lack understanding and synchronization.... -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:13:15 (GMT)
__ __ Norm Coach -:- How true, how true. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:25:48 (GMT)
__ __ Simon Satsang -:- But you don't, sister -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:27:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ Clara Clarity -:- Holy shit -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 00:44:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ I know it -:- David Smith EATS Holy shit -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 22:04:46 (GMT)

Joe -:- The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji cult. -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 17:31:15 (GMT)
__ bill -:- The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:56:35 (GMT)
__ jondon -:- The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji cult. -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:42:17 (GMT)
__ __ Joe -:- The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji cult. -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:16:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ jondon -:- So, how does one...... -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:48:23 (GMT)
__ Shroomananda -:- Do you really think that people will be prevented -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 19:24:06 (GMT)
__ __ Onionananda -:- SmartCard -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:41:04 (GMT)
__ __ Sir David -:- Some teacher eh? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:13:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Ever met a non-liar, Sir David? I've yet to meet -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:31:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Sir David -:- There's lies and then there's Maharaji's lies -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:14:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- So let me get this straight. Knowledge doesn't -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:38:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jerry -:- Bare faced liar? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:03:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Ben Lurking -:- Bare faced liar? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:05:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ G -:- bold-faced, bald-faced, barefaced -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:31:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Joe -:- It's 'bald-faced' -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:27:06 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jerry -:- Then it's settled -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:30:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- No it isn't -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:05:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ben Lurking -:- No it isn't -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 14:25:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Salam -:- I think he is a dickhead face -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 10:27:41 (GMT)
__ Xelda -:- The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji cult. -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 18:28:24 (GMT)
__ __ Shroomananda -:- I would suggest that you view a recent event like -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 19:04:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ Zelda -:- I would suggest that you view a recent event like -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:29:06 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Exit to what? Bitterness, anger, confusion and -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:53:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- Shroom , Who's confused here ? nt -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 09:22:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Zelda -:- Bitterness, anger, confusion of course in -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:42:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jerry -:- Maharaji doesn't have a heart -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:19:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- I don`t think Maharaji brainwashes people. -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:01:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jerry -:- No shit -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:42:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Gregg -:- Norge -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:45:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- Norge -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 10:38:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Salam -:- Norge -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 11:00:10 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Kjarne -:- Don`t be confused. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 11:20:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ TD -:- Oh, I just have to answer this one.... -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:54:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Nigel -:- Ha-ha! TD. Very well said!! (nt) -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:14:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ TD -:- FA - My post has disappeared!! (nt) -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:10:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Forum Admin -:- Where did you leave it...? -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:28:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ TD -:- It came magically all by itself after an hour or 2 -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 07:30:57 (GMT)

Jerry -:- Hindu 'baggage' -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 15:57:48 (GMT)
__ cq -:- M just plays God when it's financially suitable -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 17:19:25 (GMT)
__ Joe -:- What Elan Vital Hopes -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 17:10:48 (GMT)
__ __ bill -:- What Elan Vital Dopes -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:22:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ G -:- Rawat's yelling -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 23:08:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ bill -:- Rawat's yelling -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 04:17:20 (GMT)

AJW -:- Was it something I said? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 08:54:22 (GMT)
__ Robyn -:- Was it something I said? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 18:04:35 (GMT)
__ __ AJW -:- Was it something I said? -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 08:09:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ Robyn -:- Was it something I said? -:- Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 18:18:42 (GMT)

Salam -:- What the bird told me about gm -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:40:53 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- What the bird told me about gm -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:37:20 (GMT)
__ Jethro -:- Copy of email to George Chryssides -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 08:06:40 (GMT)
__ __ Salam -:- Copy of email to George Chryssides -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 08:40:25 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Where's that anti Sai Baba site? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 08:22:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ bill -:- I love your incarnation site Sir David.nt -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:26:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jethro -:- Here is the link -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 17:55:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ G -:- Here's another -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 18:33:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- That's great guys -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:47:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ bill -:- ugh, the sia bobo forum is loaded with crap. -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:24:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Lurkex -:- Here's another -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 00:17:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ Salam -:- Where's that anti Sai Baba site? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 14:17:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ G -:- Saieeee Bubba -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:05:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Unless ofcourse he was on -:- of the special students..nt -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 06:17:10 (GMT)
__ buzz -:- What the bird told me about gm -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:55:00 (GMT)

buzz -:- persistence -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:16:41 (GMT)
__ Selene -:- do people REALLY take shroom seriously? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:34:53 (GMT)
__ __ Ben Lurking -:- do people REALLY take shroom seriously? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:14:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ Selene -:- I think you mentioned clones -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:47:46 (GMT)
__ __ buzz -:- do people REALLY take shroom seriously? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:48:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ Selene -:- insecure definitely -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 07:20:16 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- do people REALLY take shroom seriously? -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:47:06 (GMT)
__ __ __ Kjarne -:- You should take everybody seriously. -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 16:04:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- You should take everybody seriously. -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 18:02:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ Selene -:- Sir Dave you know I agree with you about M -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:52:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Yeah, talking about peace, joy, love, clarity and -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 19:44:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Sir David -:- Revealing another fallacy -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:01:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ bill -:- Revealing another fallacy -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:30:15 (GMT)

Tomo -:- 1972 -:- Sun, Aug 13, 2000 at 16:26:22 (GMT)
__ hamzen -:- I think you answered your own question, -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 01:51:28 (GMT)
__ Lurkex -:- 1971, and I was 18 -:- Sun, Aug 13, 2000 at 16:54:54 (GMT)
__ __ Salam -:- 1971, and I was 18 -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 13:28:19 (GMT)
__ __ Gregg -:- Lurkex, you took the words out of my mouth (nt) -:- Sun, Aug 13, 2000 at 21:47:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ Tomo -:- Thanks -:- Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 11:36:21 (GMT)

Salam -:- A not so hypothetical question. -:- Sun, Aug 13, 2000 at 11:09:24 (GMT)
__ Shroomananda -:- A not so hypothetical answer from Shri Hans -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 01:49:12 (GMT)
__ __ hamzen -:- shri hans, a spiritually arrogant fascist, -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 02:11:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ Elaine -:- Shroom - re: HYP -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 15:04:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ hamzen -:- Especially not if he learnt his marketing skills -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 18:38:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ Sir David -:- Cult dogma revealed by Shroom's posts -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:29:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Shroomananda -:- Don't tell me what I believe, Pal. I posted that -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 19:13:10 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ hamzen -:- That's not what he's saying though is it -:- Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 07:45:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Sir David -:- Of course you believe it -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:07:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ Salam -:- Your posts prove a very good point, and that -:- Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 02:59:01 (GMT)


Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:55:57 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: My God, what a bunch of losers you premies are....
Message:
Well, I have a few things to say about Maharaji and his cult. I went to an 'event' when I thought I was an aspirant and I just have to say that cult is the world's worst, it's the armpit of the world, a total hellhole, and Maharaji is the stench of that smelly armpit. Knowledge, free? Are you fucking kidding? You practically have to donate a kidney before they will reveal those crummy meditation techniques to you, and if you disagree with anything they preach, well you can forget it.

And the place where they had the event, Amaroo, was the absolute worst place on Earth.

I mean, I've traveled all over and met a lot of premies and what has impressed me most is that no matter where I have met premies, my reaction has been the same: 'Oh, God, get me the fuck out of here.' I had alternative feelings about Maharaji and the premies as animals and ghouls. And Amaroo, my god, I hope I never have to set foot in this steaming dungheap again.

During my life, I have had the opportunity to criss-cross the world and I've met lots of people, but, holy crap, premies prove themselves again and again to be just like Maharaji, they are are craven, gutless cowards. I haven't the slightest clue what base and hideous interests these people operate under. I do not even vaguely know what drives those subhuman pig-men, but I am sure I don't want to know.

As I listened to Maharaji drone on, I couldn't hardly keep from vomiting and then, afterwards, when I was trying to end the nausea, I was approached by an 'aspirant coordinator' and all I could do was utter the words, 'No. No fucking way.' He acted in the fashion of an alien droid, unable to comprehend my statement.

And what's the big deal with the food they serve at those events? It tasted like shit. I wouldn't feed it to the dogs that food is probably made out of.

Every second I spend in the dark and evil state around Maharaji and premies is sheer agony. A second feels like a week in the presence of those monstrous non-people. I am only writing this because I wanted every last one of you grubby, ass-faced animals to realize exactly where you stand in the food chain. You are not a part of that chain. You exist outside of the human community. To hell with all of you, and good riddance.

Sincerely, a former aspirant.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 00:00:52 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: It's better to be a 'loser' with Knowledge than
Message:
to be a 'winner' without it! Poor baby. Keep searching, Former Aspirant. Maybe you'll find what you're looking for somewhere else. I doubt that you'll find it here, though!
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 11:19:08 (GMT)
From: Ex-Shroom
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: better get lost then.
Message:
Why do you make a fool of yourself saying stupid things? You don't have to respond to everybody. Why don't you make yourself a favor and just shut the fuck up and get on your way, NOW!
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:07:45 (GMT)
From: Sir David
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: You must be thick, Mushroom
Message:
You haven't got knowledge. You were never given it and you are exactly the same after apparently receiving it as you were before you thought you received something.

Those meditation techniques are public domain. Anyone can have them, just like anyone can practise any yoga which is written in books and the techniques are written in books and were, long before Maharaji came upon the scene.

Where did Maharaji get the techniques from? He copied them from standard yoga methods.

A person who has never received knowledge from Maharaji is no worse off than someone who has received Maharaji's supposed knowledge. Anyone can meditate on the techniques if they want to and they don't have to wait for permission from the fat master.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:43:29 (GMT)
From: Coach
Email: None
To: Sir David
Subject: Spooky or What?
Message:
Sir Dave,

'Thick' is exactly the word I used in a post above to describe this person. I didn't see your post. Spooky, huh?

The Outer Coach

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:58:32 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Coach
Subject: THAT synchronisity (nt)
Message:
z
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:28:25 (GMT)
From: SynCoach
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: It's a synch(nt)
Message:
sync
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:53:09 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: SynCoach
Subject: that's informal
Message:
sync or synch. Informal
n.
1.Synchronization: “an effect like that of stereo speakers slightly out of sync” (Time).
2.Harmony; accord: in sync with today's fashions.

Synchronization n. The act of synchronizing; concurrence of events in respect to time.

synchronize
v. intr.
1.To occur at the same time; be simultaneous.
2.To operate in unison.
v. tr.
1.a.To cause to occur or operate with exact coincidence in time or rate: We synchronized our watches.
b.To cause to occur or operate at the same time as something else: They synchronized their trip with the annual tulip festival.
2.To arrange (historical events) in a synchronism so as to indicate parallel occurrence.
3.To cause (soundtrack and action) to match exactly in a film.

synchronicity
1.The state or fact of being synchronous or simultaneous; synchronism.
2.Coincidence of events that seem to be meaningfully related, conceived in the theory of Carl Jung as an explanatory principle on the same order as causality.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:42:52 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Sir David
Subject: You must love denying your experience, Sir.
Message:
If they are are simply some standard yoga techniques, then why did you follow the Master for years? You did satsang, service, meditation and, yes, even darshan because of some ho-hum meditation techniques? Come on, get real, Sir! Maharaji has said many times that the techniques don't work without the Master. Of course now you deny the Master so I guess you don't subscribe to that one, eh? Of course, at one time, you did believe him, didn't you? Sounds like you're just trying to justify something to yourself now.

Since day one of receiving the techniques from Maharaji, who incidentally was in South America at the time, I've experienced that light. And it wasn't caused by pinching my optic nerve. I did not experience that self-effulgent light before Knowledge. I knew that it was Maharaji who was providing that light in my Knowledge session even though he was thousands of miles away. And I've experience that light and felt that peace many times since that day. You keep harping on the fact that they aren't Maharaji's techniques. Perhaps not. He didn't invent them. But he sure makes them come alive. And not through brainwashing. He never brainwashed me or hynotized me. Were you brainwashed or hynotized all those years following a mediocre meditation teacher? Or were you just a fool?

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:17:03 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: How do you know?
Message:

Maharaji has said many times that the techniques don't work without the Master.

So you DO believe some mumbo jumob is involved. A pwkie finally admits it.

I knew that it was Maharaji who was providing that light in my Knowledge session even though he was thousands of miles away.

How do you know this and by what mechanism could this happen?

... But he sure makes them come alive.

Again, how do you know? How do you know it's not you that make them come alive? Isn't that MUCH more likely?
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:25:25 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: G
Subject: How do you know when the sun is shining?
Message:
Because you feel it. You see the brilliance. You feel the warmth. And I tried many times to see light within me and to feel that peace. Couldn't get my mind to remain still long enough to do so. But when I listened to satsang, my mind slowed down. And after Knowledge, I could do it. I couldn't before. Maybe it was just me. But he sure hastened the process along.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:33:00 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: That's not what I asked.
Message:
I didn't ask you how you knew you experienced something.

Are you retracting your statements?

Do you think some mumbo jumbo is involved?

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 15:35:06 (GMT)
From: red butler
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Punjabi shoe shine
Message:
He had been discontent for days. Almost disconsolant. It was really starting to get to him. He leaned a chubby hairless arm against the great expanse of glass and stared out into the grey sea.

'I don't know how long I can hang on,' he thought. The fucking IRS assholes even had his lawyers worried. His lawyers worried! well HE was crapping his pants.

'I'd like to shit on those ex-premies,' he said out loud, instead, no doubt, of his $600 Armani shoes which where presently being ruined by the slow dribble of his incontinence.

'Maybe it is time to pack it in,' he thought. 'I always sleep better in India, anyway...'

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:54:09 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: G
Subject: If by mumbo-jumbo you mean some thing or
Message:
process that I don't know about, then yes. He does still say that he's a Master, doesn't he? And that something immortal lies within the heart of every human being? I don't know if that is mumbo-jumbo. I prefer to call it mysterious or even magical.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:54:08 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: the fungoid one
Subject: He denies being the 'Perfect Master'- how long til
Message:
...he denies being a Master?

On his website he says he's NOT a leader, doesn't he?

Will you continue to believe him then, Shroomy?

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:16:04 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: mumbo jumbo juju magic
Message:
So you know there is some thing or process that you don't know about?

Yes, he says that he's 'a Master', that doesn't make him one. He also says he's an ordinary human being.

One a scale of 1 to 10, where 1 is an ordinary human being and 10 is God, where would you place 'Maharaji'? Or do you think he goes up to 11?

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:20:42 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Just how stupid CAN a premie be?
Message:
If they are are simply some standard yoga techniques, then why did you follow the Master for years?

Did you really ask that question? Are you really THAT stupid? You people are acting like you're not even human, you're something less. I can't believe it.

The answer, Shroom, is that we were tricked.

Like, duuhh!

Yes, I know, you don't accept that explanation. But even you can't get away with arguing as if you didn't already have that answer. You've got it now, right? Signed, sealed, delivered: we were tricked!

Now what?

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:15:51 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: How stupid can one be? I guess if I was
Message:
'tricked' into receiving Knowledge and then 'tricked' into practicing it and then 'tricked' into giving years of my life with satsang, service and meditation and 'tricked' into believing he was God when the Knowledge was just ho-hum, then I'd feel pretty stupid. Fortunately, no one ever 'tricked' me. I practice because I want to. I listen because I enjoy doing so. I give because I want to help him. Trick or treat? To you it was a trick. To me, it is a treat. Yes, he's treating me to be a real human being and appreciate life itself. Without all the concepts. To me, if you're looking for peace, you can't be tricked. Either you feel it or you don't. I feel it.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 14:32:51 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Lard told you that, but is NOT true (nt)
Message:
no way
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:28:01 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: You just haven't faced the music, yet, Shroom
Message:
Shroom,

You were most definitely tricked. One day, if you're lucky, you'll realize it. Maybe not. A lot of people in cults die before they see what's what. You might be among them.

But maybe you will see the truth about Maharaji first in which case you will most definitely cry in your beer. I just hope I'm there to watch.

Now why should I be so seemingly mean to a fellow 'trickee' like myself? I don't know. Maybe because I despise what you guys have become. Or maybe it's just fun. I don't know. Whatever.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:47:43 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Well, that post wasn't too bad! But really Jim,
Message:
you do have a chip on your shoulder about him, don't you? After all, you said that you began weaning yourself from the 'cult' in 1981. That's almost 20 years ago. I've listened to him in person and on audio and video thousands of times since then. And I'm a very critical person like you seem to be. If I had seen or heard something from him that didn't ring true, I would have left long ago. But he knows something. I really don't care if anyone receives Knowledge or not. It's not easy to practice it. And his own brother, Rajaji, said that he is kind of arrogant. But I can't really complain about him. Every time I've heard him these last 18 plus years he's addressed something very special within me. I'm sorry you guys feel tricked. But I don't think Maharaji wants anyone to feel that way. Because I feel that with his help, we can all connect with that source within us. If he was just in it for the money, he wouldn't make such a relentless effort to offer it to others. It's free, but like others have said here, you have to really want it to get it now. It's probably a real pain in the ass having to deal with everything he has to deal with. Disgruntled ex-premies are just a small part of his aggravations, I'm sure.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 22:26:23 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: What is this? An S and M club?
Message:
What are you looking for, Shroom? What do you mean, 'that wasn't TOO bad'?

Listen, you're impossible to talk with. Nothing you say makes any sense. Anyone but a fellow cult fool would see through you in nanoseconds. You're not engaging us in good faith and there's no point to continue.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:07:20 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Excuse me Sir Dave.
Message:
Shroomananda, you remind me so much of what David Bailey wrote, that I thought you might find this interesting: from David Bailey's Journey: An 'ex' Sai Baba Devotee

Things I blindly accepted because I had been told they were so, did not stand up in the light of close scrutiny. Even the men in power around him, although they act out a role
of subservient adoration when in front of Sai Baba, play a different part away from him. On occasions I was with members of the inner circle, Mr Rao for example, in the
main office. Once, I had been sent by Swami for something and the reply he gave me ended with the words “Swami doesn’t know what he is talking about” (!) Yet they
perpetrate the idea that he knows everything.

 

Over this questioning span of many months I have had my share of indoctrination procedure from those in high places. While at the ashram, my very first queries brought
intense social interaction from an Indian inner circle member who, unknown and uninvited, visited Faye and me in our unit after almost every darshan for a week, to tell us
of the many wonders of Swami’s miraculous powers. Only later did we understand why he did this.

 

Once back home, when rumours were beginning to fly about our defection from the fold, I received several phone calls from long standing devotees from the VIP lines,
telling me that I had a problem. I had to decide if Sai Baba was God or not. If he was God, then he could do everything he wanted to anyone, sexually, fraudulently, drugs,
trickery etc, but of course if I did not accept him as God, then I had my own view of morals, and the laws of my land to follow.

 

For me there was no choice to make.

 

I know there are instances worldwide of people going to Prashanthi, and coming back with a new lease of life, but so do people who visit the many other gurus in India, or
Mother Meera, or Lourdes, and so on. My investigations into mind power find simple explanations for this.

 

If even only a handful of people sit quietly together to do Yoga meditation, circle work, or just to meditate, they expect and often get a lovely atmosphere, and sometimes,
healing happens.

 

Imagine the energy that might be generated by hundreds of people sitting quietly focused for an hour or two in darshan. Amongst these are probably some natural or
trained psychics, and natural or trained healers, as well as many people sitting still and focused for a lengthy period, perhaps for the first time in their lives. Different
experiences are bound to occur. Nothing to do with Sai Baba.

 

I think the ‘love-connection’ people experience is simply one connecting with one’s Self.

 

When one gets involved with Sai Baba, a very subtle brain washing commences. Sitting for hours in darshan is one of these. When one sees all around with hands in prayer
position, one naturally follows suite. Once attached and involved, common sense and logic progressively disappears, until one reaches the point of attributing every small
act of living to Sai Baba.

Why do foools fall in looove ... ?

 

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 00:26:24 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Vibhuti - Holy shit!
Message:
From the ex Sai Bubba page:

Vibhuti

During darshan, Sai Baba carries vibhuti in tablet form between the third and fourth fingers of his right hand, with spare tablets in the hand holding up his robe. He crushes a tablet when required, and transfers tablets during the taking of letters. I have watched this happen innumerable times. Once on the mandir porch he dropped a tablet in front of me, and told a member of the Trust to “Eat it Quickly!”

Tablet-palming can be clearly seen on many videos, if slowed down to frame-by-frame viewing, including in our wedding day interview video, used at the beginning of “God lives in India” This video has been removed from sale by the Trust.

Australian television, in it’s programme ’60 MINUTES’ (their equivalent of ‘PANORAMA’) showed how these ‘B grade’ conjuring tricks are done.

Vibhuti tablets explain why vibhuti distribution runs out in the interview room before everyone has had some.

All powder vibhuti is produced by roasting cow dung with sandal wood, and manufactured vibhuti bought elsewhere, is then double sieved by ladies of the ashram seva dal, before being packaged for interview room distribution.

Use of vibhuti on open wounds consistently causes infection in them; a fact commented by Faye to me when she was called to deal with people having these infections in the ashram.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 00:47:45 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Yes, there is a lot of (un)Holy shit flying!
Message:
Yes, G, I read that part too, but you know how people are about long posts sometimes - decided to pare it down to the section with the most similarities to m's trip. Yes, I used this text twice, and forgot to credit you this time. Do you see how those premies distract me from important things!

You know, I can't help but wonder; m must be approaching 'dirty old man' age in terms of some of the women who might fall for his line, but I guess everyone still sees that as OK for a man, even a 'meditation teacher' or whatever.

Stonor

BTW, in a post to Jim, you used 'effect' instead of 'affect' (or vice versa). I know you know the difference, and you're probably just baiting me, but beware the sharpened pointer - that's one of Schoolmarm Stonor's pet peeves, that one!

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:07:06 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Schoolmarm Stonor
Subject: effect vs affect
Message:
You don't need to credit me.

As to 'effect' vs 'affect', yes, I know the difference but I mix them up. To be honest I wasn't baiting you, I stand corrected. But instead of writing some phrase on the blackboard fifty times, I'll provide links to their definitions:

effect

affect

Thank you for correcting me Ms. Stonor.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:24:52 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: G
Subject: effect vs affect
Message:
Don't they teach you kids anything these days? With these new fangled gizmos like the one I'm typing on here, you can get those lines done lickety split! Just copy and paste, paste, paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,paste, paste,

OK, I think you've got the idea. And don't bug me about the punctuation. ALSO, be careful with that 'Yes, Ms. Stonor' stuff, Mr. G - you'll start giving Sir Dave and hamzen the wrong idea! You know, 'teachers' have also been the targets of some dubious male projections, no matter what colour their hair! ;-)

Stonor

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:22:21 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Let's not forget something here, Stonor. By your
Message:
own admission, you are a non-anything. You have not received Knowledge. You don't know what it is or isn't. So what gives you the ability to decide who is a fool or not about this topic? You might have some credibility if you had Knowledge. But you don't, do you? So please don't call me a fool unless you are prepared to be called one too!
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:33:14 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: I did NOT call you a fool, Shroom
Message:
And it's funny the way you premies one minute say that 'knowledge' is not the only possible source of 'whatever-it-is' and then turn around and say it is. I've been through this with Dog and other premies, even a few recentexes, before. I didn't write the Bailey text, I only asked the question at the end, Shroom, and you are free to ask yourself your own questions. Do you know why fools fall in love? And don't you find the similarities between David Bailey's and many other 'exes' the same? And don't you sound like his 'former' friends from the Sai Baba community? I might not know exactly what your 'knowledge' involves, because I understand that it's a lot more than just receiving some meditation techniques right? It's more like some kind of whole package deal, isn't it? Baby and the dirty bathwater or something like that, I suppose.

Stonor

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:44:05 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Why don't you find out for yourself instead of
Message:
relying on second hand information? Then you can throw out the dirty bathwater and keep the baby! It's not a package deal. Knowledge involves turning your outward going senses back inside. That's it. Either it works or it doesn't. But you'll never know without investigating it yourself. Try it you might like it. And if it wasn't your cup of tea, you could talk about it here with some credibility. As it is, you're just guessing.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:48:10 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: You're still just assuming. And, good night :) (nt
Message:
What IS your problem?
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:53:47 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: I don't have a problem, lady. You were the one
Message:
who replied to my post. Remember? You were the one who 'butted' in with your uninformed opinion saying:

why do foooools fall in loooove? Remember? Who's making assumptions here?

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 10:09:25 (GMT)
From: sb
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: I don't have a problem, lady. You were the one
Message:
Are you going to answer at least one of mine? Fool!!
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:31:20 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: And you're not even an 'ex' Sai Baba student
Message:
either, are you? My what balls you have lady, excuse the expression! Don't know about Maharaji's Knowledge or Sai Baba's Knowledge but you call me a fool? You take the cake! I guess it's easy to sit on the sidelines and comment about the game. But you should know something about it first, don't you think?
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 15:44:43 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Secretary
Subject: Sai Baba's 'Knowledge'
Message:
You think that child molester also has a 'Knowledge'? You're more deluded than I thought.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:14:05 (GMT)
From: Michael
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Make up your mind.
Message:
Shroom, you gripe if someone didn't receive the so-called knowledge and speaks against it, and you whine and gripe if someone DID receive the so-called knowledge speaks against it. Look, you are flailing about here. If this so-called knowledge works so well for you, write a little poem for ELK. I think that you are trying so hard to convince yourself that your experience is real, but it seems as if you are beginning to have doubts; why else do you work so hard to try and convince us it is real? We no longer believe that stuff.
Look, every little kid who rubs their eyes in their dark bedroom sees that light, okay? You did too, but you want to believe that M is the source of it. It is just your optic nerve. If you are so full of peace, set up a little shroomy website where you can print Sri Hans' satsangs and tell everyone how much you enjoy listening to M and practicing his knowledge.
Don't tell us who has credibility here; you never had any on this site. Now, write something nasty about Christians.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:30:24 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Michael
Subject: The early Christians were called 'Christines'.
Message:
When have I griped about someone speaking about Knowledge who has Knowledge? I've expressed a difference of opinion but I acknowledge their right to express it. I have made fun of the whining and complaining by ex-premies but not about the specific opinions.

Let me ask you. If someone called you a fool for being a Christian without first investigating what Christianity really was all about, wouldn't you challenge that person? I know you've challenged me.

As far as the optic nerve is concerned, I thought you were told about the pineal gland in the old days. As Descartes said once, 'The pineal gland is the seat of the soul'. But the light I've seen in meditation is not the light that one sees by pressing the optic nerve. Maybe it was for you but not for me. The light I'm talking about dances inside me. Sometimes I've seen it while doing the first technique, sometimes when doing the 2nd, 3rd or 4th technique. Sometimes I don't see it. But I know it's there because I've seen and felt it before. And if you are a Christian, correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't it say in John that God is light and in him there is no darkness? Are you afraid of the light, Michael?

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:34:29 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Shroomananda
Subject: The early Christians were called 'Christines'.
Message:
The light I'm talking about dances inside me. Sometimes I've seen it while doing the first technique, sometimes when doing the 2nd, 3rd or 4th technique. Sometimes I don't see it. But I know it's there because I've seen and felt it before.

Maybe they are all right, after all, and you ARE thick. It's beginning to look that way, Shroom.

Forget the pineal crap (neuroscience has come a LONG way in the last twenty years).

So, because it 'dances inside you', it isn't just your brain doing something that brains can do...

And therefore Maharaji is the Lord..?

How about your dreams at night: the vivid ones where whole realities are conjured out of nowhere in glorious 3-D perspective..

Is that Maharaji too?

How about your thoughts? The stuff going on and churning over right now in that head of yours...

Are they Maharaji's gift?

Your blinkered cult perspective does you no credit, pal. You may not be stupid in real life, but your words sure give that impression.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:54:37 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: All I can say is that I didn't see that light
Message:
within me before I received Knowledge. But that's not the only reason, you know. It's a complete package. Now I can feel peace and stillness and that experience that gives me tranquility, contentment and that wholeness. But you're entitiled to your opinion and your experience. I'm sure it's true for you. Did you ever see that light within you when you still practiced? If so, did you see it before you received Knowledge as well?
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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 02:51:57 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Shroomananda
Subject: All I can say is that I didn't see that light
Message:
Did you ever see that light within you when you still practiced? If so, did you see it before you received Knowledge as well?

Yes and yes. I had been into meditation for a couple of years, but Maharaji promised me a short-cut to 'God-realisation' and I took the bait. Experiences after no better or worse than before, but I believed for years that the best was yet to come, once I had finally surrendered properly.

And even having those experiences doesn't mean light isn't just your brain dancing inside you, and just because you didn't see it before, doesn't mean you'll stop seeing it on the day you renounce the guru for a charlatan.

You're still not thinking straight on this at all, Shroom, are you?

Imagine, for a moment, you could just shrug off this 'whole package' concept - yes CONCEPT - remember them? and enjoy whatever it is you enjoy, y'know the peace and stillness and that experience that gives me tranquility, contentment and that wholeness - all that stuff which is so good you prefer to spent hours every night talking to us... (Go figure!)

...yeah, just imagine all that without having to listen to a poorly-educated, highly repetitious, fabulously wealthy fat person talk bullshit.

Sounds even better to me. Don't you reckon?

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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 01:16:16 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: saw the light all the time as a kid
Message:
Pressed my eyeballs and there it was, along with the accompanying euphoria. I used to do it when they made me take naps.

And also closed my eyes while in labor with my first child and
was bathed in white light same euphoria. Still not a premie at the time.

It seems to be a biochemically related high.
That isn't really the point though.

Because no matter what it is, it isn't M's exclusive property. He is a fraud and got away with millions of dollars in the process.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 03:13:09 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: But I enjoy listening to him speak more than
Message:
anything else. To me, it started with satsang and satsang remains the most precious part of Knowledge. And after listening to the most recent satellite event on Sunday, man can that guy give satsang!
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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 10:46:14 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Shroo, one of the realisations I had since
Message:
becoming an ex-premie (and mind you, while I was a premie too, but I only fully acknowledged the true reality of it while an ex) was that satsang is like a 'happy-shot' that you need to take to sustain your life as a premie.

Tell me this. Do you feel invigorated once you go to see a video or hear a program and hear satsang? Are these the high periods? Do they provide clarity, whereas inbetween times, you slip back into unconsciousness? Do you feel back on track once you hear him speak? Are you reminded of your heart and what life is all about during a video? Do you feel lighter than light and all is OK with the world after another satsang?

Well, if you do. So did I. And that, my friend (as the Cubans say) is the exact same affect a heroin junkie feels once they've taken a hit. Face it. You are addicted to it, and reliant (in a bad way I have to say) to Maharaji as a liquid human heroin. You need Maharaji to make you feel good about yourself because that is what the brainwashing has done.

Shroom, do you worry about your survival without Maharaji? Do you believe you can ever have these highs without his intervention or place in your life? If so, you are in the same state a junkie is, one we've all been through, and one that is a hell of a relief to get out of and be free off. Truly. And like the classic 12 steps, the first one is to admit that you have an addiction, that addiction is not conducive to being a well-balanced human being and that you need help and resolve to get out of it.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 17:38:56 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: TD
Subject: Yeah, I confess, I'm addicted to listening to
Message:
Maharaji. And thanks for all your concern but I will continue to do so as long as he keeps talking and I keep breathing. Of course if I ever do feel like I need help, I won't come to you guys or a twelve-step program. When he stops inspiring me, I'll stop listening to him. Of course, in the hundreds if not thousands of times I've listened to him, I've never walked away disappointed. So the possibility that I will stop listening seems pretty remote at this point. As a matter of fact, I just got my satellite dish and am in the process of installing it. I look forward to indulging my 'addiction' many more times! God willing.
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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 00:15:38 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Yeah, I confess, I'm addicted to taking heroin
Message:
I've just substituted the word Heroin in your paragraph for Maharaji so you can see my point. And least a junkie knows how bad his addiction is for him/her...

And thanks for all your concern but I will continue to do so as long as I can get smack and I keep breathing. Of course if I ever do feel like I need help, I won't come to you guys or a twelve-step program. When heroin stops working for me, I'll stop taking it. Of course, in the hundreds if not thousands of times I've jagged smack, I've never walked away not on a high. So the possibility that I will ever stop taking Harry Horse seems pretty remote at this point. As a matter of fact, I just got my hyperdermic needle and am in the process of injecting. I look forward to indulging my 'addiction' many more times! God willing.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 01:00:37 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: TD
Subject: TD you crack me up (bad pun I know)
Message:
Just could not resist it though.
Hey Shroom wants to have visitors at his satellite broadcasts and it's really nice in SD right now.

Too bad I wasted my time there a few weeks ago. All *I* did was relax, go to the beach listen to local music. And visit friends.
We ex's don't know what we are missing. Got any left?

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 07:47:46 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: please can you repeat what he said please?
Message:
Exactly what inspired you?
word for word? o no
I know it isn't the words, it's the experience.

but, if you would just for me Shroom can U please repeat a bit
of the words of M??

Thanks. Lost and thirsting in the desert of ignorance - Selene
---
ps sorry I ever thought you were a fake or anything. Jim has proven you are a true premie.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 17:43:44 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: I didn't write anything down, Selene, but why
Message:
don't you get it from the horse's mouth, so to speak? Secondhand information always pales in comparison to the actual person speaking. I could never present it the way he does. Even if I had an actual transcript!
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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 18:22:39 (GMT)
From: Selenie the BiTcH
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: alas none of the premies will talk to me
Message:
Or let me in anything anywhere.

Seems my reputation is ruined forever.
Some forgiving guru. teacher. leader. speaker. whatever. :
Some
non forgiving whatever put his security to work and I am doomed.
Hey I got an idea. You live in San Diego. We could neet and you could get me in.

Now don't agree to this and then cop out and not meet me.
I make a LOT of money in one day, lost wages, etc. would be awful for me.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 20:24:09 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Selenie the BiTcH
Subject: Hey, I can do better than that. I just got my own
Message:
satellite dish. Let me know when you're going to be in town. I'll even pick you up at the airport. Just give me some notice. There is a satellite broadcast every Sunday at 1 pm my time and a repeat on Thursday at 5 pm. I'll even prepare a feast for you if you want. Actually, I work on Sundays so if you want to come then, let me know. You'll have the whole place to yourself. Just let me call in before the broadcast so I can get a 'phone feed'. I know that I can view it on the Thursday re-broadcast, but since my work is rather boring, I like to listen when I can. If you're coming, let me know if you are a vegetarian or not. I like to accomodate my guest's preferences. I make a great salad but if you eat meat, I can fire up the barbecue!
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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 21:55:08 (GMT)
From: S tHe B
Email: None
To: Shroomie
Subject: Hey, I can do better than that.
Message:
ooooooooooo.
I am there baby.

Anything is fine as far as food. I don't really like to eat when I am away from home. I'm always worried that I will get fat.

But I insist all plans be made in public, right here on forum for all to see. You never know. A girl has to be careful these days, there are a lot of crazies out there. And I have been a tad bit provocative, oh I mean I have been a BiTcH.
I was bad bad bad bad bad.
Not sure how, but I was, and I need to hear M to soothe my soul.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 23:45:26 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: S tHe B
Subject: I always seem to attract the bad girls. Must be
Message:
one of my patterns. You do sound provocative. But I don't know about this anti-Maharaji bit. Everyone's entitled to their own opinions. I would never try to convert anyone. To me, it's a matter of personal choice and responsibility. But one of things I'll probably never figure out is why some people love to listen to him, like me, and others just squirm in their seats. Let me know if you're serious. I have a feeling if I met face-to-face with one or more of you 'ex' premies that it would be a different dynamic than this impersonal hollering at one and other that is done here. In any case, take good care of yourself.
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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 04:55:28 (GMT)
From: Michael
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: I would never try to convert anyone.-Shroomananda
Message:
Shroomananda: 'I would never try to convert anyone.'
If I remember (and I do) you posted that you first heard of this site because you gave a tape to some Christian guy at work and he looked up this site and rejected M and the tapes (and he quoted Bible verses to you also,but all premies seem to like to do that too). Now, be honest, weren't you trying to convert that person? Isn't that why you were disappointed and posted that he must not have been a serious spiritual seeker as he didn't have any interest in M? That sounds as if you were trying to convert to me.
Do you want to re-think that statement?
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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 06:03:23 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Michael
Subject: I thought you weren't talking to me anymore,
Message:
Preacher! I know that I wasn't talking to you in this post that you responded to. You must have too much time on your hands! Especially since this post is so far down in the stack! And I thought you worked on Wednesday. Must have been a short sermon, huh? Did you 'convert' anyone tonight? Or was it the already converted that you preached to? Just curious...

But I don't mind answering you, especially if you want specifics. The guy I gave a video to was named John. He worked out every morning at the YMCA in downtown San Diego when I did at 7 am. One of his arms was cut off at the elbow (I never asked him why) and he was a lawyer and a Christian. We talked about Christianity and its doctrine and dogma and my main point to him, like I make to most of the Christians I talk to, is that they should read other scriptures. He said that he had studied Hinduism and Buddhism and had concluded that Christ was the answer. That he had died on the cross for my sins, etc., etc, ad nauseum. After a while, I told him that I had a teacher. He asked some questions about Maharaji along theological lines and rather than try to answer for Maharaji, I gave him a video.

Now when I give someone a video, it's between them and Maharaji. If they are interested, then I'm happy to point the way. If not, fine. This guy went on line, found this site and started bombarding me with questions. He wanted to know why you guys felt like you do about Maharaji. I told him that I didn't really know but that I thought you all were idiots. He not only printed out a lot of the stuff on this site, but he put together a bunch of bible quotes (about sin, about repentence, about Jesus being the only way to God, etc.) and then put it all together in a binder along with about 30 questions of his own. I looked at it briefly and saw that he was trying to convert me and basically had no intention of investigating Maharaji's Knowledge. So I wished him well, got my video back and just went back to saying 'Hi' when I saw him and not engaging in any further conversation about Maharaji or religion.

So the way I see that encounter is that I was doing what Maharaji has asked me and others who like him and his Knowledge: presenting him with a video. I wasn't trying to convert him. I don't really care if anyone receives Knowledge. That's between them and him. But he was trying to convert me. Does that satisfy your curiousity?

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Date: Fri, Aug 18, 2000 at 11:52:58 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: I thought you weren't talking to me anymore,
Message:
Shroo,
I think it strange that a real enthusiast like yourself is denied the opportunity to express your experience in your own inimmitable way to an interested person. You speak about it all here but you won't do anything other than hand someone a video of ol' boring Maha ! Don't you find it peculiar that Maha has supposedly given you something so enlightening but doesn't trust you at all to say anything about it ?

To me it seems that he has taken away your spiritual light and made you his slave. Don't you want to be YOU and not a robot who he considers unworthy?

Very fucking strange the way he operates IMO

Hal

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Date: Fri, Aug 18, 2000 at 19:09:36 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: I did say a few things about my own experience,
Message:
Hal. Like the stillness, peace and love I've experienced. But as far as the theological questions and specific questions about Knowledge and Maharaji, I think he does a much better job. After all, he's the Master. I'm just a student.
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Date: Fri, Aug 18, 2000 at 20:56:52 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Shroo , with a bit of practice and with loads of
Message:
people looking at you in absolute adoration and maybe without a master who tells you that you can't do it only he can. Well I think you'd do just as good a job. You know some of the premies were much more inspiring to me in the old days that Maha and his instructors. Actually a couple of them are posting on this forum now as exes. First few times I saw Maha speak in his squeeky little boys voice it did zilch for me. I was conditioned into an appreciation for him later on. Now I find him boring and unclear. You really like those hotel room events jut watching him over and over say the same things? Wow ! Ok I guess some people like trainspotting too,

Hal

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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 13:13:14 (GMT)
From: Michael
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Did you tell him Maharaji's a pilot? NT
Message:
That might have worked, Nightwatchman.
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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 17:07:03 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Michael
Subject: No, I didn't. I don't think that would have made
Message:
a difference in that situation. Do you?
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:37:45 (GMT)
From: Michael
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: The early Christians were called 'Christines'.
Message:
The pineal gland stuff the DLM people told us back in the '70s was crap just like everything else they told us. You are so extremely thick. Look, I think you have no friends and you just come here for attention. You certainly aren't doing your Lord and Master any good. I explained to you once before: don't take verses from the Bible out of context to give your cult credibility. You can scare up maybe five verses total, and all of them out of context (and usually from the KJV, so they aren't even the best translation) and it proves nothing. It's time for you to take a rest from this site; you have worn out your welcome when you have Sir Dave tired of you!
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 08:57:56 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: Michael
Subject: The early Christians were called 'Christines'.
Message:
If you are a christian, Michael, why are you so interested in the people here and Knowledge?
Do you have doubts about your own preachings?. Dosn`t the book satisfie you anymore?. I tell you: The door to Knowledge is always open. Why not try it again. Maybe you will find some peace. I don`t think you will find that in a stupid book.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 14:55:50 (GMT)
From: Michael
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Have you been paying attention?
Message:
Kjarne,
If you have been paying any attention at all to the conversations, you will understand that I am an ex-premie and I come here to talk with other ex-premies. When a premie makes a studpid statement about Christianity, I correct them. I am happy, I have a good life, and I don't waste my time squeezing my eyeballs and calling it a spiritual discipline.
I think that using the term Knowledge for those four meditation techniques is studpid; why not call it opticmanipulation yoga?
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 15:01:46 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: Michael
Subject: Have you been paying attention?
Message:
Michael, I am sorry. It was not my meaning to hurt you.
I respect the christians. Sorry about my post to you.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:58:36 (GMT)
From: Sir David
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: That really says it all, doesn't it
Message:
She doesn't have to be an ex-anything to call you a fool or anything else. People are not subdivided into your own little pigeon holes which are inside your head.

I'm sure anyone can call you a fool. They don't have to have received THAT knowledge in order to do so.

Mr Mushroom, I do declare that you really do believe in these cult classifications. Stonor is a fellow human. That's good enough for me.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:12:18 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Sir David
Subject: Fair enough. But I wonder what your response
Message:
would have been if she disagreed with your perspective and called you a fool. Would you feel the same way if she had labeled you a fool for being an ex-premie without having received Knowledge herself? Just curious...
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:40:18 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: You assume a great deal Shroom, and ...
Message:
You assume a great deal Shroom, and beautifully illustrate my last post to you with this second response!
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:48:15 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: So did I assume wrong, Stonor, or are you a former
Message:
student of Sai Baba? If so, I apologize. But it seems to me that you are assuming an awful lot yourself since you've never received Knowledge. What's your story? Why do you like to comment on something you've never experienced? Aren't you making assumptions about Knowledge?
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:02:29 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Secretary
Subject: assumptions
Message:
You're assuming that if someone hasn't 'received Knowledge' than they couldn't know anything about it. That is based on the mumbo jumbo idea that Prem Rawat, 'an ordinary human being' according to the EV web site, somehow with some super duper psychic power is able to 'reveal Knowledge' to someone, and that without him, a person is totally lost in 'darkness'. He would have to know that someone thousands of miles away is 'receiving Knowledge' and transmit this power to the person. It basically assumes that he is greater than God, even though he's 'an ordinary human being'. So tell me, do you think he's greater than God?

Followers of other gurus say the same sort of stuff about their gurus. There's a lot of one-and-only 'Masters' running around.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:08:48 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Shroom
Subject: for butting in ... above post to Shroom (nt)
Message:
for butting in ... above post to Shroom (nt)
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:56:20 (GMT)
From: Sir David
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: You must love being a parrot
Message:
I was misled, as I've already stated. I followed Maharaji because I was led to believe that I should do, by other premies. I was duped into believing he was the Lord. In short, I was brainwashed.

The techniques work just the same without following Maharaji. My main experience of Ketchari Mudra which is the old nectar technique came about in 1984 when I had long ceased following Maharaji.

Meditation on the breath is nothing new or unique. It is taught by meditation teachers the world over as is also listening to music and light etc (without poking oneself in the eye).

I can say, with hand on heart, that the techniques have absolutely nothing to do with Maharaji. He never actually inspired me to do them. All he harped on about is devotion to him all of the time and never a mention of meditation.

I surrendered my life to him when I moved into the ashram and guess what? My meditation went out of the window.

But what do you know? You were never a fully committed premie who tried to surrender to Maharaji. And now you're just a parrot.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 09:35:18 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: Sir David
Subject: Go for a knowledge -rewiew, sir Dave.
Message:
Sir Dave wrote: Meditation on your breath is nothing new or unique. It is taught by meditationteachers the world over.

Kjarne writes:

I think you should go for a knowledgerewiew, because the technique is not to meditate on your breath.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 10:52:44 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Not so and never again will I go there!
Message:
I have had at least eight knowledge reviews since I first received knowledge in 1972. I've got deep into meditation on what is now called the third technique and also the last one.

You are trying to make out there's something I've missed. I haven't. I got knowledge reviews with the 'So Hung' as a mantra and supposedly as a sound, none of which I found useful and I've got knowledge reviews where it was suggested just follow the breath. In fact, in my knowledge session in 1972, Prakash Bai Ji made no mention of any So Hung mantra.

When it all boils down to it, it is just meditation on the breath which can get deeper if one gets into it and can still the mind (not always) and I have got very deep into this, as has Jim, Bill Burke and numerous others here.

There is not anything which is revealed in the knowledge session. There is nothing else to learn. I could never sit in the same room as Maharaji, let alone listen to him and follow his advice. You can, if you want to, imagaine yourself sitting on a swing and do all manner of things. The breath is just the breath though and you cannot make it into something secret or unique.

If a person meditates on it then what they experience will be unique to them. That is the nature of personal experience, of which Maharaji has clearly none in the meditation department.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:54:17 (GMT)
From: jondon
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Well put
Message:
Very well put. I often get the same feeling when I'm around Premies. I know of 2 who went to Amaroo. They had the shitiest time of their life (literally). But when they are around other premies they tell them about how blissed out they were and about the wonderful world M has planned to create down in Australia. Which is funny, because I don't think M even has an idea what he's going to do with Amaroo. And they agreed, the food sucked. One guy got dysentery and was sick for weeks after.
Whatever.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:32:45 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: jondon
Subject: Amaroo and la Tierra
Message:
I went to Amaroo and la Tierra del L'Amour (in Argentina). At both places there were flies. At Amaroo there is the burning subtropical sun, not for Rawat though, he was shaded. They warned about poisonous snakes. The food sucked at both places and was sold in open tents where flies landed on the food. At Amaroo we practiced the techniques in an open former cow pasture. None of the negatives were mentioned in the promotional videos.

At la Tierra, there was a tremendous amount of mud; it was mainly a mud field. Videos were shown in big tents and the chairs were sinking into the mud. A 'Knowledge' review was given in little huts with damp floors. The video promoting it didn't show all that, it only showed the area around the trees and even made that area out to be far better than it was. Rawat hardly spoke to the pwkies at all and when he did he talked about ethereal mumbo jumbo. There was a very long walk to the bus, through mud. To avoid that, you could rent a tent for $300+ and then maybe you could see him more. I remember thinking, boy, he's not getting his feet wet, no siree.

At neither place was there much love at all shown between the pwkies, the emotional atmosphere seemed rather cold.

I remember Rawat talking about one of these land projects, he said regarding buying one of the lands 'It was cheap.' Yes, I agree, very cheap. He's not cheap when it comes to spending money on materialistic luxury for himself, the 106 foot yacht, the expensive watches and cars, mansions, Gulfstream IV, etc.

I remember one rationalle for these lands was that they would provide a place where pwkies could 'practice Knowledge' without distraction (from 'the world' I suppose). Well, I found all the mud, flies, long walks, long flights, burning sun, and shitty food quite distracting. I also wonder, why these locations? They are so remote. Even if they were beautiful, how often could people get to them?

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 21:00:27 (GMT)
From: sb
Email: None
To: G
Subject: La Tierra
Message:
I was there! What a horrible messy time. Three days long program and it rained every single day. Everybody was muddy, tired and no place were to go.

The food was disgusting and extra expensive. I paid $2.00 for a coke that probably cost EV 75 cents.

Getting to the program was a nightmare as it was getting off the land. We had to walk many, many blocks to get out of the place, every day, but ass Lard came and went in his jeep, comfortable, when mothers were dragging literally their children through the mud, walking miles to get their cars. He definetly does not care about people, children. This went on every day.

What a horrible experience. All the way from the US for what?

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:18:01 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: sb
Subject: Horribly disappointed
Message:
Yes, I was so disappointed, and yet I still didn't 'leave' Rawat. Discussing all this really does help clarify things.

A lot of the rationalization of it involved the concept that he was 'testing' us. That making the whole thing difficult somehow enhanced the 'path', made us more 'thirsty'. That by having to grovel and put up with his shit, that made us more 'humble' and more open to 'His Grace'. I remember someone saying that Roger Ji said that 'Knowledge' was a 'path of pain'. I was befuddled at the time, but I think I'm understanding better what he really meant.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:40:41 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Amaroo
Message:
I didn't have the bad karma to go to Argentina, but Amaroo was enough, believe me. Yes, the hot sun, and the food sucked. Plus, it took forever to even get there. Then, while I was there, it really sucked, and I felt like I was stuck in that miserable concentration camp and couldn't get out because I was fucking thousands of miles from civilization. We could have committed mass suicide there an no one would have known for weeks. What a nightmare.

Maharaji kept talking about how wonderful the place was, and I kept wondering if he was in the same god forsaken place. But, like you said, he was in the lap of luxury at all times and didn't have to suffer any of the inconveniences. The premies just made me sick they had such odd looks on their faces and said such inane stuff. I don't know if it was the food or the premies that made me so sick.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 12:42:45 (GMT)
From: Ben Doon
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo, 20 KLMs from Brisbane.
Message:
You must be daft. You can leave anytime you wish. Maybe you got lost and attended a One Nation rally? Was the food Greasy Fish and Chips sold by a Red headed Blood Nut Super Bitch called Pauline Hansen.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:35:31 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Ben Doon
Subject: Amaroo is a Hell Hole
Message:
So, what is your point? Amaroo is in the middle of nowhere in the baking heat, heat I thought was not possible to experience on planet Earth. Bugs, snakes, dust, dirt and shitty food. I'm not surprised the land was cheap The food gave me the shits and I paid through the nose to sleep in a tent. The premies were the worst part of it. Their cult-faces made me ill. From the minute I got there I wanted to leave, which, if you wanted to walk to miles in the burning heat, I guess you could. The 'event' was about as enjoyable as the Nuremberg Trials.

And I do not consider 'Ipswich', which had all the charm and amenities of a desert ghost town, to constitute 'civilization.'

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 02:36:01 (GMT)
From: Chips Rafferty
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo is really quite comfortable.
Message:
So where do you come from . I can assure you that Southern Queensland enjoys a relatively mild climate. For instance it often gets much hotter in Melbourne and Adelaide. Australia gets a lot tougher than Amaroo. Try Central Australia or the Kimberlys if you want to really fry. You sound very pampered. Did you personally meet any Snakes ? (Real ones!) Bugs . Did you get bitten? What by? We Australians dont consider Brisbane a civilised city. More like a big country town. So what's your point . What the hell did you expect? And cool it with the Jones Town bullshit. If some-one asked me to kill myself , I'd quickly top them , WHOEVER they were. That's just bullshit! By the way , have you ever been to Africa? Tetse flies,Hippo's,Mamba's? Malaria ,Flesh eating parasites? Oh and the jungles of South America? Need I start. Get over it.
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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 17:32:46 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Chips Rafferty
Subject: Amaroo is a cult snake pit...
Message:
I'm not saying Australia is all god-foresaken, and I think I've been clear that the worst thing about Amaroo was that it was populated by a bunch of mindless cult members and a mindless cult leader named Maharaji. I was offended by the blatant merchandising, elitism of the jet-set premies, and the money-making rip-off of it all. And yes, the food sucked, it was fucking boiling hot, it was dusty and buggy and I had a miserable time. What did I expect? Anything but what I got, that's what.

Again, I don't understand why Maharaji felt compelled to have people spend thousands of dollars and fly to the ends of the Earth to have an 'event' in the middle of nowhere. It makes no sense, unless he is running from something, or he feels he has to get out of the sights of the rest of the world so his cult can do its thing, like having all the cult members kiss his feet, and to rip them off for lots of cash. I was offended and completely turned off by the whole thing.

The only reason you don't see the same things I did was because you, like some other people I know, are a fucking mindless cult-zombie. You are the one who should get over it.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 00:08:20 (GMT)
From: Zelman Cohen
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo is a Conference Centre in the Bush
Message:
The only reason I don't say what you are saying is because to me this is home. He comes to visit me(and my friends) and you were invited along as well. Get over it you superficial .......
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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 00:18:43 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Zelman Cohen
Subject: Amaroo is a Conference Centre in Hell
Message:
Oh this is rich. You agree that the place is hellish, and that it's in the middle of nowhere and costs a fortune to get there, but that's okay because you already live there, in hell. Well, I feel sorry for you, but then I think anywhere premies congregate with Maharaji is hell, whether it's that pit in Amaroo, or someplace that is actually livable without the aid of drugs.
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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 15:12:01 (GMT)
From: Sir Les Patterson
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo is in the Greatest little country in the w
Message:
Settle Gretel . Drop over for a Latte and Penne with Pesto sauce. Take in a few rays. Go for a surf. Fresh fruit- What fucking planet are you from?
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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 16:41:40 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Sir Les Patterson
Subject: Amaroo is Cult Encampment
Message:
In between your flag-waving, you might realize that I never said there was anything wrong with Australia. It's a perfectly fine country with, by and large, upstanding people. But it does contain Amaroo, which, if it wasn't populated with mindless-zombie cultists, and an infantile, fat, cult-leader who gets off on grubbing money and having a couple thousand people kiss his feet, might be okay under the right circumstances.

The planet I am from is the one with normal, rational people who aren't taken in by a cult-scam. You might try visiting it sometime.

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Date: Fri, Aug 18, 2000 at 22:42:46 (GMT)
From: A Seasoned Traveller
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo is Cult Encampment
Message:
Put simply ,you managed to walk out. What IS your problem. Your Choice in the first place. When I go to India I dont expect to find the court of Kublah Khan as my destination. Take some personal responsibility
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 09:17:08 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo/ Complaining!!
Message:
A Former Aspirant wrote:

Then, while I was there, it really sucked, and I felt like I was stuck in a miserable consentration camp and couldn`t get out because I was fucking thousands of miles from civilization.

See what I mean when I say that you are a real complainer?

Amaroo is 10 km from the town of Ipswich,number of inhabitants 100.000 and 50 km from the town of Brisbane, number of inhabitans 1,5 million. I am shure that some premie would be glad to drive you to some of this places if you wanted to.

No, its much easier to complain about everything isn`t it.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 23:07:20 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Complaining about your complaining about his ...
Message:
I feel it is my duty to complain about your complaining about his complaining. If you think complaining is wrong, than why are you complaining about his complaining?
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:41:16 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Amaroo/ Complaining!!
Message:
Have you ever BEEN to Amaroo? What a fucking, barren, lifeless place. Has it rained there in the past 200 years? Does the temperature ever go below 110 degress in the shade? IS there any shade? I sure didn't see it. And Maharaji didn't seem to care that we were all developing melanoma baking in the covection oven, which Amaroo is, while he was air-conditioned and shaded, the little bugger. It was a horrible experience.

Like I said above, if I wanted to hike about 10 miles from Amaroo, I might have made it to a parched ghost town, but what was I going to do there? I only wish I had brought drugs so I could have numbed myself to the wretched experience until it was finally, and mercifully, over. It took me a week to recover from the heat exhaustion and diahrea after I got back to the land of living humans.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 08:30:36 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo and premies
Message:
So strange. because a found Amaroo to be one of the most beautifull places I have ever seen, and I have seen a lot.
Is this your way to get out your anger because you did`nt recive Knowledge?
You also say that you had alternative feelings about Maharaji and the premies as animals and ghouls and that you see them as craven, gutless cowards.

If you read the ex-premies journeys here, you will see that most of the people say that premies are very nice people.I think so too.
I belive, my friend, that you are that kind of person that complains about evereything. If things don`t go your way, it is everebody elses fault exept yours.
You have a lot to learn, and I think people like you have to learn it the hard way.
Good luck next time!.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:46:32 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Amaroo and premies
Message:
Well, your idea of what is 'beautiful' and my idea couldn't be more different. And what is the point of making people fly to one of the most remote areas on Earth for that fucking event? What was the point? What, are major cities in civilized countries too weird for Maharaji? What is it with him?

No, I didn't receive knowledge because I never want to be anything like those zombie creatures that are premies. And because Maharaji is a replusive insect. His squeaky voice alone made me nuts. I have one good thing to say about Amaroo, though. Being confined in a concentration camps with a bunch of cult members who swooned over a litte fat guy who doesn't say anything of any value that isn't said by a third grader, made me want to hurl my lunch and get as far away from that scene as possible. Seeing the premie creatures in an entire cult habitat, made me see just how sick and weird that cult is.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 16:55:29 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo and premies
Message:
You say that you would not receive knowledge because you would not be like the zombielike premies.

Why did you go to Amaroo then?

By the way, Maharaji have a lot of programs i major cities all over the world where knowledge is given.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:07:02 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Amaroo and premies
Message:
I went because I was gullible and stupid, and because these premies told me it would be great. Where I live the premies are pretty strange. They are like robots at the videos, but I thought maybe that was just here, and maybe if I got around more premies and around Maharaji I might see it differently. WRONG! I was right the first time, and the rest of the premies aren't much different. All I did was waste thousands of dollars to sit around in the desert and get sick. Forgive me if I am not happy about that.

And they were selling fucking playing cards and jewelry for god's sake! What is that about? And then, they had the premies line up and kiss his fucking feet!!! That really threw me for a loop. I never heard of anything so weird in my life.

Then, the premies tell me it's MY fault for not seeing how great it all is. What a crock of shit!

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:22:45 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo and premies
Message:
I am sorry that you feel this way. That is not the way I experience knowledge and premies. I don`t think that the premies that I know behaves like zombies either. As far as I see it, premies are like ordinary human beeings. Not better and not worse than anybody else in this world. We are just lucky to have a place inside to go and experience peace. I have been to Amaroo and I think that the place is beautifull, but I was there in september when the temeratures is not so high. I have heard that it can be a very hot place to be when there is summer in Australia. Thats why the international programs is in september and april.

I think you should give knowledge another try.

Where do you come from?

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 22:37:48 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Are you kidding?
Message:
Give knowledge another try? Are you nuts?

Where I am from doesn't matter. Let's just say it is a long way from the outback of Australia. It was a long, expensive and unpleasant trip so that I could bake in the desert with a bunch of smiling saps and eat shitty lasagne, and sleep in a tent that I could not afford. It was a real treat, let me tell you.

I think it was October when I was in Amaroo. Hot as hell.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 23:16:46 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Dairrhoea at Amaroo
Message:
I was also at that event and avoided the dairrhoea by taking my own food and drink with me, and commuted daily from Brisbane where I stayed with friends who had no desire to charge me $1000 for the privilege.
I can remember being looked on with suspision from the moment I arrived and assumed it was because I paid only the registration fee of $100 without giving an added donation on top.
The most blatant momey making scam, besides darshan, was the FM radios that were on sale for premies to listen to whatever was going to be broadcast over the airwaves between M's appearances. Guess what was broadcast. Nothing. So all these premies where sitting around trying to tune there just purchased radios in only heard static. Fortunately,I had brought a radio with me and I was not sucked in.
There was plenty of room to get away from the heat. It was in the concession tent where you had the choice of a million and one framed photos of M that you could buy if you could spare the price, which was an arm and a leg.
Last but not least there were the security goons. What a joke. I think the T sirts on sale had the phrase *Sharing the feeling* on them. Well these guys and gals had no idea how to do that.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 23:25:26 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: The Concession Tent
Message:
Yeah, 'Sharing the Feeling?' More like 'Sharing the Bacteria.'

I was flipped out by the stuff they were selling there. The playing cards with swans on them, and the jewelry was particularly weird. They even have cook aprons with some of his garbage printed on it. Blantant money-making trap.

I forgot about eh $100 entrance fee, in addition to the cost of everything else. I thought those things were supposed to be 'free.'

I guess I got the trots from the food, but the place really freaked me out. Now, I think the two grand I spent on all this, and the vacation time I wasted, as a lesson about why I don't want to join a cult. It was expensive, but probably worth it in the long run.

And wasn't there some kind of expensive restaurant running at that place? Wasn't it run by Maharaji's daughter? I think it cost $100 or something to eat there, and I heard the food even sucked THERE. The whole thing was a money scam.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 00:48:48 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: You can get anything you want at Amaroo's Restaura
Message:
*And wasn't there some kind of expensive restaurant running at that place? Wasn't it run by Maharaji's daughter? I think it cost $100 or something to eat there, and I heard the food even sucked THERE. The whole thing was a money scam.*

Yes there was, but I don't know whether it was M's daughter who ran it. Had some spacey name like Divine Food or something equally trippy. The prices were certainly astronomical but I think the patrons were there hoping that M would turn up. One amusing story I heard was that on one ocassion when he fronted, a blissed out sister was on the point of orgasm because she had managed to souvenir one of his cigarette butts. Guess what she did with it? She ate it! I wonder what she would do if she got hold of one of his stools, and I'm not talking about what he sits on.

Yes you are correct, it was just a money making scam.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 19:44:37 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: Except decent food...
Message:
Thanks for giving more examples of the kind of mindless, stupid, zombie-like things that premies do when it comes to that cretin Maharaji. Can you tell me what the theory behind eating his fucking cigarette butt? What kind of sick person would do something like that? Well, maybe after she kissed his feet, she thought, 'what the hell, since I've already kissed his fucking feet, I might as well eat his cigarette butt, dine on his feces, or lick the bottom of his shoes. I'm a premie, after all.

WHERE do these people come from? How did so many losers congregate in one place? I am so fucking grateful that I don't have be ever involved with any of those pathetic people again. Maharaji ought to be slapped.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 21:18:40 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: eating his butt, the theory behind
Message:

Can you tell me what the theory behind eating his fucking cigarette butt?

This one is hard to explain. The theory is that somehow when he touches things, a bit of His Divine Presense or Vibe or Energy or something or other rubs off and the thing is then imbued with the stuff that rubs off. That's the theory behind 'charnamrit' (blessed water or Holy Water) and 'prashad' (blessed food) and perhaps involved with the idea of places like Amaroo. The premie viewed the cigarette butt as 'prashad'. I think I heard though that food or water only gets 'blessed' when he wants to bless it, not just by him touching it, or that he could bless food without touching it. I don't know, it's confusing. Charnamrit is supposedly made by running water over his feet. Premies also used to go get the flowers that surrounded the stages at programs and almost worship them like they were blessed. I think there's a big time placebo effect involved. The thing is, the placebo effect often works, which reinforces the idea. Premies don't want to give up their placebo effect. However, there are easier ways than going to the other end of the earth!

It's like God is everywhere, but is more at some places than others. You know, like 'Animal Farm', all the animals are equal, but some are more equal than others. Now for some strange reason, this rubbing off business doesn't seem to work with people as well, since premies don't treat each other with the same kind of reverence they treat 'charnamrit' and 'prashad'. You would think that according to this theory, any premie who touched him or even got close to him would become blessed and so premies would treat each other with permanent reverence.

He was getting away from this kind of stuff (darshan and charnamrit) for a few years, but that didn't last.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 10:26:12 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: Oliver/A former aspirant
Subject: This is hysterical. Former aspirant - you are ...
Message:
...priceless! I love your 'tell it as it is' posts! And I should be offended I guess, being an Aussie, but your take on Amaroo and all it's wank is so funny and refreshing to read.

I must admit Oliver, the whole Daya's restaurant thing struck me as such a pretentious toss too. So expensive and elitist. That's so tragic about the ciggie butt - god help those poor premies.

Actually, one of those classic moments I had, was when I was sitting down in the grass on a hill at Amaroo, and I had a Frenchman come up and tell me that it was dangerous, because of snakes and I should move, and I couldn't believe it. I've seen more and been around more Aussie snakes and bushland than he would ever have been, and the paranoia of people at Amaroo was ridiculous. Snakebite is like a shark attack. You are more likely to be struck by lightning than for this to ever happen. I just felt it was ridiculous to be told by a visiting Frenchman to watch out for snakes. That's like telling an African to watch out for lions. Honestly!!

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 20:35:29 (GMT)
From: A Former Aspirant
Email: None
To: TD
Subject: Thanks, but it wasn't so funny at the time
Message:
It wasn't very funny at the time, believe me. Now I can kind of laugh about it, but the whole thing was a nightmare. There is something so frightening about being with a bunch of people who all spout the same things, especially when they are so ridiculous. At least where I live I could get away from premies and go find some sanity. But in Amaroo, I felt both freaked out and trapped, and everyone was making me feel like I was the only person in the whole universe who didn't see how great it was. If I even mentioned my concerns, premies made me feel like I was infringing on their bliss and they just brushed me off.

And this is what I paid all that money for. Like I said, it was a nightmare.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 12:45:21 (GMT)
From: Oliver who is not Fmr Asp
Email: None
To: TD
Subject: Well written TD,.......
Message:
....a better example of the use of irony would be difficult to find in these environs.
I thought the threat of snake danger was just part of the security strategy to keep the customers in their *place,* didn't you? After all, even M made a point of promoting the snake scare to strike terror in our hearts. Wouldn't it have been inconvenient for him if a couple of premie bush walkers stumbled onto the residence.
You must understand that the Frenchman was only doing his job, and a difficult one it must have been. Jobs that include a high percentage of bullshit all ways are, so I trust you were not too hard on the man.
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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 00:54:58 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: Oliver who is not Fmr Asp
Subject: Hi Oliver and Fmr Asp (sorry it looked like I ....
Message:
... thought you were both the same person, but I didn't I was just being lazy and responding to you both in the same thread). Just like I'm doing now!!

Fmr Asp - I know what you mean. I can only laugh about it now too. I also felt like a freak at Amaroo. I seemed to be one of only a few people who was under the age of 30, and I spent most of the time sitting by myself and feeling so alone. I remember I came out from Darshan (my second time) and I sat and watched all these people in this stupid trance sitting on the hill, and I just sat down and pretended to be doing the same thing when really I was so untouched and felt like I'd failed because I didn't feel all gooey coz of kissing his tootsies.

Oliver - I think you're spot on about the snake rant of Maharaji's. I didn't think about it like that, but I reckon you are right! My partner (a long timer premie) was doing security and they had him stuck in a chair somewhere out in the middle of nowhere. Maharaji had such tight security around his house.

Being in such a blissful state of consciousness and so in touch with my heart and the Master, yes of course I was nice to the Frenchman. I smiled that spaced out smile and moved!

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:17:30 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: Amaroo - I can sympathise
Message:
I've been in that nightmare scenario too. I was stuck in a premie tent city near Copenhagen with awful food which gave me the shits, mud everywhere, toilets that stunk and were overflowing with shit, inane premies in every place who I learned to hate and I couldn't get any sleep because I was working as one of Maharaji's slaves all day and night.

I hated those so called 'festivals' and I didn't enjoy a single one of them. Others I suffered were near Orlando Florida, Dortmund in Germany and in Wales and England. I know just how you feel. Welcome back to civilisation and the human race.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:33:38 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: He can make more money if people stay at Amaroo
Message:
... and onsite, rather than if they are at hotels etc. Actually when the 1997 event came up, we had the option of staying on site (for about $1000) which has to be the world's most expensive campsite, or a range of hotels in Brisbane. It wasn't a hard choice for me. I could stay in luxury at a five-star hotel for about $400 and get the bus to and from Amaroo, or stay in a crap tent for $600 more, and have to share facilities. Hmmm. Tough call - not. I like camping, but I like to do it for free, and out in the bush, not in a tent-city like Amaroo. There it would just be hellish.

Actually, I did find Amaroo to be quite beautiful, especially with the Ivory Rock, and all the premie slave-labour that had produced the great landscaping. Mind you, as a day-tripper, I could appreciate it more, coz I wasn't sleeping there.

I wonder how M's new hexagon house on Amaroo is coming along? Anyone know....

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:49:51 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: TD
Subject: Amaroo's a money scam
Message:
The land was cheap to buy, lots of money has been raised, he has lots of free labor fixing it up, and the materials can't be that expensive. I mean, what's actually there except his house? On top of that, he charges pwkies $1,000 to stay onsite in a cheap tent. Also he wants to rent the place out, which he's done at least once. I doubt renting the place will bring in loads of money, but it's the thought that counts.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 06:04:45 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Amaroo's a money scam
Message:
Yeah, well as the Ivory Rock Conference Centre, apart from it bringing in extra cash, it avoids the local-yokels thinking that it really is owned by a cult.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:13:15 (GMT)
From: Pauline Premie
Email: None
To: A Former Aspirant
Subject: You lack understanding and synchronization....
Message:
And it's just so tragic. I have to admit, sometimes premies do come across as mindless zombies, but that's the premies and not Maharaji, whom I think rarely comes across as a mindless zombie or a ghoul. Because of your mind, you are exagerating.

And I couldn't give a rats ass if you want to receive knowledge or not. It means more room at the lotus feet if you don't, so good riddence to you, too.

I have to agree, though, that the food at Amaroo was pretty shitty. It gave me terrible diarhea. I was constantly looking for a bathroom and had to use the area behind large rocks on more than one occasion. But I was blissed out, even when shitting my insides out, because I saw Maharaji a few times, and we got to kiss his feet.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:25:48 (GMT)
From: Norm Coach
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: How true, how true.
Message:
Pauline, my little spark of eternity.

Not a lot of people know this but 'Amaroo' actually means 'Bucking Kangaroo' in the local dialect, or something close anyway. To have defecated on the 'Bucking Kangaroo' is, in fact, considered to be the sign of great spiritual elevation amongst certain indigenous tribes. So I guess your bad guts was really a shower of grace. How blissful. The one time that I visited the outback I did get to see an 'Amaroo Jumpabout'. At these gatherings the natives meet to re-enact the legend of the 'Bucking Kangaroo' from the mists of Oz pre-history. It really is something not to be missed. Sort of a cross between a Rodeo and the aftermath of a bad curry, I suppose. It's extremely difficult to shit on a rather large wild bucking marsupial at the best of times. But after a few tinnies of Fosters, it's well nigh impossible.

Strange but true.

Keep synching,

Norm Coach

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:27:27 (GMT)
From: Simon Satsang
Email: foaming@themouth.con
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: But you don't, sister
Message:
To shit upon that hallowed ground, dear sister - how fortunate you are!

Your turd still lies there, as a memorial to your devotion. I am inspired, I am overcome, for my dear, that is holy shit!

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 00:44:21 (GMT)
From: Clara Clarity
Email: None
To: Simon Satsang
Subject: Holy shit
Message:
Yes, and Pauline's turd can be made into Vibhuti, or Holy shit, tablets that Maharaji can give out as Prashad. Vibhuti is mentioned at the ex Sai Baba web site (see above Vibhuti - Holy shit!), but he just makes it out of cow dung, and we all know that Sai Baba is a fraud, Maharaji is the true God in Human Form, only He can bless shit.

I remember hearing a terrible incident where some non-premie tricked some innocent premies into eating some ordinary shit, telling them it was Maharaji's shit. How horrible.

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 22:04:46 (GMT)
From: I know it
Email: None
To: Clara Clarity
Subject: David Smith EATS Holy shit
Message:
every day!
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 17:31:15 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji cult.
Message:
This website and forum, in one incarnation or another, has now been around about 2.5 years. We have seen hundreds of ex-premies post here. We have seen literally dozens of premies, or 'non-practicing premies' become ex-premies by reading the iformation and discussions here. We have seen a number of aspirants find out what they were about to be getting into and becomming 'ex-aspirants,' a number of whom have told us about their experiences.

It is also likely that many, many premies read this site, and a very small number of them, all with a very paranoid anonymity, even post here. And, as we know, this website and forum are officially monitored by premies in Elan Vital who have the 'service' of tracking what is going on here. I haven't seen the numbers in quite a while, but this website and forum get very high traffic, with thousands of messages read each day. I can only assume the number is higher now than the period I am referring to.

We have seen a lot of information come out on these pages that many of us didn't know about Maharaji and his cult, including sexual molestation scandals, financial shennanigans, and the not-so-perfect personal problems of the former Lord of the Universe. We have seen an excellent compilation of documents that prove the allegations people make here.

We have seen attempts by Maharaji's lawyers to shut down the ex-premie websites, and we have seen ex-premies find and communicate with people they knew in the cult, and in a couple of cases, these connections have resulted in relationships and even marriage. I can say for me, I have made some new friends, and I have come in contact with a group of smart, funny, and generally very caring people, who have something in common.

But one of the most significant developments is the effect these discussions and this information has had on the cult itself. We have seen Elan Vital attempt to address all this with the FAQs on its website. We have seen Maharaji get his own website, after disparaging the internet for a long time before that. These are both obvious reactions to what ex-premies are doing.

And, we have seen a big increase in paranoia in the cult with lots more security, and even 'smartcards' which are apparently so that premies can be 'card-carrying members' so that only approved premies can get into PWK-only events. This is not only bizarre, I think it's also self-defeating, as it makes the cult even less attractive to outsiders, who will see the paranoia as evidence that they are approaching a cult.

We are told that Elan Vital has pictures of many of us ex-premies, or have people in security know who we are, out of fear that we might try to crash one of these 'events.' This is kind of funny, but also shows how crazed these people are.

It even appears that Maharaji is trying to go even further underground, to hold programs in remote locations like Amaroo, and progressively fewer elsewhere in the West, and an attempt to even eliminate 'halls' and any kind of group meetings that can be targeted by ex-premies or the press. I think we have clearly altered how Maharaji does things, and to the extent it has driven him further underground, it is positive in the sense that even fewer people are likely to get involved with him, or be turned off if they do.

The question is, is it for the better? I think in one way it is. I think Maharaji has basically written of North America and Europe as places were much of any propogation is going to happen. So many people are now computer and internet-literate, that he has to figure that anyone who has a computer will find ex-premie.org and will start asking questions.

Any other ideas about this?

Joe, who is currently in a 'taking stock' phase.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:56:35 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji
Message:
You could write a section on what we have done to m and his troubled mind and how he tries to justify himself to the 'world'
by explaining his bad behaviour as evidence of his holier than thou reality, which demands that someone as masterful of life as he, must have 'total disregard' for doing what other humans rightfully expect of him.

Trying to push such things as banishing mom and cheating on his wife, lying, cheating folks out of thier money, ect, under the umbrella of 'total disregard' which is now apparently a condition that a 'master of life' is required to do by the unconcious oneness.

He has also had some kind of revelation which led him to say recently 'Hey you guys, know what? I think blind faith sucks.'
Implying of course something that means he is better and smarter.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:42:17 (GMT)
From: jondon
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji cult.
Message:
I was thinking about this the other day. I believe that this site is not really damaging M's daily functions too badly. I believe it has caused a chink in his armor and made him put up and maintain some defenses (which are not working very effectively). But the main thing that this site has offered is a place for premie's with doubts (PWD's) and aspirants to come and look over the fence to see what is on the other side. THis site reveals some of the things that M and Premies have been and still are hiding. And it really is enough to keep some from joining or for some to quit.
As far as damaging his routine and daily function (whatever the hell it may be) I think as long as he stays out of the PUBLIC EYE, he is maintaining his defense. Exposure would be the ultimate. Exposing this fraud to the public would surely bring him down.
If 20/20 or 60 minutes or Michael Moore was to do an episode on the Lord of the Universe and if they were able to get some insiders (premies or ex's) to speak, it would do some damage. The ultimate would be for him (M) to do an interview. I think the worst reporter in the world would crush him like a grape. Hell, all you'd have to do is let him speak.

Maharaji sucks, peace, out.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:16:31 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: jondon
Subject: The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji cult.
Message:
I agree jondon. I think the major effect on Maharaji has been a greater determination to stay underground, and to try to communicate to the die-hard, money-giving, premies in a fashion that won't be noticed outside the cult. Also, the fact that there is this website makes it more likely that the press is going to pick up on the exes v. cult-leader story and start publicizing.

But, I think no matter what happens, no matter how scathing the expose, no matter how stupid Maharaji looked in an interview, there are still a group of premies who are so intrenched that they wouldn't abandon him and would just view it as 'lila.'

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:48:23 (GMT)
From: jondon
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: So, how does one......
Message:
go about bringing the exes v. cult-leader story, to the press? I tried in Boston to get a talk show to do something, but they were not too interested. The Boston Phoenix thing did not shake things up too much.

I agree that this site has forced them to squeeze the die-hard money givers, and you're right, the ones who are too entrenched will not abandon him. But that's Okay. I think as long as this site serves as a place to inform, that it will become difficult for him to get new people to join. And eventually he will either go away or come out of his hole and become exposed. I prefer the latter, but if he were to just pack it all up and go live the good life in India (which is anything other than living on the curb) I would be happy.

Maharaji still sucks. Out.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 19:24:06 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Do you really think that people will be prevented
Message:
from attending events because they don't have smart cards? I know plenty of current premies who don't have smart cards. They are being offered so that people will not have to enter all their personal information each time that they wish to attend an event. Where did you hear that only people with smart cards will be allowed to attend? And when was the last time you attended an event Joe? You guys think you're preventing Maharaji from doing his work? You may be stopping a few people from receiving Knowledge but the thirsty truth seekers are still coming. Someone who really wants to know that inner peace will come. You're just stopping a few curious onlookers. The bottom line is that Knowledge works and those who investigate it seriously find that out. So don't be so prepared to call someone who supports Maharaji a 'cult' member. If there are any 'cult' members it's you guys. You're obsessed! I simply support my teacher in his effort to make Knowledge available to others.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:41:04 (GMT)
From: Onionananda
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: SmartCard
Message:

Where did you hear that only people with smart cards will be allowed to attend?

On the SmartCard application, it says that there will be events where having a SmartCard will be required for attendance.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:13:39 (GMT)
From: Sir David
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Some teacher eh?
Message:
Your teacher is by your own admission, a liar. What kind of person are you who regards a blatant and bare faced liar as your teacher?

You can't have many scruples and the fact that you persist in attempting to prop up a liar and a con man will prevent you from getting any respect here.

You're digging yourself into a hole.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:31:34 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Sir David
Subject: Ever met a non-liar, Sir David? I've yet to meet
Message:
a human being who has never lied. Have you? Knowledge works. Whether or not Maharaji has lied or not doesn't have anything to do with his showing me how to access that Life force within me. And you guys crack me up. You keep going on about the finances. What organization in the world ever operated without funding? Does anyone have to give him money? No! So don't do it if you don't want to! He doesn't charge money for Knowledge, does he? Most of you here are a bunch of sniveling whiners! Get over it! And be sure to introduce me to someone who has never lied. I'd like to meet him or her. How about you, Sir David? Ever tell a fib?
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:14:26 (GMT)
From: Sir David
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: There's lies and then there's Maharaji's lies
Message:
And his lies are about the biggest. I've never met anyone else who has claimed to be God. That's just about the biggest lie I've ever heard.

Normal everyday lies pale into insignificance compared to Maharaji's blatant lie. And you still follow him? I could never bring myself to even listen to such a person again who has told such a lie, in order to extract donations from people.

Knowledge doesn't work, by the way. That is apparent since most people who receive it never practise it after a while. Maharaji isn't much of a master is he? Most of his devotees (students) leave him after a while and never want to return. Many of them hate him.

So who is wrong? Maharaji or the ex-devotees? You either blame the teacher or you blame the students.

Only a bad teacher blames his students for leaving him. A good teacher will not lose his students.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:38:01 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Sir David
Subject: So let me get this straight. Knowledge doesn't
Message:
work yet you followed him for years simply because he claimed to be God? If it didn't work, wouldn't that have been your first clue? Am I missing something here? And there are thousands of people who haven't left. I don't hear him blaming anyone for leaving. He's always said that the door is open.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:03:56 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Sir David
Subject: Bare faced liar?
Message:
Okay, Sir D, you've said 'bare faced', I've said 'bold faced', and I've seen Joe say 'bald faced' liar. Now which is it? What's the proper term, and way to describe M? Is he a bare faced liar, a bold faced liar, or a bald faced one? I want to get this right. So anybody who's savvy with this expression, please fill me in. What's the proper term?
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:05:21 (GMT)
From: Ben Lurking
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Bare faced liar?
Message:
Bare and bald are incorrect as he wares makeup -Bold it is
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:31:13 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: bold-faced, bald-faced, barefaced
Message:
Relevant definitions from www.dictionary.com:

bold-faced

Impudent; brazen: 'a bold-faced lie'.

1. Somewhat impudent; lacking modesty; as, 'a bold-faced woman'.
'I have seen enough to confute all the bold-faced atheists of this age.' --Bramhall.

bald-faced

Brash; undisguised: 'a bald-faced lie'.

barefaced

2. Without disguise; unconcealed.

3. Undisguisedly bold; brazen. See Synonyms at shameless.

2. Without concealment; undisguised. Hence: Shameless; audacious. 'Barefaced treason.' --J. Baillie.

1: with no effort to conceal; 'a barefaced lie' [syn: bald]

2: unrestrained by convention or propriety; 'an audacious trick to pull'; 'a barefaced hypocrite'; 'the most bodacious display of tourism this side of Anaheim'- Los Angeles Times; 'bold-faced lies'; 'brazen arrogance'; 'the modern world with its quick material successes and insolent belief in the boundless possibilities of progress'- Bertrand Russell [syn: audacious, bodacious, bold-faced, brassy, brazen, brazen-faced, insolent]

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:27:06 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: It's 'bald-faced'
Message:
Although it means basically the same thing, a lie that is apparent and 'uncovered.'

From the Oxford Dictionary:

Bald-Faced
adjective
Brash; undisguised: a bald-faced lie.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:30:28 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Then it's settled
Message:
Maharaji is a 'bald faced' liar. Thanks, Joe.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:05:03 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: No it isn't
Message:
You are American. Over here the term 'bare faced liar' is used. I've never heard bold/bald faced liar used here.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 14:25:31 (GMT)
From: Ben Lurking
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: No it isn't
Message:
But we can all agree he lied!
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 10:27:41 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: I think he is a dickhead face
Message:
nt
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 18:28:24 (GMT)
From: Xelda
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: The effect are Ex-premies having on Maharaji cult.
Message:
good post
I would add that this forum and ones like it have given fuel to a ex premie movement.
Many of us are in contact with fence line premies, and their personal contacts with us also enable them to leave the cult . Many lurkers are from this group.

Makaka has no idea how many of his followers have been innoculated against him and still attend his events.
We have alerted them to his salesmanship tactics and they now view him with 'doubt in their minds'
The beauty of it is is that the harder he tries the more obvious he is.

This is what they want to discuss.
This process can take a while.

As for the pictures that EV has of us- They have videos of the darshan lines- a very invasive practice. The camera is concealed from the audience and only when one approaches the last few yards
to his feet is the camera in evidence.
In the name of getting footage of the darshan line for future videos or recording the holy event- EV is building its video archives which also serves as a human library

z

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 19:04:26 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Xelda
Subject: I would suggest that you view a recent event like
Message:
Sunday's Q & A session from Alexandria. Same message. He didn't seem to be trying any harder. You guys think you're stopping the 'cult'. I don't think that you're doing anything but venting. Knowledge sessions keep happening, satellite broadcasts are increasing and Maharaji is still going places and talking from his heart.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:29:06 (GMT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: I would suggest that you view a recent event like
Message:
I dont think I am stopping the cult. I help premies become fenceline and eventually exit.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:53:41 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Zelda
Subject: Exit to what? Bitterness, anger, confusion and
Message:
whining? I guess if you exit from joy, love, clarity and gratitude, then that's what you get! No thanks. I'll stick with the real thing.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 09:22:09 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Shroom , Who's confused here ? nt
Message:
fd
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:42:30 (GMT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Bitterness, anger, confusion of course in
Message:
the ex holding tank where we all support each other with complimentary lies, negativity and miserableness what else???
dont you know that there is no peace and contentment out of the cult? That any hope of happiness is forfieted if one becomes an ex.
Better stay where you are because if you make a statement like that you need all the crutch you can get.

This is a cult here and dont you forget it Dooomananda

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:19:17 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Maharaji doesn't have a heart
Message:
Knowledge sessions keep happening, satellite broadcasts are increasing and Maharaji is still going places and talking from his heart.

Just what exactly is M saying from his heart? Nothing. He's just parroting a sales pitch that's worked for generations of gurus, that's all. You might as well say the boys on Madison Avenue (advertising execs) are speaking from their heart, too. They're just trying to sell shit the same as M is. I know, I know, I can hear you now. Maharaji's 'gift' is 'free'. Not really. Maharaji steals your mind and then uses it for his own gain. He'd be more honest if he WAS charging for his 'gift'. As it is, he's just a devil in disguise, pretending he's giving something away, when in reality, he's taking, taking, and taking. Just look at all the shit this guy owns. You don't think that's what he was aiming for, that his wealth is his heart's delight? Get real, Shroom. Seeing how brainwashed you are only makes me despise Maharaji that much more.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:01:11 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: I don`t think Maharaji brainwashes people.
Message:

I don`t think that Maharaji is the one that brainwashes people. Reading this site for some days now, its very clear to me that you guys are trying to brainwash premies and aspirants to go against Maharaji.
It`s like a cru`sade. You all are still living in the 70`s. Always talking about how you sacrifised your youth and gave Maharaji money. Do you think happines is in luxury? Do you think Maharaji is happy because of the money you gave him? I don`t think so.
And if Maharaji is in just because of the money, why does he spend so much time in the poor countries like Nepal, Malaysia and some countries in Africa? It`s not so much money there. I myself have been to programs in Nepal, and I will tell you, no money there. Most of the people earn 50 cents a day.
I got knowledge in the 70`s and I am still a premie and proud of it.
I am just an ordinary guy with a good job, great familie and a grandchild too. I have some premiefriends and some friends that are nonpremies. I respect them and they respect me. I listen and see videos of Maharaji from time to time. Trying to practise knowledge and go to some programs if I can afford it. If I go to a program, me and my wife (also a premie, got knowledge 3 years ago)), try to have a vacation as well. It has been a great way to see the world. I see no harm in Maharaji`s teachings. If people like knowledge, fine. If not, they can leave and find other things to do. No problems here. Its you guys that pretend that there is a problem. Cult, brainwashing, money and all that stuff. Maharaji is not asking anybody for money. It`s all in your heads.
I think its time for you to come to the year 2000 and not be stuck in the 70`s. Things have really changed. I am not a cultmember and I think that nobody of my friends or at work see me as one. Wake up you guys and welcome to the year 2000.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:42:04 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: No shit
Message:
Do you think Maharaji is happy because of the money you gave him?

I certainly hope not. I hope he's a miserable bastard.

I got knowledge in the 70`s and I am still a premie and proud of it.

That's because you haven't learned how to think yet, Kjarne. When you learn the value of rational thinking, you might not feel so proud. You just might smack yourself in the head.

I am just an ordinary guy with a good job, great familie and a grandchild too.

I'm glad to hear that. Really, I am. It's good to know you have something real going on in your life. But I doubt you realize just HOW real. That might be brash of me, but if you think so much of Maharaji, you've probably lessened the importance of your family because of it. Maharaji certainly lessens the importance of family. As his disciple, I think it's safe for me to assume you follow his lead.

If people like knowledge, fine. If not, they can leave and find other things to do.

It's not that simple, Kjarne. Part of the aspirant process is being brainwashed that this Knowledge is the key to understanding and enjoying life. Once that belief is entrenched in your mind, it can be very difficult to uproot it. I know. I was stuck in it for more years than I care to remember. I might still be if it wasn't for the help of the fine people I've met on this website. Now, I'm free, thanks to them.

Maharaji is not asking anybody for money. It`s all in your heads.

Kjarne, wake up. Maharaji is constantly soliciting funds one way or the other. Where the hell did he get it all if he wasn't?

I think its time for you to come to the year 2000 and not be stuck in the 70`s.

I think it's time for you to realize that Maharaji is not going to be allowed to change his stripes that easy. This is a man who once claimed he was God, and was the sole dispenser of Knowledge of God. You don't just deny that claim without being taken to task for it.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:45:01 (GMT)
From: Gregg
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Norge
Message:
Kjarne: you are worshipping someone who told everybody he was a God. Do you really think there is nothing wrong with that?

Do you think your Master really understands what it means to be a Master? Have you read the sacred texts from Hindu/Buddhist traditions? Do you think Maharaji's insipid satsang compares with those teachings? Could it be that you imagine that Maharaji is more than he really is?

Think about it. Unless you think that thinking is wrong.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 10:38:00 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: Gregg
Subject: Norge
Message:
Gregg: Could it be that you imagine that Maharaji is more than he really is?

Kjarne respond:

Well, I must admit that I still see Maharaji as somebody more than a teacher. And I think that most of the premies do.
It`s hard for me to see him as a ordinary human beeing after 23 years with Knowledge.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 11:00:10 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Norge
Message:
Kjorne said

Do you think happines is in luxury? Do you think Maharaji is happy because of the money you gave him? I don`t think so

I would rather be rich and not happy rather than poor not happy.
Or is it rich and not happy rather than poor and happy. Or
rich and happy rather than poor and not happy.

help I am confused

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 11:20:51 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Don`t be confused.
Message:

Salam wrote:

I would rather be rich and not happy, rathet than poor not happy.
Or is it rich and not happy rather than poor and happy. Or rich and happy rather than poor and not happy.

Help I am confused.

Kjarne writes: That`s a good one!
Salam, I think it is better to be rich, happy and healthy rather than poor, miserable and sick!.

Did that clear up for you?.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 22:54:39 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: Oh, I just have to answer this one....
Message:
Do you think happines is in luxury? Do you think Maharaji is happy because of the money you gave him? I don`t think so.

Well then why doesn't he give it back? I don't think any of the 70's ex-premies would refuse it. If Maharaji hasn't enjoyed the wealth he's accumulated over the years, then why has his portfolio increased over the years.

And if Maharaji is in it just because of the money, why does he spend so much time in the poor countries like Nepal, Malaysia and some countries in Africa? It`s not so much money there. I myself have been to programs in Nepal, and I will tell you, no money there. Most of the people earn 50 cents a day.

Feeds his ego, and his credibility as well as a world-wide cult leader. Maharaji is such a liar when he says he will go to wherever in the world people are thirsty for Knowledge. Bollocks. He only goes to safe places where his lardy arse won't be threatened. What about the poor Fijian premies who he stopped going to visit, after the original coup. Of all times, that's when he should have gone...

I am just an ordinary guy with a good job, great familie and a grandchild too. I have some premiefriends and some friends that are nonpremies. I respect them and they respect me. I listen and see videos of Maharaji from time to time. Trying to practise knowledge and go to some programs if I can afford it. If I go to a program, me and my wife (also a premie, got knowledge 3 years ago)), try to have a vacation as well. It has been a great way to see the world. I see no harm in Maharaji`s teachings. If people like knowledge, fine. If not, they can leave and find other things to do.

Just like a happy-camper Christmas letter. It's such a premie style - not one negative thing to tell at all about being involved with Maharaji. It's all bliss and sunshine. C'mon Kjarne, you've never had any dramas with taking time off work suddenly to attend a program, ever struggled with practicing K, never had your wife prior to her getting Knowledge, being just a little bit jealous of your commitment to Maharaji, never ever put Knowledge, Maharaji or a program before your kids? If you haven't - you're not like any premie I've met...

Cult, brainwashing, money and all that stuff. Maharaji is not asking anybody for money. It`s all in your heads.
I think its time for you to come to the year 2000 and not be stuck in the 70`s. Things have really changed.

Kjarne, I am in my thirties, and I was a 90's premie - not stuck in the 70's at all, and the techniques of brainwashing are still the same. One of the worst realisations I have ever had, was that I had been brainwashed as an aspirant. A real dent to my ego, I can tell you that much! It's like what Joe says all the time. If you knew you were in a cult, you wouldn't be in it. And this forum is not the place to say that Maharaji doesn't ask for money. Of course he doesn't himself during a program, but money is extracted from premies via a variety of sources. Debiting credit cards, from instructors fund-raising tours (eg Yoram Weiss), money from the videos and merchandise etc etc....

I am not a cultmember and I think that nobody of my friends or at work see me as one. Wake up you guys and welcome to the year 2000.

Kjarne, do you tell your workmates that you have kissed the feet of your Indian guru, and would again if M offered Darshan at the next program?

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:14:37 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: TD
Subject: Ha-ha! TD. Very well said!! (nt)
Message:
But you clicked anyway to see what I put here, didn't ya?

Hmm, guess it's your time you're wasting...:)

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 23:10:28 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: FA
Subject: FA - My post has disappeared!! (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 17:28:44 (GMT)
From: Forum Admin
Email: None
To: TD
Subject: Where did you leave it...?
Message:
Hmm, dunno...

Was it short / long - posted what time? Did it never appear, or disappear later? I'm not sure if this is the same problem Jim reported and if so, we're not sure why it's happening. Stay tuned...

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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 07:30:57 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: Forum Admin
Subject: It came magically all by itself after an hour or 2
Message:
nt
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 15:57:48 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Hindu 'baggage'
Message:
I've got a bug up my ass about this 'hindu baggage' thing, which is the excuse given for why M said and did all the things he did back in the seventies and early eighties. The way I figure it is Maharaji comes from a background of self delusion. He bought into all that Hindu crap about being a divine incarnation. Even if he didn't actually believe it, which he may not have, he acted the part, and still actually does in India. So, what gives? What kind of madness are we talking here?

The way I figure it is either you're God or you're not. You don't just play the role of being God if it's culturally acceptable and stop playing it when it's not. It doesn't work that way. So how does Elan Vital expect rational thinking people to agree that it's okay for M to say he was 'greater than God' because that's the culture he was raised in? All that tells me is they've got some really fucked up, grandiose dudes in that culture, and if anything, M is not to be trusted because that's where he comes from. He's filled with grandiosity. The last thing he is is a humble meditation teacher. He never was that, and he'll never be that. Anybody who says he is is gravely kidding themselves.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 17:19:25 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: M just plays God when it's financially suitable
Message:
M just plays God when it's financially suitable for him, and I'm sure the wheeler-dealers he's attracted to his scam can understand that.

(PS ever thought it might profit THEM too?)

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 17:10:48 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: What Elan Vital Hopes
Message:
It bugs me too, Jerry, but I think what Elan Vital hopes is that people won't hear about how Maharaji claimed to be God. See, they tried to destroy all the evidence, like publications, movies, etc., where he said that stuff, and they have tried, or maybe are still considering, shutting down the internet sites in order to hide the evidence of their's and Maharaji's lying claiming some kind of bogus 'copyright.' This is the hope.

See, the internet threw a big wrench in Maharaji's plans to transform himself into something more socially acceptable, to keep from becoming completely irrelevent and a laughing stock, which is what would have happened if he persisted in wearing crowns and dancing half naked in front of large audiences. So, he tried to drop the 'god-thing.' I think this is why he was so critical of the internet at first. Perhaps he saw the danger, but now, I think because of ex-premies, he has had to face it, but he has done so in the usual Maharaji way. He is so out of touch with the way ordinary people think, that he thinks arrogance and lies will take care of the situation. Have you ever heard anything so arrogant as to first ask if Maharaji is rich, and then, instead of even answering the question you say you don't have any right to judge someone about their 'lifestyle?' Pure Maharaji arrogance. He certainly hasn't changed in that regard.

The problem for him is that his past, to most thinking people, is indicative of the kind of person he is. What does it tell us? Well, he claimed to be, and acted like he was, god. He demanded total dedication and surrender from his followers. He has almost incomprehensible material and financial greed. He displayed callous uncaring about his followers and what his god-complex and greed did to them. And he, or at least the people around him, know that if people know about this, they will head for the hills instead of becoming members of his cult. Plus, there are a good number of premies who will find it increasingly difficult to justify their involvement with him.

This is a serious problem, and, as usual, Maharaji doesn't handle it very well. Elan Vital lies on its website, and anybody with an ounce of interest can verify the lies online. How on earth does Maharaji think this will help his credibility? I don't get it.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:22:07 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: What Elan Vital Dopes
Message:
Jerry posted another post a while back and what he brought up is the thing that still bothers me.
I will dig it up.
Jerry, it was something you found on the faq site and it was them trying to cover up rawats blasting staff in rages by claiming that 'sometimes (the lord) has had to take someone to task........'
I have to pull that one out.
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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 23:08:42 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: bill
Subject: Rawat's yelling
Message:
It's from the Elan Vital The little man behind the curtain page (they call it 'The Man Behind the Message')

Kind is a description of him that frequently crops up and one insider comments: 'he can be tough, demanding and very focused on the standards he wants to achieve. However even when he’s had to take someone to task he always follows up with a reassurance that mistakes happen not because people are stupid or incapable, just that they have forgotten to be conscious of their actions.' Maharaji’s own take on this: 'When you slip on a banana skin, you
can’t blame the banana or the person who threw it there. It was you, through a moment of unconsciousness, didn’t look where you were walking.'

That's a strange kind of 'kindness'. Oh, he just had to yell at them, I mean, he just didn't have any choice, did he? And they he 'kindly' follows through with a one-two punch and tells them they didn't fuck up because of being stupid or incapable (implying they are), but because they weren't 'conscious' (another cult misuse of a word).

'he can be tough' translates to 'he is a mean asshole', 'demanding' to 'bossy and overbearing', and 'very focused on the standards he wants to achieve' to 'obsessively perfectionistic and greedy'.

In the last part he's saying that they deserved what they got because of their 'unconsciousness', i.e. he didn't like what they did or didn't get what he wanted. Maybe he's also calling himself a banana skin.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 04:17:20 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Rawat's yelling
Message:
well said G.
I went to my archives tonight trying to dig up the yelling info I have but didnt find it yet. When I do, you will be appalled.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 08:54:22 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Was it something I said?
Message:
My wife met a an old premie friend last Friday. She told my wife an interesting little tale from Amaroo.

Her partner, also an old premie friend, went to the last festival in Amaroo and got into a conversation with an American premie. They stood chatting for a while, then the subject of the Ex-Premie websites came up, followed by my name. Our friend said, “Oh, Anth and Dot. I know them both,”at which point the American premie spun on his heel and headed off into the sunset at top speed, without even a ‘Goodbye”. Maybe he was scared that some of the contamination radiating from me would somehow infect him, via my friend (who I haven’t seen for about a year).

Or maybe it was something I said?

Anth the Outcast.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 18:04:35 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: Was it something I said?
Message:
What a feeling of power though, eh? :)
Just on my way to pick up my car that broke down on Friday, $300! :(
I know I blow in here now and then and have nothing to say about m but I miss you all and never did have to much to say about him at anytime. I am glad there are people like you here though Anth, and lots of others to keep the fires burning under his ass and becoming internationally renouned at it! :)
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 08:09:39 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: Was it something I said?
Message:
Hi Robyn,

Your tin of Ricola is still on my table.

Maybe by Christmas...

take care

Anth the Lost the Post Office

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Date: Thurs, Aug 17, 2000 at 18:18:42 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: Was it something I said?
Message:
Dear Anth,
No rush with the tin unless it is the REAL ricola! :) This way when you see it sitting there you think of me. :)
Love,
Robyn the no room to talk about anyone else's problems with the mail! Ask JM!
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:40:53 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: What the bird told me about gm
Message:
These are sites that link to maharaji.org or elanvital.org.
I have not seen them listed(i think) on this forum

The local vegie shop. In active. Why?

http://www.living-foods.com/community/personal/disclaimer.html

Cann't figure out why this (korean?) site has links to maharaj.

http://jfk.hkcampus.net/~jfk-000/favorites/bookmark.htm

look where EV is advertising

http://www.grippo.com/argentina/espanol/society/newage.htm
http://search.oingo.com/topic/60/60981.html

if you can read French, tell me why this character has Elan Vital
as special site. He seems to be some kind of acedemic

http://tornade.ere.umontreal.ca/~blaudcel/celestin.htm

Can you tell the difference between sprouts and maharaji.
If you cann't I do not blame you.
Click on continue and go to the bottom of the page

URL: www.gogreen.org

The University of Wolverhapton think that EV is a religion

http://www.wlv.ac.uk/sed/rsnet.htm#nrm

Amazone is having a discount on premie music. Do not miss out

http://www.cdickey.com/music/premie_music.htm

The Greens support maharaji for presidency/click on Spritual connections

http://www.miamigreens.org/

Find a compatable partener, ask gm

http://www.myfreeoffice.com/abondigas/

Weird art inspired my maharaji

http://orbita.starmedia.com/~introart/MSDtrasoir.html

another missing page/please e-mail them

URL: www.logdev.com/LogDev/GEWeb/MyFavs.htm

Maharaji-poetry

http://dirt.dmoz.org/Society/Religion_and_Spirituality/Poetry_and_Music/

The Russian Conection

http://neystadt.org/dos/russia/sites/org-ru.htm

Can you find him

URL: www.gilbertogil.com.br/polen/9903.htm

Salam

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:37:20 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: everyone
Subject: What the bird told me about gm
Message:
I just got an e-mail from those people that this link that I put above

www.logdev.com/LogDev/GEWeb/MyFavs.htm

should look likw this

http://www.logdev.com/LogDev/StaffWebs/GEWeb/MyFavs.htm

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 08:06:40 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Copy of email to George Chryssides
Message:
To: G.D.Chryssides@wlv.ac.uk


Deea George,

I have just seen your site called 'Religious Studies on the Internet' and note that you have Elan Vital/Maharaji down as a 'new religion'. Maharaji/Elan Vital is regarded a cult by many many people including former members and I think you should include the web addresses of anti-Maharaji sites which clearly tell the 'other side'.

The main address is http://www.ex-premie.org .

I am also surprised that you have not listed sites of ex-followers of Satya Sai Baba and Iscon.

Also please note that you have listed Sathya Sai Baba with Shridi Sai Baba, please notes that followers of Shridi would not associate or would want to be associated with Sathya Sai Baba.

Regards Jethro Cadbury

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 08:40:25 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Copy of email to George Chryssides
Message:
I was looking at this website

http://www.wlv.ac.uk/sed/rsnet.htm#nrm

and the first thing that I expected to read is some introduction on religon. I also expected to find your criteria of the defenition of religion and the method that you have used in your conclusion that a particular sect or organisation can be classified as religious. In particular I am interested in the organisation

Elan Vital

that you have listed under new religious movement. I would like to bring your attention to the fact that this organisation is listed as a charity organisation and is regestered as a church with the IRS. Do you imply that all churches represent a religious movements. I would very much like to hear your comments.

Salam

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 08:22:17 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Where's that anti Sai Baba site?
Message:
I like your cocoa and drink it every night. Do you have the URL of that anti Sai Baba site? There was a web site which detailed his magic parlour tricks and also his sexual encounters with some of the young men in his cult. Is that the site which you are refering to?

If you have this URL, I will put the link on my Incarnations of God page.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:26:21 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: I love your incarnation site Sir David.nt
Message:
sdfgh
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 17:55:15 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Here is the link
Message:
http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/sathyasaibaba

I'm sure there are others as well.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 18:33:51 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Here's another
Message:
Here's another, it has some links to other sites:

Sathya Sai Baba exposed

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:47:00 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: G
Subject: That's great guys
Message:
Thanks alot. The fact that I've also advertised my God Incarnations page on several newsgroups means that more people will get the truth about these charlatans.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:24:05 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: ugh, the sia bobo forum is loaded with crap.
Message:
Man I am glad this forum is not plagued with that kind of crap.
They need a JIM of thier own.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 00:17:14 (GMT)
From: Lurkex
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Here's another
Message:
Jesus H. Christ! That site (Satya Sai Baba exposed) is unbefuckinlievable.

Go check it out!

Recognize a lot of the programming... people's refusal to look at the evidence of abuse because they can't trust themselves and anyway he's God.

Very interesting!

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 14:17:11 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Where's that anti Sai Baba site?
Message:
Try this

http://www.myfreeoffice.com/saibabaexposed/student1.html

Also altavista advanced search type: sai and baba and cult
if you want all the web sites that have a link to sai baba home page type(using adv. search),

link:premasaibaba.org.

As for Ananda, he seems to be in it too ,

check him out at

http://www.jps.net/aanetwork/xxxw2.html

Salam

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:05:39 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Saieeee Bubba
Message:
If someone were in jail, they wouldn't want him as a cell mate. A disjusting thought, eh?
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 06:17:10 (GMT)
From: Unless ofcourse he was on
Email: None
To: G
Subject: of the special students..nt
Message:
Salam
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:55:00 (GMT)
From: buzz
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: What the bird told me about gm
Message:
salam the answer to what is the differance between sprouts and mahraji is.sprouts are wholesome and good for your health.mahraji is full of wind.correct?
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:16:41 (GMT)
From: buzz
Email: None
To: shroo
Subject: persistence
Message:
i've not read all the stuff you've posted but i wonder why you persist.is it that you feel we have strayed from the path and you are being the good sheperd and trying to bring us back to the flock or is it that your foundations of your beliefs are a little rocky and you are trying to convince yourself that there are no truths it what is being posted here about the meditation pedlar?don't get me wrong i love to read your postings as i've always loved good humour,but if your boat is unsteady you can always change it for an unleaky one.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:34:53 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: buzz
Subject: do people REALLY take shroom seriously?
Message:
I think he is just pulling a big joke and being disruptive.
Just my opinion.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:14:51 (GMT)
From: Ben Lurking
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: do people REALLY take shroom seriously?
Message:
I think shroom takes himself seriously, for the rest of us it the same old #$%!, different day and spout mouth
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 21:47:46 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Ben Lurking
Subject: I think you mentioned clones
Message:
That is how it is all right. We could do them a favor and just supply form letters. I'd say about 20 max should do it.

How many times have YOU been told 'no one held a gun to your head'. Didn't these people ever hear of peer pressure, coersion, etc.??

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:48:26 (GMT)
From: buzz
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: do people REALLY take shroom seriously?
Message:
like i said he's always good for a laugh.i still think basically he's insecure.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 07:20:16 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: buzz
Subject: insecure definitely
Message:
That is something we can agree on. Why would he post here over and over otherwise?

Even in my last year as a premie when I was seriously on the fence and hating most of the videos, the events, all of it, I would come to this forum once in a while, read a few posts and leave immediately. Never dreamt of posting here until I was ready to leave.

For a premie to come here over and over to defend M there has to be a reason; To disrupt? or because they are questioning their beliefs? I think my other nagging thought is that some may just be bored and sociopathic.
Insecure is as good a word as any.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:47:06 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: do people REALLY take shroom seriously?
Message:
I think he is deadly serious. This is not a joke to him and he is an example of a person who follows Maharaji today. He has shown to me by his words here that the cult is an insidious enemy of mankind. It is not something to be taken lightly because we know that the cult has caused some people to take their own lives and has ruined countless more.

When we consider such things and the possibilities of further tragedies, it is no longer a joke and we see graphically illustrated here in Shroom's posts, the philosophy which has caused so many people to wreck their lives and end them.

I have no doubt now that Mahraji and premies are a destructive force in our world.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 16:04:24 (GMT)
From: Kjarne
Email: None
To: Dave
Subject: You should take everybody seriously.
Message:

Dave (I think you should erase sir from your first name).

Why didn`t you take me seriously, Dave. when I asked you to translate my post into french and put it on the french forum, you translated into french and added some jokes about it.
You should take everybody seriously and not fool around with people.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 18:02:12 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Kjarne
Subject: You should take everybody seriously.
Message:
I'm sorry but I couldn't resist putting that last line in and I did say that I wrote it myself.

Of course I'm not a 'Sir' and I wish sometimes that I'd started with another handle but I was knighted on the forum, so it stuck.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:52:04 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Sir Dave you know I agree with you about M
Message:
And premies being destructive. I've been victimized severely by M and the cult over and over.

And I appreciate your input. I threw the question out to get feedback because he seems too much to be real. Just so stereotypical.
Thanks- you are someone whose opinions I value. You've been right before when I was wrong!!

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 19:44:16 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Yeah, talking about peace, joy, love, clarity and
Message:
inner Knowledge is 'destructive', isn't it? He gave you Knowledge because you asked him for it. Right? You gave him money because he asked you for it. Right? And why did you get in to the Darshan line or attend events or practice Knowledge? Was somebody holding a gun to your head?

I'm not insecure, Selene. At least about this topic. And I'm not a sociopath. I'm simply expressing an opinion to people who have received the same Knowledge as I did. Maybe one of you will give it another chance. And maybe some aspiring person will wander here and see that it's important to make up one's own mind about things this important. And they'll investigate further. Not everyone who received Knowledge was disappointed in it. As a matter of fact, there are a lot of people who really enjoy Maharaji and listening to him.

By the way, I met a guy at a recent community satellite broadcast who had not attended or practiced for years. His wife recently died and he's taking care of his 2 kids. He came here and couldn't believe some of what he read. He said that although he hadn't practiced Knowledge for years, he loved listening to Maharaji and he was eager to get back to practicing regularly again. He told me that when he came here, he posted a message asking for information on local events and someone e-mailed him about the information line for Knowledge events in his area. That's how he was able to come to the event. So you guys helped someone find Maharaji! Far out! Right?

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:01:28 (GMT)
From: Sir David
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Revealing another fallacy
Message:
Maharaji didn't give me knowledge and I had never seen him in person or on film when I 'received knowledge'. He wasn't in this country even.

I completely reject this notion that Maharaji gave me knowledge. All Maharaji did is put me off the practise of knowledge with his inane drivel.

The Mahatma who showed me the techniques of meditation had more understanding about it than Maharaji ever had. That Mahatma no longer follows Maharaji. Her name is Prakash Bai Ji.

Therefore I see absolutely no reason to follow Maharaji. Prakash Bai Ji also never made us promise not to reveal the techniques to anyone else. The techniques of meditation are public domain and she herself said that in the knowledge session.

Maharaji's philosophy is destructive and that is shown quite clearly in the quotes from his father which you decided to post here. But in the modern day, it is also destructive. A premie once said to me that knowledge is just a heavy trip. It certainly is the way Maharaji has layed it down and it has damaged more lives than it has helped.

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 04:30:15 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Sir David
Subject: Revealing another fallacy
Message:
Plus, it was CD that posted info.
He was not an ex.
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Date: Sun, Aug 13, 2000 at 16:26:22 (GMT)
From: Tomo
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: 1972
Message:
1972, 17 and like so many others got sucked into the whole thing.
I now bitterly regret trashing the life I could of had with my family and dear friends at that time. There's a lot of hurt still bottled up from over the years. Depending on how deep you were in, we have all had to rebuild our lives, but mentally its not easy to just move on and forget. I hardly ever meditate which I feel guilty about, once in a blue moon I'll see M in England and so maybe I'm just sitting on the fence as far M is concerned.Have all those who write here truely given up in your heart.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 01:51:28 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Tomo
Subject: I think you answered your own question,
Message:

I now bitterly regret trashing the life I could of had with my family and dear friends at that time. There's a lot of hurt still bottled up from over the years.

Sounds like you regret the damage to 'the heart', you and people close to you suffered, how much 'heart' does a person have to take before they admit they're being stupid and holding onto some Wizard of Oz dream, and damaging their real world in the process?
Don't get me wrong Tommo, like a lot of the twisted definitions filtered into our brains we all got fucked over.
But as a premie, family & friends were less than 'the heart', weird heh, and I wonder who slipped us that one!
If you're talking really good head states from meditation, on it's own pure & simple, no guru involved, why should that be affected? The techniques are just that, techniques, all to do with you, not some magic juju.

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Date: Sun, Aug 13, 2000 at 16:54:54 (GMT)
From: Lurkex
Email: None
To: Tomo
Subject: 1971, and I was 18
Message:
and yes i HAVE given up any hope that MJ is the Lord and Knowledge is the true path. I went through a transition that took about a year, back in 1984.

Giving up that 'hope' was the best thing I ever did, and it was the beginning, not the end, of my real spiritual life. I get from what you're saying that you are on the fence because you feel that if you let go of MJ and the cult, you are letting go of some beautiful experiences you have had, and perhaps some deep hopes of a purpose-filled life, or experiences of something a bit 'beyond.' You don't have to let go of those hopes and visions. MJ absolutely doesn't have a patent on God, meditation, life purpose, your breath, or even the techniques that he calls his. You belong to yourself, and by reclaiming yourself, you can start to notice that anything you liked in the meditation is an intrinsic part of you. Anything you adored in MJ was just a projection of your own goodness. Anything spiritual you felt you have direct access to (God doesn't have any grandchildren, meaning that you don't have to go through an intermediary to get to Her).

What you are experiencing is just cult programming that has made you doubt your own feelings and feel that you are bad and wrong if you don't give your all to MJ and his so-called path. Most of us on this page have woken up from that horrible trance and are in the process of reclaiming our lives, and we invite you to join us. Also, if you want a spiritual life, you can absolutely have it, in a way that feels free and loving to your real self. There are many, many ex-premies who still meditate, not necessarily using MJ's techniques. Many of us feel we have found much better ways to meditate. Others among us don't feel the need.

Jump off the fence, Tomo. You will be okay!

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 13:28:19 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Lurkex
Subject: 1971, and I was 18
Message:
Tomo,

I am trying to think how to answer you.

You must be at an intersection, who do you turn too?

If Shroom was here, he will give a run down
why he seems to be able to get the most out of gm and knowledge.
(I hope he breaks a leg)

The decision is yours.

Like Lurkex and others said, it is the cult that is filling your head.

you see, we all had something implanted in out minds.
The fear of walking away from gm.
We feel a vast emptyness looming every time we want to take that step.
It is conditioning.

As for me I love conflicts. I love dragging my self into unknow regions.

You know why?

Well, ask you self a simple question,
what were you looking for when you decided to take knowledge?
The truth.

If there is truth in leaving maharagi will you continue the lie?

It is simple to walk away if you want to, just do it.
You will wake up tomorrow,
This forum will be here,
You can still go to work and see your freinds,
you will lose premie freinds,
you will gain ex-premie freinds,

The best part is when you can call maharaji lardi or gum ji li
and laugh at yourself,

but then it is all a lila,
maharaji does not care.

Salam

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Date: Sun, Aug 13, 2000 at 21:47:45 (GMT)
From: Gregg
Email: None
To: Lurkex
Subject: Lurkex, you took the words out of my mouth (nt)
Message:
x
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Date: Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 11:36:21 (GMT)
From: Tomo
Email: None
To: Gregg,hamzen,Lurkex,Salam
Subject: Thanks
Message:
Thanks that was Just what I needed
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Date: Sun, Aug 13, 2000 at 11:09:24 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: A not so hypothetical question.
Message:
Which is more important to a starving family, food or knowledge?

Which is more important, the rainforest or maharaji?

Is it better for a 10 years old to be at school or in a festival?

Is it better to donate money to Green peace or EV?

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 01:49:12 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: A not so hypothetical answer from Shri Hans
Message:
excerpted from 'Benevolence' in Hans Yog Prakesh:

The great soul who shows the way to perfection is the only true well wisher of humanity. Unparalleled power resides in such great souls. Whatever we do in this world we do on the strength of our reasoning power. Without this power we would treat our body as a lump of clay. Therefore, a person who experiences this power in its proper perspective, as do these great souls, will be able to perform all his actions correctly, and a person who does not experience the power within himself will be unable to pursue even his own interests, let alone the interest of the Supreme.

If any Knowledge is useful after spiritual Knowledge it is intellectual knowledge. The imparting of intellectual knowledge is much superior to the giving of clothes and food, because the main objective of a man, which is to fulfil his creativity, cannot be accomplished without such knowledge. For one who has never experienced any creativity, to live or to die would be the same. What use is a life spent In ignorance and suffering?

The next most important help we can offer people after giving them these two types of knowledge is physical. To help others by means of one's physical strength is truly a kind of charity. But we should not think that physical service is the only way to lessen the sufferings of others. As a matter of fact physical service is one of the lower forms of service, because it brings only immediate relief. Physical help leaves no permanent change in the situation Feeding a hungry man certainly removes his immediate pain, but he will soon become hungry again. We should understand that wherever there is necessity, suffering is also to be found. If we really want to be happy, there should be no feeling of necessity in our lives. The day our sense of need is completely removed, we will be instantly and truly happy. In that state, hunger will not be an obstacle for us, and no worldly incident will have lessen our joy.

We should understand that the help we need to attain such a state is the most of all. Next in order comes intellectual help and then comes physical help. The unhappiness that we see in this world cannot be eradicated by physical help alone. Unless the way people behave is also totally changed, people will still feel bound by a variety of needs. If these needs are not fulfilled, unhappiness is sure to result. Thus physical help alone is insufficient to remove unhappiness from the earth. The most potent medicine for all suffering is to purify the mind by receiving true Knowledge. One saint has said that if a man's mind is pure, even his enemy becomes his friend and even the snake and the tiger look upon him with love.

All sins and sufferings spring from ignorance. Humanity will be completely happy when man has been introduced to his own power of consciousness and when full self confidence in it has grown, following the realisation of the Knowledge of Truth. We should not even hope for that state of world happiness before this. Even if each household distributes alms daily to the poor, the present predicament of humanity can never be erased. Unless the nature of man as we see it today undergoes a complete change the world will continue in its present distressing state.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 02:11:39 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: shri hans, a spiritually arrogant fascist,
Message:
just what's needed.Lets just have a look at this little piece of text you posted shroom, bearing in mind it's called benevolence.

Therefore, a person who experiences this power in its proper perspective, as do these great souls, will be able to perform all his actions correctly, and a person who does not experience the power within himself will be unable to pursue even his own interests, let alone the interest of the Supreme.
So only premies can do anything well in this world, give us a break, that's so ridiculous it's laughable, you expect anyone to take that seriously?

If any Knowledge is useful after spiritual Knowledge it is intellectual knowledge. The imparting of intellectual knowledge is much superior to the giving of clothes and food, because the main objective of a man, which is to fulfil his creativity, cannot be accomplished without such knowledge. For one who has never experienced any creativity, to live or to die would be the same. What use is a life spent In ignorance and suffering?

So someone starving to death who hasn't got knowledge, what does it matter what happens to them, well this is a message hitler would have been proud of, again I can't believe you're serious about that as a response, that isn't just ridiculous, it's disgusting.

I guess this also means you're worth a thousand ex-premies at least, because we've all forgotten that creativity, in which case it's very sweet of you to explain things so slowly..

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 15:04:01 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Shroom
Subject: Shroom - re: HYP
Message:
Yeah, Shroom - I wouldn't quote the Hans Yog Prakash and still expect any respect here. Even I find the HYP a bit much.

It's like reading the Old Testament about not cooking your food on a certain day of the week or something - might have had it's purpose to those being spoken to at the time, but - Come on - we're not those people - I don't think Shri Hans would be saying alot of that stuff to a savvy Western audience.

IMO.
Regards,Elaine

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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 18:38:43 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: Especially not if he learnt his marketing skills
Message:
at prem pals school of skim & spin.
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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 06:29:40 (GMT)
From: Sir David
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: hamzen
Subject: Cult dogma revealed by Shroom's posts
Message:
There is no point in trying to reason with a closed book. This person already admits that his 'master' is a bare faced liar and yet he hangs onto his every word and those of his father also, even though the dogma is shown to be corrupt and obscene to the extreme.

It is a waste of time to bother to communicate with these people. These people are shown by their words here to be hard-line cultists. They think they have the supreme truth and that we are deluded and inferior. They believe they have to educate us. They are (despite Shroom's ridiculous name) without empathy or understanding of other human beings, as is shown by Shroom's post above.

Shroom has revealed here the basic dogma that lies behind Maharaji's 'mission' and current premies including Elan Vital. He does not believe that simple charity towards one's fellow man is a worthwhile thing. He would rather a person starve to death than to help them. To him, people without knowledge are not worth anything - they would be better off dead. This is the basic belief behind premies' thinking and the reason why they are a blight in this world; a cancer that if allowed to spread, will spread a philosophy of elitism and ruthless uncaring towards one's fellow humans.

Look at Elan Vital. It is a most uncaring and cold organisation and having heard the real dogma behind their beliefs, a dogma that scorns ordinary people and non-premies, (as revealed by Shroom) we can see that Maharaji and premies are indeed an enemy to Mankind and a disease which left unchecked, will cause untold misery and suffering to innocent people.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 19:13:10 (GMT)
From: Shroomananda
Email: None
To: Sir David
Subject: Don't tell me what I believe, Pal. I posted that
Message:
excerpt from Shri Hans as a response to Salam's post. It's not an either/or proposition. Do you really think that Shri Hans or Maharaji want people to starve to death? Come on! To me, he was simply pointing out the validity of spiritual knowledge and putting it in perspective vis a vis intellectual and physical. Feeding people and donating to Greenpeace are worthy causes. And so is someone propagating Knowledge like Maharaji does. Giving people Knowledge of the Divine Light within them is, to me, more beneficial to humanity as a whole. A starving family should be given food and we should save the whales but we should also let people have Knowledge of their inner being.
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Date: Tues, Aug 15, 2000 at 07:45:45 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: That's not what he's saying though is it
Message:
If shri hans had a choice between two people starving to death he would always give the food to the possible premie, that is a definition of fascism whether you can accept that or not.

And secondly, if he's got this powerful number that everyone needs to hear about to awake them surely he would be doing everything in his power to get this message over, and what has the reality been, well only in the early seventies were the numbers up, and that at a time he admits himself he was lying. So how did he do compared to other similar cults, TM (miles bigger),
ISHCKON (miles bigger), Scientology (MUCH bigger), want me to go on?

For the superior power in person he's been a pretty crap communicator, another little puzzle.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 20:07:46 (GMT)
From: Sir David
Email: None
To: Shroomananda
Subject: Of course you believe it
Message:
You posted it because you believe it. Nobody would post all that Shr Hans elitist crap on here unless they either believed in it or were ridiculing it.

The philosophy stinks and everybody here knows it. You cannot post something here and then sheepishly come back and say that you didn't really mean what you posted.

That makes you look even more ridiculous.

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Date: Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 02:59:01 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Shroomanandji Li
Subject: Your posts prove a very good point, and that
Message:
is, you can not think outside the frame of gm.

You are a stunch beliver of him, any attempt to argue otherwise with
you is usless.
To me that is worth a title such as

'The impediant of free will and speech by EV'

makes a good thesis for the Sociological Review. Oh yes

a not so hypothetical question by Shrooomanad ji,
was reciently post..th..pre...

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