Forum V: Archive
Compiled: Wed, Dec 13, 2000 at 14:20:51 (GMT)
From: Nov 22, 2000 To: Dec 10, 2000 Page: 2 Of: 5


Brian -:- So far so good -:- Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 16:30:56 (GMT)
__ Gail -:- So far so good -:- Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 16:43:50 (GMT)
__ __ Salam -:- Thank you Brian -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 14:37:42 (GMT)

Stonor -:- John and Yoko's Year of Peace (OT) -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 23:02:36 (GMT)

Zelda -:- To Steve Quint- request for link -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 20:54:31 (GMT)
__ Stonor -:- To Steve Quint- request for link -:- Thurs, Dec 07, 2000 at 03:27:27 (GMT)
__ Steve Quint -:- From Steve Quint - Here Are Some Links -:- Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 14:14:22 (GMT)
__ Salm -:- Zelda, I thing I put that link -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 23:46:55 (GMT)
__ Steve Quint -:- From Steve Quint- request for link -:- Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 19:47:41 (GMT)
__ __ Zelda -:- Link jinks -:- Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 04:05:00 (GMT)
__ gerry -:- To Salam- in the same vein -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 21:08:57 (GMT)

Kelly -:- Book recommendation -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 15:43:06 (GMT)
__ Disculta -:- Book recommendation -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:57:42 (GMT)
__ __ Kelly None -:- Life102 -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 21:14:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ Monmot -:- Life 102---Go to www.bibliofind.com -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 04:59:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Kelly -:- Life 102---Go to www.bibliofind.com -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 17:28:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ cq -:- Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ... -:- Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 19:57:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Bobby -:- Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ... -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 04:45:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Disculta -:- Jesus - does that ever suck! -:- Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 08:06:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Life101 - now what was that all about? -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 18:49:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ bobby -:- Life101 - now what was that all about? -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 22:12:06 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- 'the reverse could also be true' -:- Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 19:59:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Disculta -:- Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ... -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 02:55:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Kelly -:- Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ... -:- Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 21:20:57 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ... -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 18:56:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ gerry -:- Life102 -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 22:52:09 (GMT)
__ Katie -:- Book recommendation -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:43:07 (GMT)
__ Hal -:- Book recommendation -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:15:38 (GMT)
__ __ Deputy Dog -:- Book recommendation -:- Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 02:43:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ Hal -:- Thanks Dep -:- Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 11:50:06 (GMT)
__ __ Kelly -:- Book recommendation -:- Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 21:45:55 (GMT)
__ __ jondon -:- Book recommendation -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:30:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ Hal -:- I loved that story too Jondon! -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:35:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jerry -:- I loved that story too Jondon! -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:50:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ ham -:- Don't forget the fatboy -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 01:59:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- Hi Jerry -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 21:09:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ ham -:- Hey hal, it's almost 2001!! -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 02:02:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- To Hamzen (ot) -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 14:54:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Disculta -:- Jumping up and down agreeeing! nt -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:00:04 (GMT)

Salam -:- I want to be a president...OT -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 14:00:09 (GMT)

Aussi Ji -:- Question -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 00:45:27 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- Question -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 02:47:35 (GMT)
__ __ Aussi JI -:- Question -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 03:11:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ sam -:- Question to aussie ji (ot) -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 03:58:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Aussi Ji -:- Question to aussie ji (ot) -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 04:13:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Aussi Ji -:- Question to aussie ji (ot) -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 04:17:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ sivan -:- (ot) want to keep in touch? -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 10:06:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ sivan -:- Question to aussie ji (ot) -:- Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 09:57:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ aussi ji -:- I read every day now -:- Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 04:42:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ sivan -:- I read every day now -:- Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 10:26:57 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Aussi Ji -:- I read every day now -:- Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 10:58:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ sivan -:- new format -:- Thurs, Dec 07, 2000 at 08:40:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ sivan -:- glad(0t) -:- Thurs, Dec 07, 2000 at 08:24:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Aussi Ji -:- I want to email you -:- Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 04:30:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ gerry -:- can I quote you? -:- Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 05:08:05 (GMT)

Maurice -:- someone to believe. -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:38:02 (GMT)
__ Aussi Ji -:- someone to believe. -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 00:37:10 (GMT)

Brian -:- Miami Herald article on Bob Mishler -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 19:47:24 (GMT)
__ bill -:- Miami Herald article on Bob Mishler -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 22:41:57 (GMT)
__ Steve Quint -:- Bob Mishler Interview With Gary Tesler -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 22:15:53 (GMT)
__ __ Brian -:- Bob Mishler Interview With Gary Tesler -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:42:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ Steve Quint -:- Bob Mishler Interview With Gary Tesler -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:48:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jean-Michel -:- He slipped on a soap bar in his bathroom -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 08:14:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ toby -:- mata ji a faithfull indian housewife? -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 08:43:47 (GMT)

Way -:- Uncle Maharaji -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 17:50:44 (GMT)
__ JTF -:- In Defense of Bullbagwanna Ji -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 08:25:01 (GMT)
__ __ Salam -:- bugger. -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:41:24 (GMT)
__ suchabanana -:- http://www.manavdharam.org/msd.html -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 21:39:28 (GMT)
__ __ such -:- more about the Satpal Rawat cult uniforms -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 21:46:38 (GMT)
__ Disculta -:- Get this!... -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 18:35:36 (GMT)
__ __ Maurice -:- Get this!... -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 19:31:15 (GMT)
__ __ Curoius George -:- Nephew and niece available for perusal! -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 19:17:58 (GMT)
__ __ __ CG. -:- that was really scarey! -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 19:26:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ jondon -:- Moustache? -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 21:56:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ ulf -:- never ending story? -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:34:11 (GMT)

EV Newsletter -:- Survey about Newsletter -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 16:58:34 (GMT)
__ Cynthia -:- all I can say is WOW! Asking for opinions????nt -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 00:41:32 (GMT)

Maurice -:- Watches ,Boats, Planes, and Houses. -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 00:53:12 (GMT)
__ Joy -:- Well Said, Maurice! (nt) -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 05:38:26 (GMT)

cq -:- Hey, everybody! - the Hamster has a new website! -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 20:25:34 (GMT)
__ Steve Quint -:- He's Got His Second Wind, What Do We Do Now? -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 21:38:53 (GMT)
__ __ cq -:- Talking of second wind ... (urp) -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 18:32:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ Stonor -:- Talking of second wind ... (urp) -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 21:18:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ cq -:- hamsteritosis? Moi? Flattering I don't think ... -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 14:03:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- I know you like having your leg hoovered .. -:- Thurs, Dec 07, 2000 at 05:54:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Cynthia -:- hamsteritosis? HooHeeHaaLOL (nt) -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 15:25:10 (GMT)

JTF -:- Organizational Addiction/abuse/coverups -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 12:05:11 (GMT)
__ Stonor -:- whenever we confuse religion with spirituality... -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 14:11:17 (GMT)
__ __ Disculta -:- Fantastic stuff! Check out the link and -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 17:37:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ Stonor -:- Yes, some of these cult related links at EPO! -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 03:00:58 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Disculta -:- Making a page about all this -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:30:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Making a page about all this -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:50:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ la-ex -:- Fantastic stuff! I loved both quotes... -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 23:02:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ cq -:- ...there's more -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 18:57:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Stonor -:- ...there's more -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 03:27:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ cq -:- cultural traditions?It's all 'Hindu baggage' to M -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 18:44:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ Way -:- Didn't you think the decapitation... -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 18:00:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Steve Quint -:- You Can Take The Guru Out Of The Devotee -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 23:28:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Disculta -:- Um... yes, a bit harsh... -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 22:03:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Kelly -:- I'll second that -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 23:10:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Joy -:- Telling Friends -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 06:03:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Cynthia -:- Everybody has there own pace in life and learning -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 03:33:22 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Marianne -:- Reply to Kelly -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 23:37:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Disculta -:- Reply to Kelly -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 01:22:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Disculta -:- Oh yes, and... -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 01:27:57 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Kelly -:- Oh yes, and...telling friends -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:07:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Disculta -:- Oh yes, and...telling friends -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:26:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Kelly -:- Oh yes, and...telling friends -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 19:06:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ I want to play -:- Sounds like fun -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:29:57 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Kelly -:- Sounds like fun -:- Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:43:22 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Cynthia -:- Rest is very, very good, especially now... -:- Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 03:37:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Curious George -:- I'm very curious about The Yoga Journal -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 04:18:34 (GMT)

Susan -:- interesting Krisna abuse board -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 02:05:15 (GMT)
__ Bazza -:- Also, Identifying a Cult -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 07:00:54 (GMT)

Cynthia -:- Me, My Mom and our Talk About Maharaji.... -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 20:44:01 (GMT)
__ Curious George -:- I've got M's private phone # for your Mum! -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 05:03:28 (GMT)
__ __ Cynthia -:- I've got M's private phone # for your Mum! -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 05:45:54 (GMT)
__ AJW -:- Respect to your Mum Cynthia -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 10:10:22 (GMT)
__ suchabanana -:- We gave to him and can't even get a response!! nt -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 02:40:21 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- Cynthia, your mum is my kind of person -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 01:51:42 (GMT)
__ Bin Liner -:- Me, My Mom and our Talk About Maharaji.... -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 22:04:12 (GMT)
__ cq -:- Me, My Mom and our Talk About Maharaji.... -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 21:13:25 (GMT)
__ __ Marianne -:- Me, My Mom and our Talk About Maharaji.... -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 22:57:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ Happy -:- What a great Mom! -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 13:39:45 (GMT)

Gregg -:- Maharaji: Master of...umm...err...uhh -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 20:37:20 (GMT)
__ Daneane -:- Maharaji: Master of...umm...err...uhh -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 19:36:24 (GMT)
__ Cynthia -:- Maharaji: Master of...umm...err...uhh -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 17:54:05 (GMT)
__ Steve Quint -:- EVIL TALANT -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 16:17:54 (GMT)
__ __ Steve Quint -:- Or -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 16:29:58 (GMT)
__ Curious -:- Let's make up some other silly tecniques! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 22:02:57 (GMT)
__ __ janet -:- actually he did the techniques with us... -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 05:35:18 (GMT)
__ cq -:- Knowledge goes digital ... -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 20:53:58 (GMT)
__ __ Disculta -:- Aaaaarrrrrghhhh! -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 01:04:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ Joy -:- Pearls of Wisdom -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 16:55:38 (GMT)

Way -:- Susan, please email me. (nt) -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 18:16:48 (GMT)

Way -:- 'India Today' Dec. 4 -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 17:10:22 (GMT)
__ suchabanana -:- Sly Baba orders: don't look at Internet ex-sites! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 19:27:20 (GMT)

Salam -:- A thought -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 16:30:47 (GMT)
__ Cynthia -:- A thought -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 22:04:59 (GMT)

Bongo -:- Calling master Bango! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 12:08:40 (GMT)
__ Gail -:- Calling master Bango! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 15:56:29 (GMT)
__ Master Bango -:- Master Bango Answer Call Of Sincere Ex-Premie -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 13:46:09 (GMT)

Sir Dave -:- I'm still waiting, Bimbo -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 00:49:18 (GMT)
__ Gail -:- Where's Jim? -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 16:08:42 (GMT)
__ __ Katie -:- Hi Gail! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 17:22:59 (GMT)
__ __ Salam -:- Where's Jim? -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 16:22:29 (GMT)
__ FA -:- Bimbo is banned (nt) -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 10:44:10 (GMT)
__ __ Katie -:- Thank you FA! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 14:19:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ Salam -:- Thank you FA! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 15:43:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Katie -:- Thank you FA! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 17:21:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ Cynthia -:- Thank you FA! Phew! nt -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 15:37:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Monmot -:- Thank you FA! Phew! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 16:34:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Marianne -:- Thank you FA! -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 20:58:39 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- The only thing necessary, Bimbo -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 11:00:53 (GMT)
__ Goregous George -:- I'm still waiting, Bimbo -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 06:02:06 (GMT)

Nigel -:- The game's up Danny. Got a photo of you..! -:- Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 23:04:06 (GMT)
__ ham -:- Don't wet yourself Nigel, I mean I don't want to -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 04:13:28 (GMT)
__ Joe -:- Who I think 'Danny' is..... -:- Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 23:25:20 (GMT)
__ __ National Enquirer -:- Danny Munter (nt) -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 01:27:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ Joe -:- That was my guess (nt) -:- Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 01:33:30 (GMT)
__ __ Susan -:- cmon Danny is Joe right???? (nt) -:- Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 22:05:03 (GMT)
__ Selene -:- isn't it strange how they all look alike? -:- Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 23:07:45 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Famous forum premies identified -:- Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 23:59:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ cw -:- Famous forum premies identified -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 08:07:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ Selene -:- and to think -:- Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 00:08:56 (GMT)


Date: Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 16:30:56 (GMT)
From: Brian
Email: brian@ex-premie.org
To: Everyone
Subject: So far so good
Message:
The move to the new server is finally done. I think these scripts are working okay. I'll be testing the other scripts scattered around the site (White Pages, Archives, etc).
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Date: Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 16:43:50 (GMT)
From: Gail
Email: None
To: Brian
Subject: So far so good
Message:
You're amazing. I've lost your new phone number and would love to call you both. Please phone me collect so I can put it in my book.
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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 14:37:42 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Gail
Subject: Thank you Brian
Message:
for your time and effort.

I hope the boofheads here appreciate what oy doing.

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 23:02:36 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: John and Yoko's Year of Peace (OT)
Message:
Well, I don't have cable, but for those of you who do, you might want to catch this hour-long documentary while you can, with grainy black and white footage shot in 1969, tomorrow night at 10 pm Montreal time on CBC's Newsworld's program, The Passionate Eye.

Trivia from the newspaper article except for my additions in non-italics: current Federal Health Minister Allan Rock (who wears hemp shirts and takes echinacea for his colds) was a 21-year-old student leader when he ferried the former Beatle around the national capital in his VW Beetle. He remembers stopping at 24 Sussex Drive (Canada's 'White House') so Lennon could drop off a note for Pierre Trudeau (Prime Minister of Canada at the time - died this fall), one of the few politicians who then seemed willing and eager to listen to the concerns of the young.

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 20:54:31 (GMT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Steve Quint
Subject: To Steve Quint- request for link
Message:
Hi Steve

Remember a few weeks ago - the link you put on the forum about things 'spiritual' ? It had short essays on many subjects
I went to it and found some interesting material - but I cant find it again-
Would you repost it for me?

Many thanks
Zelda

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Date: Thurs, Dec 07, 2000 at 03:27:27 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Zelda
Subject: To Steve Quint- request for link
Message:
Hi Zelda!

Always happy to see a post from you. I'm posting a few links in a new thread up above, in case others are interested. Hope that link is among them, but even if it isn't, you'll find more than enough to keep you busy for a looong time! \

Love,

Anna

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Date: Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 14:14:22 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Zelda
Subject: From Steve Quint - Here Are Some Links
Message:
I've gone through some of my posts and here's what I've come up with so far.

Prem

Hell Hath No Fury Like A Woman Scorned

Hell Hath No Fury Like A Supreme Being Scorned

Enjoy

Steve

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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 23:46:55 (GMT)
From: Salm
Email: None
To: Zelda
Subject: Zelda, I thing I put that link
Message:
http://www.truthbeknown.com/

gerry: I know that Stonor already posted some links on AG, but this is the one I used:

http://www.davideck.com/cgi-bin/tests/tests.cgi?action=personality

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Date: Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 19:47:41 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Zelda
Subject: From Steve Quint- request for link
Message:
Are you sure it was me? Your description doesn't ring a bell. Could you give me a bit more detail as to what the link was about or some of the articles there? I've posted a lot of links.

Steve

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Date: Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 04:05:00 (GMT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Steve Quint/Salam
Subject: Link jinks
Message:
Hi

The forum just today popped up on my bookmark- its been down for ages.

I may have the wrong person- Steve- maybe it was Salam.
My Data-specific memory got as far as the 's'

Anyway, the link was a wierd sort of mixed bag spiritual one with some essay exerpts from Blatavsky (?) amoungst others .

Strange references in old type set print and the subjects were turn of the century occult studies. The kind Jim would have a ball with.

The one I am interested in is the effects of the rays of the Sun on white skinned people in the Polynesian countries- believe it or not.

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 21:08:57 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: To Salam- in the same vein
Message:
Do you have that link to the personality test handy? If not I'll look in the archives

-gerry

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 15:43:06 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Book recommendation
Message:
After the Ecstasy, The Laundry by Jack Kornfield
It’s a marvellous book and I’m told his previous one was also A Path with Heart

He has gathered a collection of first hand accounts and stories from a wide range of different spiritual disciplines, telling of all the perils and pitfalls on the way, all the highs and lows.

I haven’t finished it yet ,but last night I was reading Chapter 10 “The Dirty Laundry”

This should be essential reading for any wavering premie. Well for anyone.

Here are some of the sub headings:-
Learning discriminating wisdom
Four major areas in which difficulties arise
These being Misuse of power, misuse of money, misuse of sexuality, misuse of alcohol/drugs
Isolation and Denial
Confusing charisma with wisdom
“Another source of spiritual misunderstanding is our confusion of charisma with wisdom. Certain spiritual leaders possess the ability to evoke extraordinary states. Amplified by our hopes, feelings of bliss and transcendence arise easily around these charismatic ministers , priests, Zen masters, mystics rabbis, and gurus. It is easy to mistake such spiritual powers as definite signs of wisdom or enlightenment or divine love. We forget that charisma and power are just charisma and power, that these energies can just as easily serve demagogues, politicians and entertainers.”
Betrayal as a Fierce Initiation
This is particularly appropriate
And many more
Anyway, it is amazing how this chapter in particular should come into my life right now, and it is also amazing how well it supports what you people have been telling me. I am especially reminded of posts by Disculta and la-ex.
So thanks to you all
Kelly

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:57:42 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: Book recommendation
Message:
I LOVE that book!

Did I mention another favorite cult-exiting book 'Live 102, What to do when your guru sues you' by Peter Williams or McWilliams. I mentioned it somewhere recently, so sorry if I'm repeating myself, but it's absolutely FANTASTIC for us ex-premies, because their guru, John Roger, is so similar in personality it could be the same guy, and because the author explains with great brilliance how mental programming occurs even to very intelligent people.

Everyone read it and larf!

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 21:14:49 (GMT)
From: Kelly None
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: Life102
Message:
Yeah you did mention it and I've been hunting. No trace on amazon uk nor on amazon us. Shame
I have just ordered The Spiritual Tourist' by Mick Wood, the guy who wrote the Sai Baba expose in the Daily Telegraph. Could be interesting, and while doing so I was reminded of a book someone lent me a few years ago called thr Spiritual Supermarket. It contained an account of the run up to and then the embarrsassing fiasco that was 'Millenium' 73. It was a totally cringe making account and I guess was one of the first..drip...drip factors for me . I remember he used the phrase to sum up the premies ...'the starry eyed syndrome' That really hit home. Anyway I searched for it on amazon us and they found it but it's out of print. While I'm on the subject..do I dare watch 'The Lord of the Universe' video.
cringing already!
Kelly
ps Jean Michel has my phone no
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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 04:59:19 (GMT)
From: Monmot
Email: None
To: Kelly None
Subject: Life 102---Go to www.bibliofind.com
Message:
Kelly:

This book is extremely difficult to find. John-Roger's organization tries to buy up all available copies extant.

I just did a search a couple of minutes ago on www.bibliofind.com and they had two copies available. Just put in Life 102 and Peter McWilliams in the search engine bibliofind has and the two books will appear. You then have to email the bookseller and they'll email you back and hold the book for you until you send payment.

I found a copy in a used book store after searching for a long time. Abebooks.com and bibliofind.com rarely have these.

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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 17:28:39 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Monmot
Subject: Life 102---Go to www.bibliofind.com
Message:
Thanks Monmot (my word?) I did that and now there's one left.
Mind you I don't know whether I'll get it since they insist they won't take credit cards yet they put a box to fill in your card details! We shall see.
Love Kelly
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Date: Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 19:57:12 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Kelly None
Subject: Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ...
Message:
is out of print at amazon, but ... enough demand ... enough supply?

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/093158034X/excultarchive/107-8364680-7090168 for reviews (if nothing else, at present).

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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 04:45:49 (GMT)
From: Bobby
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ...
Message:
The rights to Life 102 were taken over by John-Roger in a court suit. The book was then taken off the market. Peter used to have the book available for free, along with his other bestsellers, on his website. The other books remain on McWilliams.com


Life 102 probably is still floating around the net somewhere in electronic form. Years ago I got my copy that way.


Peter died about a year ago of cancer and AIDS. He was persecuted and jailed by the government for his very vocal stance on medical marijuana. Medical marijuana was the only thing that helped his chemotherapy induced nausea. Though legal in the state of California, he was denied use of it.

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Date: Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 08:06:47 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Bobby
Subject: Jesus - does that ever suck!
Message:
I didn't know that about Peter McWilliams - after exposing John-Roger's attempts to sue him, he gets sued and his book about this gets taken off the market!

John-Roger must have Johnny Cochran as a lawyer.

I have to say that this has really pissed me off. I was in my local bookstore today and happened to notice that they are featuring all of John-Roger's books (probably written by Peter!). His whole thing was that he came up with the ideas, and J.R. would sign off on each page to say 'this is okay' - and this was his 'co-authorship.' And the worst thing was that he told Peter that he had AIDS and that he (J.R.) would save him as long as he did this ghost writing for him to make him look good. I hope it is available on the web somewhere. That cult was so pernicious and SO similar to the one we were in, down to the ridiculous rambling satsangs given by an overweight uneducated guy in business suits being gazed at adoringly by drippy eyed followers (his talks sometimes get broadcast on our local access cable and I have to blink to know it's not Maharaji).

Oh well. Strange world.

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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 18:49:20 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Bobby
Subject: Life101 - now what was that all about?
Message:
I liked this quote from Quentin Crisp on http://www.mcwilliams.com/books/books/life1

.
.
.

'The very purpose
of existence is to reconcile
the glowing opinion
we hold of ourselves
with the appalling things
that other people
think about us.


QUENTIN CRISP


P.S. you might like to check out a website run by a 'cyber-friend' (terrible phrase) of mine. It's at http://WWW.DRINKME.NET, and her name is Miranda, and she recently underwent a course of chemo, and writes very perceptively about it.

Best wishes,

Chris

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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 22:12:06 (GMT)
From: bobby
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Life101 - now what was that all about?
Message:
haha. good quote.

the reverse could also be true.

one thing I'm learning is how strongly our own perceptions affect how we experience others and how we experience ourselves.

i'm one that was quite involved with the Insight during the eighties, the group that Peter was involved with. I corresponded a bit with Peter a few years back.

thanks for the link cq, I'll check it out.

best. bobby

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Date: Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 19:59:46 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: bobby
Subject: 'the reverse could also be true'
Message:
Ha!

I love it when that happens.

(but not always).

You say 'how strongly our own perceptions affect how we experience others and how we experience ourselves.'

I'd like to take that very valid insight from a slightly different angle and say:

'how strongly our own perceptions of ourselves affect how we experience others, and how we let those perceptions influence our experience of others.'

It's another angle, but if you can get it, it sheds an interestingly different light.

Let us know about your involvement with this 'Insight' group, if you feel to. I'd be fascinated (having gone through the Rajneesh experience shortly after leaving the Maha in the mid-70s)

regards,

Chris

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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 02:55:31 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ...
Message:
Yes, thanks. I ordered one too, as I lent mine to someone and can't remember who.
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Date: Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 21:20:57 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ...
Message:
Thanks cq ,you make life so easy . I went straight in there and ordered it. Yeah,the reviews had some interesting bits in there.....like how on earth did he get into it in the first place?
Kelly
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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 18:56:30 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: Life102 - what to do when your guru sues you ...
Message:
you managed to get a copy? strange, I thought Amazon said it was out of print.

Anyway, hope it turns up, and in (sort of) answer to your question, how did he get into it in the first place? Well, how did any of us get into idolising a would-be avatar? I'm sure there must have been an element of spiritual pride and self-aggrandisement in there somewhere.

At least this John Roger character had the sense to get a decent writer for his material. Imagine if the Maha had one!

.
.
.
(on second thoughts, don't!)

Cheers,

Chris

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 22:52:09 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Kelly None
Subject: Life102
Message:
Hi Kelly,

Yeah, 'Lord of the Universe' is a big cringe, alright. I watched it with my wife. She was kind.

Glad you're out.

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:43:07 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: Book recommendation
Message:
Thanks, Kelly (and hi!)

I really enjoyed 'A Path With Heart', and want to get this new book as well. Jack Kornfeld is an excellent writer - and a very compassionate and humane person.

Another book I like is 'The Highly Sensitive Person' (not sure if the title is correct, but it's close) by Elaine Aron. She has a good section on false teachers.

There is also a book called 'The Guru Papers' that a lot of us here have read (at least in part - it is somewhat scholarly and dry!). It is basically a discussion of authoritarian structures. There are some very interesting ideas in this book - even if you don't agree with all of them.

Take care,
Katie

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:15:38 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: Book recommendation
Message:
Hi Kelly,

I read that book a couple of months ago and it really uplifted me. I particularly liked the way that he excluded nothing from the spiritual pathway. Mind is not demonised but enlisted as a friend and all the tough parts of life are included in learning. Maha always created a feeling of 'if your not blissed you're dissed.' Ridiculous!

Since I've checked out other paths of self discovery like Zen , Tao and psychology it becomes more and more apparent how limited, inept and incomplete are the spurious teachings of Mahaha!

Love
Hal

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Date: Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 02:43:13 (GMT)
From: Deputy Dog
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Book recommendation
Message:
All great books. Here are some of my favourites that I regularly plagiarize from:

Insight Meditation: The Practice of Freedom by Joseph Goldstein

A Gradual Awakening by Stephan Levine

Journey of Awakening: A Meditator's Guidebook and

Grist for the Mill by Ram Dass

Zen Comments on the Mumonkan by Zenkei Shibayama

Psycho-Cybernetics by Maxwell Maltz

Zen Flesh Zen Bones by Paul Reps

But hey, the menu is still not the meal.

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Date: Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 11:50:06 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: Thanks Dep
Message:
I've read all those . I do get a lot of inspiration from reading but you are right in saying that the menu is not the meal.

Talking of the meal you should try it without all that unhealthy and greasy Lard!

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Date: Mon, Dec 04, 2000 at 21:45:55 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Book recommendation
Message:
Yes I absolutely agree 'limited inept and incomplete' He tries to whitewash us all with his 'simplicity trick' You know 'How simple can you be?' It gets you on the defensive straight away because you know you're a complex being, so probably you're disqualified from the kingdom of heaven!! I think he uses this approach to sort of over compensate for his own ignorance. In the same way that .he ridicules and belittles the world of the intellect and culture. I'm in danger of getting really insulting now so I'd better stop.
Love Kelly
p.s. are you a computer?
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:30:28 (GMT)
From: jondon
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Book recommendation
Message:
Here is an amusing story from the book about a Zen Buddhist master and his disciple that I think is at the very heart of the book:

A disciple sent his master faithful accounts of his spiritual progress:

In the first month, the student wrote, 'I feel an expansion of consciousness and experience oneness with the universe.' The master glanced at the note and threw it away. The following month, this is what the student had to say: 'I finally discovered that the Divine is present in all things.' The master seemed disappointed.

In his third letter the disciple enthusiastically explained, 'The mystery of the One and the many has been revealed to my wondering gaze.' The master yawned. The next letter said, 'No one is born, no one lives, and no one dies, for the self is not.' The master threw up his hands in despair.

After that a month passed by, then two, then five, then a whole year. The master thought it was time to remind his disciple of his duty to keep him informed of his spiritual progress. The disciple wrote back, 'I am simply living my life. And as for spiritual practice, who cares?' When the master read that he cried, 'Thank God. He's got it at last.' -

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 16:35:52 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: jondon
Subject: I loved that story too Jondon!
Message:
That's why I don't practice any spiritual disciplines as such. I just live my life as it comes , with awareness and appreciation.

Sometimes I sit quietly in self observation but only if it is the right thing to do in the moment. I certainly have renounced all effort towards attaining any particular state of consciousness and I try not to hold beliefs about God or any power outside of myself. It feels good!

Best wishes to you,
hal

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:50:42 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: I loved that story too Jondon!
Message:
Hal,

I so much agree. There is so much to learn and be rewarded by just by being aware of who we are as we are, RIGHT NOW, then there is in chasing rainbows that can only make us feel blue because we never seem to find them. I've only had very brief moments of being in 'spiritual' consciousness that I suffered for decades chasing, because I wouldn't allow myself any respite until I achieved such awareness. Now, I just want to be aware of NOW, and who I am in it.

Consciousness rules! And science does to. I find reading such authors as Steven Pinker, Howard Bloom, and Richard Dawkins to be much more enlightening than stuff coming out of the new age community. But that's just me, I guess.

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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 01:59:23 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Don't forget the fatboy
Message:
Hi jerry,

well can one believe it,
a lesson in zen taking place at channel 5!!

it'll be zen koans next

but fatboy slim said it all with 'right here, right now'
Did you ever see the evolution video that went with that track, wicked stuff.

but basho's me fave if we're getting all zen

and yeah, getting a second deck next week, can start mixing again
been hearing this weird mixed up shit coming out of detroit at the mo, fucking excellent stuff, think you'll love it

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 21:09:36 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Hi Jerry
Message:
It's a new one for me Jerry as I've been depending on making requests to and feeling abandoned by some kind of Divine power for most of my life.

I was frightened and apprehensive of abandoning my belief in a superior power but I feel so much more in touch with my true self since I renounced the God myth. I like Zen at the moment as there is no belief in God or soul or immortality . In Zen there is just consciousness or Zen. It's not even restricted to Buddhism . I can be a Zen atheist or agnostic.

I must get to read these authors you mentioned as I'm definitely ill informed in those areas.

Best wishes to you ,
Hal

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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 02:02:54 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Hey hal, it's almost 2001!!
Message:
allwight matee

when you returning to the land of the rain cloud?

are you gonna be down south?

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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 14:54:52 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: To Hamzen (ot)
Message:
Hi Hackney ham,

I notice you've had a few drops of rain this year!

I'm delaying my return as long as possible but I have to get back there in the next 6 mths unfortunately.

We'll be somewhere in the south of England but no idea where yet.

I'll be sure to contact you and go for a drink when we do settle back.

Cheers
hal ( steve.mulley@clix.pt )

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:00:04 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Jumping up and down agreeeing! nt
Message:
YES!
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 14:00:09 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: I want to be a president...OT
Message:
If you Americans can accept someone saying this stuff

http://members.tripod.com/~TheCosmicDivide/gw.html

Then I am sure you can keep up with me.

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 00:45:27 (GMT)
From: Aussi Ji
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Question
Message:
What ever became of Bob Mishler?I heard he died years ago in a plane crash.
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 02:47:35 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Aussi Ji
Subject: Question
Message:
He had a heart attack while flying a small plane to a confrence meeting on cults. Some people think the plane was tampered with that is why he crashed.
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 03:11:35 (GMT)
From: Aussi JI
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Question
Message:
Thank You,I do recall hearing something along those lines quite a few years ago,but wasn't sure.
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 03:58:52 (GMT)
From: sam
Email: None
To: Aussi JI
Subject: Question to aussie ji (ot)
Message:
hi aussie,
do i know you? i noticed u know who i am.
regards.........s
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 04:13:35 (GMT)
From: Aussi Ji
Email: None
To: sam
Subject: Question to aussie ji (ot)
Message:
Hi Sam, I thought you would catch on.It's me Tony.
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 04:17:51 (GMT)
From: Aussi Ji
Email: None
To: sam
Subject: Question to aussie ji (ot)
Message:
Sorry I have to get used to how to send these posts correctly.It is me,sam,Tony.
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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 10:06:05 (GMT)
From: sivan
Email: None
To: Aussi Ji
Subject: (ot) want to keep in touch?
Message:
i do
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Date: Tues, Dec 05, 2000 at 09:57:29 (GMT)
From: sivan
Email: None
To: Aussi Ji
Subject: Question to aussie ji (ot)
Message:
hi tony,
that thought entered my head. thought of u. only one i did think of actually. glad to say hi- often think of u.
haven't been here lately- jussed stopped in. lucky to catch u.
bye for now
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Date: Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 04:42:23 (GMT)
From: aussi ji
Email: None
To: sivan
Subject: I read every day now
Message:
Hi sivan,I have ceased going to programs,and am feeling great.I love to meditate still,it is something I did before receiving knowledge anyway,so I will keep enjoying it.Cheryl is cool about my exing.We'll keep in touch
Cheers Tony
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Date: Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 10:26:57 (GMT)
From: sivan
Email: None
To: aussi ji
Subject: I read every day now
Message:
hi tony,
very interesting to hear, cause i've known u a long time. i could see u experiencing 'it' all again tho' some time (dont quote me.. heehe)
i used to meditate before k too. have read a lot of interesting stuff here about techniques and how widespread they are and about the lineage. i find meditation is still there- k and any other type i might do- or yoga. cheryl is cool. say hi.
bye for now
sivan
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Date: Wed, Dec 06, 2000 at 10:58:17 (GMT)
From: Aussi Ji
Email: None
To: sivan
Subject: I read every day now
Message:
Hi Sivan,
Cheryl sends her regards to you too

Tony(Aussi JI)

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Date: Thurs, Dec 07, 2000 at 08:40:11 (GMT)
From: sivan
Email: None
To: Aussi Ji
Subject: new format
Message:
with new format, just read some of your back posts (dont read mine- i just see something and go- blah, blah, without much thought,,,,,,,,). but i thought in all the time we've known each, i just started to get to know u.
sivan.
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Date: Thurs, Dec 07, 2000 at 08:24:11 (GMT)
From: sivan
Email: None
To: Aussi Ji
Subject: glad(0t)
Message:
tony, is this a big thing for u?
i imagine it is. hope u r going ok.
feel free to say hi on my e-mail.
i have read everything on this site- and then printed it out and read it all again. obsessional? then i thought 'ok, get on with it... life ie'
but it is still such a big thing- working thru' it.
love
sivan
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Date: Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 04:30:30 (GMT)
From: Aussi Ji
Email: None
To: sivan
Subject: I want to email you
Message:
Hi Sivan,My computer spat the dummy a while back,so I lost all my email addresses(including yours)Can you send me an email so I can reply to you?
I will reply to you then
Love Tony.
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Date: Fri, Dec 08, 2000 at 05:08:05 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Aussi Ji
Subject: can I quote you?
Message:
'Spat the dummy?'

god that's great!!!

This is a little vulgar, but have you heard the saying 'shit the bed?'

It means the same thing (I think!)

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:38:02 (GMT)
From: Maurice
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: someone to believe.
Message:
Realising a freind was two steps ahead of me, and I two steps behind, the thought came to me that my greatest loss after Rawat was the loss of an unsophisticate understanding of god as being someone I saw and felt at the centre of an Indian Paisley bedspread hanging on the wall of a friends apartment,once when I was really stoned on grass or a bit of black or red Leb. or anything that just happened to be about, listening to Abraxas. From a simple vision like that ,when I felt the presence of God in my heart, I moved on and traded my feeling for something my intellect and emotions convinced me was the truth. Now two steps further down the road I looked back at my old freind and saw what we had lost and given away was our love of god, Because I rejected Rawat and all I had made my belief system, I had also rejected and lost my love and simplicity .It has taken me many years to look back and see myself as alone without my old friend , and open myself again and trust myself and feel a love inside myself that has nothing to do with divine light mission or being stoned. Things are getting simple again and the beauty and love I feel inside occurs.
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 00:37:10 (GMT)
From: Aussi Ji
Email: None
To: Maurice
Subject: someone to believe.
Message:
Good onya mate.Sounds good to me.
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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 19:47:24 (GMT)
From: Brian
Email: brian@ex-premie.org
To: Everyone
Subject: Miami Herald article on Bob Mishler
Message:
If anyone remembers an interview with, or an article about Bob Mishler published by the Miami Herald in 78-79 will you please email me.

I'm trying to narrow down a library search to the month, week, or day that it was published.

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 22:41:57 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Brian
Subject: Miami Herald article on Bob Mishler
Message:
I believe it was around the time of holi. 78 or 79.
I bet 78.
the other times could have been around guru puja 78 79
July was the usual time for puja (good grief!)
and march was the usual holi time.
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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 22:15:53 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: Bob Mishler Interview With Gary Tesler
Message:
He indicated that it was to be his younger son who was going to succeed him and become the Guru Maharaj Ji. What actually happened was that when the guru died, there were some very dubious circumstances surrounding his death, but that's another story as well.

Does anybody know anything about the 'very dubious circumstances' surrounding the death of m's father? Here's the link.


I'm dying to know.

Steve

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:42:52 (GMT)
From: Brian
Email: brian@ex-premie.org
To: Steve Quint
Subject: Bob Mishler Interview With Gary Tesler
Message:
Bob said that Maharaji suspected Mata Ji of having poisoned Hans. This was related to me by a close friend of Bob's in a phone conversation a couple of years ago.

But Maharaji was too young at the time of his father's death to have thought this on his own. My best guess is that he was told this by someone else years later - like a mahatma or someone with an axe to grind against Mata Ji.

Whether she poisoned her husband or not isn't something that we can find out, but I thnk that Maharaji believed it possible at the time that he told Bob, whether or not he believes it anymore.

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:48:39 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Brian
Subject: Bob Mishler Interview With Gary Tesler
Message:
Interesting answer but why, if Mata Ji was a devoted Hindu as m has said, and if Hindu women were so devoted to their husbands that they would even throw themselves on funeral pyres, would Mata Ji conceivably want to poison her husband?

Something's really strange here.

Steve

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 08:14:46 (GMT)
From: Jean-Michel
Email: None
To: Steve Quint
Subject: He slipped on a soap bar in his bathroom
Message:
and broke his head. That's another version reported here 2 or 3 years ago by someone who heard it from an old Indian mahatma.

That's why his death was totally unexpected.

I guess he woke up on that day and didn't meditate, or had too much bang the previous evening!

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 08:43:47 (GMT)
From: toby
Email: None
To: Jean-Michel
Subject: mata ji a faithfull indian housewife?
Message:
I follower of 'bhagwan'(osho) once told me that his master once
visited mata ji to find out about m's father.
She was obviously very frustrated and made clear to him
that Shri hans was a fraud.

Maybe that inspired to do the same business ,i don't know.

I have read that later myself in one of bhagawan-magazines.

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 17:50:44 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Uncle Maharaji
Message:
Maharaji's nephew continues the family tradition and explains the true meaning of satsang. Click on Shradhey, part 1. (Requires Real Player).
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 08:25:01 (GMT)
From: JTF
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: In Defense of Bullbagwanna Ji
Message:
He is giving away these 'holy discourses'....his baby brother can charge for his nonsense

The nephew speaking in broken English leads me to wonder if he isn't getting ready to come after some of the Western pie

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:41:24 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: JTF
Subject: bugger.
Message:
This little out of date moron crashed my computer. I hate gurus.
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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 21:39:28 (GMT)
From: suchabanana
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: http://www.manavdharam.org/msd.html
Message:
Check out the photo of Bal Bhagwanji's (SatPal's) very militaristic 'honor guard' of loyal troops -- his private Wehrmacht Peace Corps!

Polluting spirituality with gross material gratification and worldly power for the parasitic guru's personal gain. How industrious and original!

Delusions of... Must be some kind of family illness.

It's really sikh, sikh, sikh.

http://www.manavdharam.org/msd.html

Peace,

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 21:46:38 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: suchabanana
Subject: more about the Satpal Rawat cult uniforms
Message:
'Members of 'Manav Sewa Dal' are generally identified by their uniform i.e. male members wear grey shirt, khaki pant and dark blue cap while female members wear either suit or sari and blouse of mustard colour and khaki cap during sewa or attending training camps either organised by Sewa Dal itself or during the public functions/fairs.'

Peace,

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 18:35:36 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Get this!...
Message:
From Satpal's website:

'As Shri Hans Ji Maharaj said, 'I have been offered donations large enough to complete the construction of this Ashram, but that is not what I want. I prefer to give each and every devotee a chance to participate in this holy and meritorious work. Service is the expression of love, and this kind of spontaneous loving service will gradually build Prem Nagar, the ‘City of Love’.'

Could be rewritten in current time:

As Prempal Maharaji said, 'I have been offered donations large enough to complete the construction of this (World Tour/House/Plane/etc.), but that is not what I want. I prefer to give each and every devotee a chance to participate in this holy and meritorious work and keep the cash for more yachts and planes'

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 19:31:15 (GMT)
From: Maurice
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: Get this!...
Message:
There are no limits on this family of con artists,it would seem that there is no end to the amount of credible scams these guys are willing to get up to by using the name of God . I'm saddened to think of the number of vulnerable individuals who will be pressurised by their peers to participate in a slave labour project for the greater glory of another asshole , pulling the same old rabbit out of the hat and using the same pain in the arse concepts to terrorise another generation and many thousands of poor people who will hopefully now come to their senses and not give their all for the greater purpose of having a makeover on the old family home, or the future city of love, give me a break.
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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 19:17:58 (GMT)
From: Curoius George
Email: None
To: All
Subject: Nephew and niece available for perusal!
Message:
I listened to a young female speaking and watched her speak there too. She was speaking in Hindhi and only spoke English sporadically, on Real Play as I assume you listened to a young male. I assume they are nephew and niece - sat Pal's kids but you know what assuming does it makes an ass out of you and me - but we're prabably right as these guys like to keep it all in the family.

C.G.

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 19:26:27 (GMT)
From: CG.
Email: None
To: All
Subject: that was really scarey!
Message:
I just listened to nephew speaking. He was just like M was in the 80's really scarey stuff - moustache and all.

C.G.

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 21:56:11 (GMT)
From: jondon
Email: None
To: CG.
Subject: Moustache?
Message:
Do you call that growth of pre-pubescent puberty beneath Maharaji's nose a Moustache? I thought perhaps he had trained a hairy catapillar to remain still above his lip. Only problem was, this hairy catapillar is predicting a mild winter. His nephew on the other hand, now that's a Moustache.
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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:34:11 (GMT)
From: ulf
Email: None
To: jondon
Subject: never ending story?
Message:
I just seen it to
it looks like he is beliving in what he is doing,saying !!!
Like M said : its an endless saga that just goes on ,and on ,and on , and on ,
I dont think there is a end to this madness
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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 16:58:34 (GMT)
From: EV Newsletter
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Survey about Newsletter
Message:
Noticed this today whilst perusing EV site:

http://www.zoomerang.com/recipient/survey.zgi?ID=0WCX57FJSXE3

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 00:41:32 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: EV Newsletter
Subject: all I can say is WOW! Asking for opinions????nt
Message:
ny
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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 00:53:12 (GMT)
From: Maurice
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Watches ,Boats, Planes, and Houses.
Message:
The thing I notice about rolex watches is that if I have one on my wrist the energy stops flowing into my hands, causing a feeling of deadness in my body. On some very expensive boats I had the feeling of leaving my real self on land and instead had a kind of magazine self ,like in' Hello', on board. In expensive planes all I could think of was when will I be landing. Expensive houses are places to suffocate feelings and in them its hard to breath, the air is full of static and electrical energy that causes anxiety as well as claustraphobia.To me a man who gathered all these particular things around himself is a very insecure person , particularly when that person is obsessive in regard to constantly referring to them, and his ownership of the items. So much so that it begins to look like he's shoreing up a crumbling inner network of deeply rooted self deception. A man who has not been able to become a whole human being would be obsessed with the trappings of life without integrating them, into a cohesive loving inner and outer world. So, to do this repeatedly , and at the same time have to convince thousands of other people that this is normal behaviour leads me to turn my attention to the psychopathological nature of such a person. P.P.Rawats behaviour patterns seem to show all the signs of someone who is empty inside and out. The signs are on the wall for all to read, so why hasn't he crumbled or turned into a flake or abused someone enough to face ciminal charges? The answer is , he has, he abuses his power and that is why everyone close to him is covering for him,they are his victims. With out an expensive watch how can he decide who he really is today. Maurice.
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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 05:38:26 (GMT)
From: Joy
Email: None
To: Maurice
Subject: Well Said, Maurice! (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 20:25:34 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Hey, everybody! - the Hamster has a new website!
Message:
check this!
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 21:38:53 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: cq
Subject: He's Got His Second Wind, What Do We Do Now?
Message:
Thanks, cq.

Steve

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 18:32:08 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Steve Quint
Subject: Talking of second wind ... (urp)
Message:
... time for

cult communion? ??

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 21:18:31 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Talking of second wind ... (urp)
Message:
Good Whatever-it-Is, Chris!!!!

Is THAT how you celebrated your 46th!!! If you want to avoid Mad Cow disease or antibiotic overdose or developing breasts from all the hormones they pump into farm-factory animals, it really is much healthier IMHO to try vegetarianism! (no wonder the King of Hamsters advocated it ... he could see where it was all going with his awesome omniscience and wanted to protect his own hide and next of kin!)

BTW, did you know that guinea pigs were an Incan delicacy! You can still buy them for that purpose in Peruvian markets - no, you can't find them in their supermarkets!

(and you can forget the platonic hugs and especially kisses for a while! ;-)

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 14:03:44 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: hamsteritosis? Moi? Flattering I don't think ...
Message:
... but talking of flattery:
.
.
.
A carpet layer had just finished installing carpet for a lady. He
stepped out for a smoke, only to realize that he had lost his
cigarettes. In the middle the room, under the carpet, was a bump.

'No sense pulling up the entire floor for one pack of smokes,' he said to
himself. He proceeded to take his hammer and flatten the hump.

As he was cleaning up, the lady came in. 'Here,' she said, handing him
his pack of cigarettes. 'I found them in the hallway.'

'Now,' she said, 'if only I could find my sweet little hamster.'

.
.
.
;)

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Date: Thurs, Dec 07, 2000 at 05:54:20 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: I know you like having your leg hoovered ..
Message:
That's supposed to be a paraphrase of 'having your leg pulled'.

Nice to see you're still posting jokes! In return, here is the joke Salam sent me today:

The Not-So-Dumb Blonde

A blonde and a lawyer are seated next to each other on a flight
from
Los Angeles to New York. The lawyer asks if she would like to play a fun game.

The blonde, tired, just wants to take a nap, so she politely
declines and rolls over to the window to catch a few winks. The lawyer persists and explains that the game is easy and a lot of fun.

He says, 'I ask you a question, and if you don't know the answer, you pay me five dollars, and vice versa.'

Again, she declines and tries to get some sleep.

The lawyer, now agitated, says, 'Okay, if you don't know the
answer, you pay me $5, and if I don't know the answer, I will pay you $500.'

This catches the blonde's attention and, figuring there will be no
end to this torment, agrees to the game.

The lawyer asks the first question: 'What's the distance from the earth to the moon?'

The blonde doesn't say a word, reaches into her purse, pulls out a $5.00 bill, and hands it to the lawyer.

'Okay,' says the lawyer, 'your turn.'

She asks, 'What goes up a hill with three legs and comes down with four legs?'

The lawyer, puzzled, takes out his laptop computer and searches all his references ... no answer. He taps into the air phone with his modem and searches the Internet and the Library of Congress ... no answer. Frustrated, he sends e-mails to all his friends and coworkers but to no avail.

After an hour, he wakes the blonde and hands her $500.

The blonde thanks him and turns back to get some more sleep.

The lawyer, who is more than a little miffed, stirs the blonde and asks, 'Well, what's the answer?'

Without a word, the blonde reaches into her purse, hands the
lawyer $5, and goes back to sleep.

And you thought blondes were dumb.

I know you certainly don't think blonds are dumb! Only dumb people do - that's how they first established the psycho-dynamics of 'projection' ;-)

)~(

Anna

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 15:25:10 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: hamsteritosis? HooHeeHaaLOL (nt)
Message:
ny
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 12:05:11 (GMT)
From: JTF
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Organizational Addiction/abuse/coverups
Message:
http://www.trancenet.org/krishna/opinion/addict-I.shtml
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 14:11:17 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: JTF
Subject: whenever we confuse religion with spirituality...
Message:
Great link JTF, thanks. Here is her interesting conclusion about 'spiritual materialism':

Schaef says that addiction is a spiritual disease. She writes, 'Indeed, whenever we confuse religion with spirituality, we are opting for the structure, control, and rules of an addictive system. This reliance on religion may remove us from the inner search only we can do from the depths of our own being.'


Anna

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 17:37:13 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Fantastic stuff! Check out the link and
Message:
here's another great quote from it;

'when dishonesty and denial are the norm, members believe that the organization would not survive if it were honest'

As I was reading it, I wanted to copy and paste about half of it to put on the forum here. I think that this article deserves a permanent place on the website. It describes the qualities of a cult in terms of the addiction process in a way that most premies and exes will recognize. This kind of information was one of the big helping factors in consolidating my leaving in 1984. I was exploring the whole idea of dysfunctional families because of my own feelings of grief, and later read an article in Yoga Journal that compared gurus to the addicted leader of the dysfunctional family, and pointed out that most people in cults came from such families. Bingo! Drip, drip drip flood, flood...

Love Disculta

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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 03:00:58 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: Yes, some of these cult related links at EPO!
Message:
I've been thinking the same thing Disculta. There are a number of related links that should be permanently posted at EPO: that one, the Krishnamurti 'abdication' speech, the Rick Ross link to 'Manipulative People', as well as other anti-cult sites. From my reading, it seems to be very helpful for cult members to see the pattern reflected in other cults. A number of sites have links to EPO and there should be something like that here, IMHO.

Love to you too, Disculta,

Anna

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:30:07 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Making a page about all this
Message:
I am in discussion with Jean-Michel about making a page with links and actual articles about all this. Sounds like you have great resources for this, too. Wanna help? I'm moving really slowly on it.

Love, You know who...

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:50:04 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: stonor21@hotmail.com
To: Disculta
Subject: Making a page about all this
Message:
Count me in, Disculta!

I lost all my old bookmarks in the June 2000 crash and burn, but I'll help if I can - I'm entering my relatively slow season - I tell people we'll get together when the ground freezes, which is far more frequent than when hell freezes over, at least here!

Love, Anna

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 23:02:49 (GMT)
From: la-ex
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: Fantastic stuff! I loved both quotes...
Message:
Disculta-I loved both of those quotes, and think they should be displayed somewhere on this site....
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 18:57:49 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: ...there's more
Message:
More from http://www.trancenet.org/krishna/opinion/addict-III.shtml:

QUOTE:
By maintaining an addictive system, ISKCON is actually cheating sincere
religious seekers who join the organization.

Schaef also notes that addictive organizations tend to drive away their best employees. This
has been one of the effects of the addictive system in ISKCON. Unless the organization
heals itself, it will cease to exist. Even now, most people who remain are there because they
derive some benefit in terms of money or admiration. 'Ordinary' members are being driven
out by economic necessity, while leaders still derive financial support from the temples or
from their supporters.

.
.
.

'... addictive organizations tend to drive away their best employees'

- probably with words like this:

'You premies are all stuck in your ratholes, and the only exciting thing about a rathole is
when the mother rat comes out backwards.'

Maharaji said that!

(I wonder who the mother rat represents? Or did he mean 'Rawat' coming out backwards ???? I need a drink %~0

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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 03:27:47 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: ...there's more
Message:
Hi cq!

Great link isn't it. Even covers some of the mainstream 'cults' like the ones hamzen and I have been dealing with in education and social work.

'You premies are all stuck in your ratholes, and the only exciting thing about a rathole is when the mother rat comes out backwards.'

Sounds like another 'cunt' put down - doesn't m know anything about his cultural traditions?!!

Anna

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 18:44:42 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: cultural traditions?It's all 'Hindu baggage' to M
Message:
... at least, when he wants it to be.

Consider this tasty little morsel that Kelly has discovered among her old DLM/EV publications:


' Q. What is the purpose of all the other teachers that are on the earth now?

A. When there is a tree, beside that tree there are many weeds. Right? And these weeds
are unnecessary. What do they do there? They are just there . And when this tree is really
going to be something it is going to abolish these weeds. Then you will find no sign of them,

Q. Is there no purpose to them at all then?

A. None at all. None at all. They are just wasting one's time. People go to them, then it
takes five years for them to decide no, no, he is not a true master, let me look for
something else. And then they go to somebody else and they waste their time again. They
waste five years unnecessarily. There is no use in this. To waste five years of your time. It
is always unnecessary. If there is only one master,you know, everybody can rush to him.
But because there are these weeds they are stopped from coming.'


.
.
.
Culture you won't get with the Maha. Not even an acceptance that other 'teachers' might have something to offer. The man's arrogance (and ignorance) always was mind-numbingly astounding. Perhaps that was part of his attraction.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.

PS. No I didn't get laid on my 46th!

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 18:00:16 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: Didn't you think the decapitation...
Message:
...was a bit harsh? There are easier ways for a devotee to leave his guru.
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 23:28:09 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Way
Subject: You Can Take The Guru Out Of The Devotee
Message:
But you can't take the devotee out of the guru.

Steve

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 22:03:07 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Um... yes, a bit harsh...
Message:
it makes DLM look rather wimpy. I mean, how many decapitations did we have? What's our big problem, anyway, since we didn't have any decapitations? Why don't we just get off it and get on with our lives!

'...But I did get decapitated! I'm still trying to glue myself back together...'

BTW, I am proposing to Brian that we have a page on this website to store articles like this about cults and psychology/addiction information. I think it is very important in exiting for many people.

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 23:10:29 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: I'll second that
Message:
That would be very helpful, and while we're on the subject, do you still have the article from Yoga Journal you mentioned in your post above?

What you said about it really struck a chord, and also highlighted a problem I now have....which is...What and how to tell my premie friends who are still so deeply dependant on MJ and his cult. One in particular comes from such a dysfunctional family, it makes mine look like the Teddy Bears picnic!

This is the main reason I have remained anonymous...I haven't told them yet. I haven't decided what to tell them. I know that the truth, the whole truth would be just too devastating, but I also know that I can't palm them off with some vague statement. So I have been biding my time and trying to weigh up whether to tailor the truth so it won't hurt too much. Or What?

Do you or anyone else have some advise on this?
Love Kelly

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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 06:03:35 (GMT)
From: Joy
Email: joy52@earthlink.net
To: Kelly
Subject: Telling Friends
Message:
I'd be kind of cautious, Kelly. I have maintained a lot of my old premie friends for many years by specifically not speaking about M with them after I left. I didn't want to alienate them from me as friends, I valued their friendship too much. Yes, I know they are trapped in a cult, but at this point we're all mature adults and that's their choice, to continue to believe the M fantasy. It's like a lot of my family who are right wing Christians, I just have to let them have their beliefs and get on with my own, and not try and de-convert them from their thinking, but still love them for the dear folks they otherwise are. For one thing it's just too tiring. And everyone has a right to their own opinions and beliefs, IMO, even if they are what we USED to believe in.

You need to decide if it's more imporant to you to try and de-program your premie friends and risk losing or distancing them (almost certain to happen, people like to decide these things for themselves) or keep them as friends and just let the M issue fade into the background (if, of course, you have other things in common besides M, I would assume you do). All my premie friends know I've not been going to programs or practicing K. for over 18 years now, and in their own way, in their own time, they've started to come to the conclusion that perhaps chasing all over the globe after him and donating their hard-earned cash isn't the best lifestyle, but I just feel it has to be their realization, I can't make it for them. They will see that you no longer practice or participate, I guess it's called now, and if curious will ask you why. If not, I'd just leave it. Nothing can be more obnoxious than the newly converted _______ (fill it in, pick a religion/new age system like EST, Amway salesperson etc.) Including ex-premies, I think, if too heavy-handed about it to those still involved.

This is just my personal style and experience with premie friends, others may have a different story.

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 03:33:22 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Joy
Subject: Everybody has there own pace in life and learning
Message:
Hi Joy,

I liked your post. I have a sister who was never involved in the cult as much as I, yet still holds on. I love her so much, and value her friendship as a sister and friend, that I don't talk to her about Maharaji anymore.

Everyone has their own learning curve, be it intellectual, emotional or spiritual. When she is ready, I will be strong enough to support her through the process of exiting the cult, when and if that happens.

I will never place my my relationship with her at risk because of what I have learned about M. And because she is very inactive in the cult, I just don't talk to her about my own revolution and new understandings.

Best,
Cynthia

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 23:37:13 (GMT)
From: Marianne
Email: MarianneDB@aol.com
To: Kelly
Subject: Reply to Kelly
Message:
Kelly: I'd be interested in discussing this off line if you want to email me.


Marianne

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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 01:22:55 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Marianne
Subject: Reply to Kelly
Message:
Yeah.... it is definitely an interesting challenge!

When I was exiting, I was pretty visible, because I had this practice in which I did various healing/therapies with people who were often exiting. I worked with PAMs and some instructors who were flirting with leaving; some did, somd didn't (obviously it wasn't my decision). Anyway, I was absolutely out of the cult, but because I was living in Miami, surrounded by thousands of VERY encultified premies, I was very moderate in my public communications. I found that in order to work with people effectively, I had to use my genuine understanding of the feelings that were involved in being a devotee. If I just dissed them, I would be of no help whatsoever. So it was a great education in being very flexible in my communications. In talking to other non-premie therapists, who also saw premies in their practices, I realized that I had better luck, on the whole, because I wasn't rolling my eyes, on any level, at the strange set of beliefs and feelings involved.

The line that I have found to be the most influential and important, BAR NONE, is this line of pointing out the dysfunctions. In other words, starting to perceive and relate to the whole phenomenon of MJ and the cult through the lens of a bit of psychological sophistication. Kelly, I get the impression that you have some psychological sophistication yourself. I think this is the approach to take in talking to people that you care about, and would like to give some new information to. When it comes to people that you don't care so much about, but just want to keep the peace with, you might as well just protect yourself and keep quiet. One approach that might work with people you do care about is to say that you have had some amazing revelations, and would be happy to share them IF THEY ARE INTERESTED. This way, they have to enroll themselves in hearing your new point of view, otherwise you're not going to share it, so it's a lot harder for it to turn into a competitive argument. Get them to agree to hear you out, perhaps on the basis that you have both heard the party line for years (decades!), and you are requesting a few minutes to just be heard in your new experience. You know, THAT experience, within inside, that precious NEW enjoyment of life and freedom that you are NOW having.

Most of all, I would say that it's okay to protect yourself as much as you need to in this rather tender period. It won't last forever and eventually you will be laughing more and more about the whole thing. And wear a thick scarf to avoid decapitations!

I probably have more advice to share if you want it, and if you do, give me your e-mail address (I don't give mine out on this forum because it has my name in it, and I am more or less anonymous).

Much love, Disculta

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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 01:27:57 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: Oh yes, and...
Message:
the Yoga Journal article, and other articles...

I am plotting and scheming to start a page on this website where these articles can be posted. I don't have that article any more (it's antique), but I might be able to access it. There were actually many very good articles in Yoga Journal when it was edited by Stephan Bodian (1985-1995). He has now become one of my best friends, so I am going to ask him about accessing that stuff.

There were also very good articles more than once about cults and dysfunction in the magazine Common Boundary (about the shared boundary between spirituality and psychotherapy).

And one of the funniest and most a propos books I have read is Life 102, What to do when your guru sues you, by Peter Williams. Order it today on amazon.com. It's so incredibly reminiscent of our guru days, and very brilliantly written, about how programming takes place, and how you're not necessarily an idiot to succumb.

Not necessarily an idiot, Disculta

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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:07:33 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: Oh yes, and...telling friends
Message:
Thanks to all who responded to my request for advice.

Don't worry Joy I'm not going to hit the streets with leaflets( I know thats not what you meant!) The problem is I had a sense of certainty when I got into it and I have a bigger sense of certainty on the way out...But..I now no longer trust my judgement. That's not quite true. ..But I will always from now on ..just take a few steps back...and reflect.

However, I cannot help feeling a sort of missionary zeal about this.
To quote an ex Sai Baba devotee:-

'The intense desire I have to expose Sai Baba now is proportionate to the amount of devotion I gave him'
That explains to me why some of you are still here (apart from enjoying the good company) after so long. When I first visited this site I thought for God's sake what are they still doing here? Why don't they move on?

I'm ti
ed now and I'm going to bed ... but before I go I want to thank you Disculta for your recent posts There's alot I'd like to talk to you about.
How can I get in touch?
Love Kelly

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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 17:26:55 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: Oh yes, and...telling friends
Message:
Put up yer e-mail address and I will happily e-mail you and we can chat. I think it would be fun - maybe we can do phone, too.
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 19:06:23 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: Oh yes, and...telling friends
Message:
I can't for now ,same problem as you . Its got my name on it. However I have given it to Jean Michel and asked him to pass it on. He said he would. And yes I would love to talk on the phone. My digits are getting worn out doing all this typing . Soon I won't be able to practice the first two tequniques.
Love Kelly
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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:29:57 (GMT)
From: I want to play
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: Sounds like fun
Message:
'I'm tied now and I'm going to bed....'
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Date: Fri, Dec 01, 2000 at 23:43:22 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: I want to play
Subject: Sounds like fun
Message:
Look , I've been in bondage for a long time...A slave to a vey demanding master, I deserve a ....break....and I'm very very ..tried.
Godnight,
Sweet(FA) Dreams
Kelly
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Date: Sat, Dec 02, 2000 at 03:37:49 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: Rest is very, very good, especially now...
Message:
It's very important to pamper yourself. You've been through a lot in a very short time. When you're tired, rest if you can.

Sweet Dreams,
Cynthia

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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 04:18:34 (GMT)
From: Curious George
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: I'm very curious about The Yoga Journal
Message:
There was an article in the 80's about Swami Rama being sued by a devotee for sexual abuse. I would love to see that here on the forum.

I have a a couple of tapes called The Guru Tapes that I need to transcibe here. There is a lot of excellent insights and information in them. they are pretty long - about two hours I think.

Regards,

C.G.

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 02:05:15 (GMT)
From: Susan
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: interesting Krisna abuse board
Message:
Looking at the Hare Krisna devotees defending their faith, it is eerie how much it reminds me of here


ABC debate board

transcript of Hare Krishan story

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 07:00:54 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: bshaw8@bellsouth.net
To: Susan
Subject: Also, Identifying a Cult
Message:
Im sure this has been posted here before but its the first time Ive seen it

Identifying a Cult

I much prefer this to the definitions of a cult given on the elan vitle faqs

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 20:44:01 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Me, My Mom and our Talk About Maharaji....
Message:
Hi Everyone,

Some of you may or may not know that my 78 yr. old Mom has early Alzheimers. She still lives on her own for the time being, and I call her every day (she's in Conn. and I'm in Vermont). Before the onset of her disease she rarely swore; now she's like a sailor.

Today when I talked to her I asked her if she remembered about my following Maharaji. She said 'yes, of course I do, we tried to tell you girls (me and my sister) but you were brainwashed. You wouldn't hear it.'

I told her all about this website, and how it's helped me a lot, etc., and I also told her about m's opulent lifestyle and about a lot of how it was and is now. This was her response:

'Why don't you all sue the son-of-bitch, look at the lives he's ruined--all you young people in the prime of your lives giving up everything--that's ridiculous, what a nut case, what a bastard!!' I said ya, that's true, and I told her about all his jets and high priced homes and toys and the gold plated toilet, and she said:

'You mean to tell me that you were working your asses off for that devil in sheep's clothing? Someone ought to sit his ass on a gold plated toilet and gold-plate his ass to it so he can't move anymore! What's his phone number? I'm going to call him and tell him off. I'll write him a letter and tell him off.'

I said Ma, nobody can get near him. She said other things that I can't repeat here, but my Mom really made my day today. We laughed so much. My Ma.

She said 'Someone ought to hang him up by the balls! What a betrayer he is! What a creep! Why doesn't his wife leave him? What's the matter with her? Everything you young people gave to him and you can't even give him a call or get a response?'

Needless to say, after the past few days trying to deal with Bimbo, she definitely made my day.

My 78 year old Alzheimers Mom. What a gem.

Love,
Cynthia

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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 05:03:28 (GMT)
From: Curious George
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: I've got M's private phone # for your Mum!
Message:
If she would like to call him I have it. I got it from Jim and he didn't tell me where he got it from. It really works though. I got curious and tried it and spoke to M's secretary. Before the sec came on the line the mesage said for Prem Rawat press 1 and for Marilyn Rawat press 2. So I pressed 1. I wonder if my name, address and telephone number appeared on a screen there.

C.G.

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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 05:45:54 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Curious George
Subject: I've got M's private phone # for your Mum!
Message:
O Curious George, my Mom probably doesn't even remember our phone call. Her long term memory is very good (she loves to talk about her youth and has many cogent days), but she's got Alzheimers, and it just wouldn't work out for her to call, even though she'd probably try it! She's a fierce protector of her five daughters.

But....I am interested in that number and I'm sure one of my older sisters (who is a fearless genious, and never received K) might try to make a call or two.

I'll get an email address to you.

LOve,
Cynthia

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 10:10:22 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Respect to your Mum Cynthia
Message:
There's nothing better than a mum.

Anth the son

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 02:40:21 (GMT)
From: suchabanana
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: We gave to him and can't even get a response!! nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 01:51:42 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Cynthia, your mum is my kind of person
Message:
Give her a hug from me next time you see her.
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 22:04:12 (GMT)
From: Bin Liner
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Me, My Mom and our Talk About Maharaji....
Message:

That's inspired me to try & talk to my own Mum about all this.

She's 82 & lives just a few miles away & is starting to lose it a little bit mentally . I don't know about Alzheimers in her case , I pray not , but what can you do.

When I 1st got involved in the Rawat cult (72) & for a couple of years after , we had the most appalling heavy arguements about the whole business.

Then I stopped mentioning him at all & over time I suppose she concluded that I'd 'grown out of it '.

Little did she know that it would take 28 years & the testimony of strangers (this website).

However her stand was the one thing that prevented me from going the whole hog & joining the ashram .

I couldn't see why love for Rawat should cancel out love for my mother.

So she saved me from the total devotion trip , for which I can only be eternally grateful.

I've been thinking that I've got a moral obligation to resolve this submerged aspect of our relationship.

Your post has encouraged me to do it.

THANKS

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 21:13:25 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Me, My Mom and our Talk About Maharaji....
Message:
Cynthia, you might know that one of the symptoms of Alzheimer's is that those afflicted with it have:
quote: '... mild difficulties finding the right word (aphasia)'

Sounds to me like your mum has lost most of those difficulties!

All the best to you and her.

Chris

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 22:57:33 (GMT)
From: Marianne
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Me, My Mom and our Talk About Maharaji....
Message:
Oh Cynthia, that is such a great post! I laughed all the way through it. You are lucky that you have the opportunity to sort this out with your mother. She sounds in fine form.

Fondly, Marianne

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 13:39:45 (GMT)
From: Happy
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: What a great Mom!
Message:
You have a wonderful mom! Give her a hug from me, too.
I would almost kiss her feet...
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 20:37:20 (GMT)
From: Gregg
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Maharaji: Master of...umm...err...uhh
Message:
When the adolescent Prem Pal Rawat first came to the West, he tried to soften the Indian concept of a Master by saying something like this:

'When you want to learn math, you go to a math master.
When you want to learn to read, you go to a reading
master. So when you want to learn meditation, you go
to a meditation master, one who has mastered meditation.'

I was reminded of this specious line of reasoning when a recently disillusioned premie posted below about the content of a recent Knowledge review, or Auto-Knowledge session, or whatever.

In it, Maharaji simply instructed everyone where to put their fingers, basically. And I know what she's talking about, because I went to one of these shindigs in Denver a couple of years ago, and that was the essence of the Master's teachings. After talking for a few minutes about these digital yogic techniques, he'd leave the throne for fifteen minutes, apparently unable to sit still himself, while the premies would all practice.

It is astounding that a so-called Master of meditation can't bring himself to say any more about the experience than where to put your fingers and to say how wonderful and peaceful is the experience of Knowledge and...and that's about it.

It's a cop-out to say that the experience is beyond words. Well, yes, spiritual experience is ultimately ineffable, but that hasn't stopped many teachers and saints and gurus from saying some interesting, relevant, useful and inspiring things about the mystical realm.

Even the Fraud of the Hour, Sai Baba, while not diddling kids in his private quarters, pretends to be interested in talking about God. (And he isn't coy about God's identity, either!)

Maharaji doesn't know anything about spirituality. That's why he spends his throne time talking about boats and jets and Rolexes!

You'd have to be a mindless cult follower to take all those inanities seriously, and you'd have to be incredibly deluded to think Maharaji actually knew a fucking thing about meditation.

By the way, many of us on this site actually have FIRST HAND KNOWLEDGE about the experiences of mindless deluded cult followers, if you catch my drift. So this is not a putdown, it's a tribute to the effectiveness of cultic indoctrination and the ultimately sweet and touching openness of the spiritual seeker.

Enjoying the World cuz it's a beautiful wide open rockin' place,

Gregg

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 19:36:24 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: None
To: Gregg
Subject: Maharaji: Master of...umm...err...uhh
Message:
Not only does he know nuthin' about the 'spiritual'; but he deludes people by building it up to be something - to be the great answer. Big old promises about a pile of nothing one can never reach because it just ain't there. But I have this problem with all 'devotional' or 'only I can show you the way' creeps.
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 17:54:05 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Gregg
Subject: Maharaji: Master of...umm...err...uhh
Message:
Gregg, you mentioned Maharaji saying this:

'When you want to learn math, you go to a math master.
When you want to learn to read, you go to a reading
master. So when you want to learn meditation, you go
to a meditation master, one who has mastered meditation.'

Actually, the one thing he said in this string of master quotes was:

''If you want to learn perfection, go the the Master of Perfection.'', i.e. The Perfect Master.....

Fortunately, I missed his in person k reviews. The premies who told me about them were more gushing about the darshan than the k review, anyway.

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 16:17:54 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Gregg and Everyone
Subject: EVIL TALANT
Message:
A little anagram of Elan Vital.

Steve

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 16:29:58 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: Or
Message:
A Venal Til
A Lila Vent
Natal Evil
Natal Vile
Venal Tail

Steve

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 22:02:57 (GMT)
From: Curious
Email: None
To: Gregg
Subject: Let's make up some other silly tecniques!
Message:
It always bugged me that M didn't meditate with us when he gave us knowledge reviews. Now I know he has a short temper and a short attention span. He's just plain greedy.

I thought for a laugh we could make up our own meditation tecniques. Anthony would be really good at it!

C.G.

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 05:35:18 (GMT)
From: janet
Email: None
To: Curious
Subject: actually he did the techniques with us...
Message:
in snowmass colorado, at a summer in person knowledge review he called up in the high mountains. i remember being quite suspicious and staring, to see how he did the techniques, himself. he did meditate with us. and he did come around thru the entire room and look at each person to be certain they had the positions right. he came right up to me and took a good long look.so once upon a time.....
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 20:53:58 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Gregg
Subject: Knowledge goes digital ...
Message:
Finger this!
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 01:04:46 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Aaaaarrrrrghhhh!
Message:
Oh boy, this was a good line:

'he'd leave the throne for fifteen minutes, apparently unable to sit still himself, while the premies would all practice.' Isn't it incredible that we had a so-called 'meditation master' who didn't know shit about meditation! I remember when I read one of Steven Levine's books about meditation while I was a premie, I got so much help in one chapter, and I wondered why I had never been given this kind of guidance by MJ. It was one of them drips, knowhatimean?

I left before the era when MJ 'gave Knowledge' and reviews. I did hear one pearl of wisdom from a premie friend who went to one of the first Knowledge reviews, though. I've told it before, but if you missed it, you'll love it:

'You premies are all stuck in your ratholes, and the only exciting thing about a rathole is when the mother rat comes out backwards.'

This, we thought was a spiritual master!? Oy vey!

Discultified Disculta

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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 16:55:38 (GMT)
From: Joy
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: Pearls of Wisdom
Message:
Wow, if that isn't an example of verbal abuse, I don't know what is! I also remember M saying things of this nature in ashram meetings etc. So, to top it all off, he's a major verbal abuser as well as a power-hungry fraud and a drunk. Perhaps they should put some of these quotes over on the EV web site. Just so people get a well-rounded perspective. Delightful. The 15 minute breaks were no doubt to have a cigarette.

Your comments re meditation guidance were right on. The amount of time and attention the Buddhist teachers I studied with devoted to meditation guidance was phenomenal, also. They would spend literally hours and hours with students answering each and every question in great detail, never tiring, always attentive, always giving. Sounds like M just can't be bothered. The comparison makes M look like the mickey-mouse operation he really is.

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 18:16:48 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: wwilliam@kumc.edu
To: Everyone
Subject: Susan, please email me. (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 17:10:22 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: 'India Today' Dec. 4
Message:
Here is the Sai Baba article.
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 19:27:20 (GMT)
From: suchabanana
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Sly Baba orders: don't look at Internet ex-sites!
Message:
'The devotees are also countering the Internet war on two fronts. First, everybody is encouraged to shun the Internet. Explains Hal Honig, a senior Sai official in New York: 'Swami tells us not to look at the Internet but at the inner net.' And secondly, by posting sites that support Baba's teachings. One such site-The Sai Critic-urges devotees to believe only their experiences with Baba, stating, 'When doubt walks in through the front door, faith walks out of the back door.'' - India Today, 2000

Deja vu...

Peace,

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 16:30:47 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: A thought
Message:
JMK posted Jagdeo's phone number below and asked me to give him a call. I had to struggle with this. I find it hard to do. What am going to say, Hi how you doin? Tell me what you think about people saying that you had.....
No. I think the conversation would not go anywhere. I am biased. I think he is guilty until proven innocent. Anyway that is what I think.

What is a criminal?

Sometime ago, I worked in a prison. I found out that there are few classes of criminals. There are those criminals that were driven to the life of crime in one way or another. For example, I knew this young fellow, perhaps he was 20. Well he called me boss. This boy was really innocent. I could say anything to him and he would believe it. He became a thief when some mates of his introduced him to drugs. He became addicted and resorted to thief to supplement his habit. He got 4 years. Another guy was in his late sixties. His wife had a snake tong. When one day he was in the kitchen cooking something she walked in and started her rap. He lost is and cut her through. He was the most harmless person I knew, never uttered a word.

The other class of criminals is people like serial killers. Not sure if anyone knows Iven Millat, but he is a serial killer. Did 8 or so people in south of Sydney. This fellow is really cool. Very civilized, respectful and will do any job he is asked to do. Ofcourse he claims to be innocent (all criminals do that). Also in this class are drug dealers, the rapist, and all the re-offenders. This class of criminals is the more dangerous type, because their actions are premeditated, i.e. they know that what they are doing is going to harm somebody. Because there are actions are premeditated, they can not be reformed.

However there is a third class of criminals. They are the ones that need protection from the main population. A normal jail will have a special wing were those inmates are housed. In this category there is the grandmother a rapist, child killers, child rapists and the like. You may not believe this. But criminals have a code. Not to hurt a child is a big one. Not to kill a grandma is another. I found out that this class is lowest low life that you can find. This class is where Jadgeo and Sai Baba fit. Because if they ever where left in the main population they will not last the day. Jadgeo is a compulsive offender. I do not give a flying monkey what childhood he had or whatever excuses someone will find for him. But as far as am concerned he is a sleaze bag, ego manic and a petty criminal that prays on defenseless people whether these are children or adults that have dedicated their lives to the service of a master and thus are subjected to humiliation by him (the master) or his ministers. I dread to think what he will do if left with a handicapped person.

There is no doubt that one-day the truth will be known. By associating himself and protecting such a figure, m will cause himself a lot of damage.

It is OK for those at EV to play dumb and claim that they never heard about it. It is also OK to try to protect one’s ass. That is fine when you are under ms’ umbrella, but I do wish that your mind does not come to you when you are under the blanket and ask you if what you are doing is right. That could be the only time that you may have a chance to listen to your mind and do the right thing.


That also applies to you Mr. Rawat.

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 22:04:59 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: A thought
Message:
Dear Salam,

There is no excuse for abuse. That is a slogan here in American for any time of abuse, whether it be spousal, child or whatever kind of abuse.

The distinction is there may be reasons the most malicious and evil people commit violent crimes against others, which may include their own childhood history, however, it is never an excuse, and is never excusable.

Cynthai

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 12:08:40 (GMT)
From: Bongo
Email: None
To: Master Bango
Subject: Calling master Bango!
Message:
Great One,greetings.
Thank you for your kind offer to continue the stewardship of my psyche in these troubled times. Before I accept I must interrogate and probe you with clever questions (Anth stylee).
Can you do it? You see my problem, now that I have dumped rawat(for moral offences and Jazz crimes)is very serious. In a word it is this: THE FUTURE! You see I've never really had one before.
Hitherto I have lived 'for the next festival'. I have left one darshan line, only to join the back of the next. My life has been a continual present, surging back and forth, to and from the lotus feet. (Are your feet lotus?) The only FUTURE I have been allowed to envisage is the grave! a fact that rawat has never hesitated to remind me of. Secure in this view of the FUTURE, I found that the present simply disapeared too!(Its a bit like being asleep and awake at the same time ) But sadly this is not so any more.
Can you advise,Your Potential Highness? I am being forced to fall back on a world view that is totally inadequate to the task.
What of the future Master Bango? Am I doomed to wander the internet, a disenfranchised cult-buster forever? Speak Oh Incipient Greatness. THE FUTURE?
Ps Where are Bengo and Bungo?
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 15:56:29 (GMT)
From: Gail
Email: None
To: Bongo
Subject: Calling master Bango!
Message:
Unfortunately, the longer you have been involved, the longer it takes to regain control of your life. All of your personal interests have slowly been usurped by cult activities; many of them to do not return.

It is very difficult to know what you actually like. Geez, for years we have been told what to life and what to dislike--even down to the colour green. I still don't know what I like and can't really pinpoint what I want. It is an absymal project; regaining the rein's of one's life after so many years of slavery.

However, take the time to feel proud of yourself. It is very difficult to admit you have been living a lie, cut your losses and stand up and face life again. It is not for the weak-minded or coward.

For some reason, we chose to cloister ourselves from the world--in favour of Maharaji's fairytales (to coin Jean Michel). There is a heavy price to be paid for this grievous error.

You will make it. Be patient with yourself.

Gail

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 13:46:09 (GMT)
From: Master Bango
Email: None
To: Bongo
Subject: Master Bango Answer Call Of Sincere Ex-Premie
Message:
Yes, I here my child.

There is no present, my child, only future.

My feet no lotus, more like pineapple.

I supply pineapple, you supply ice cream, chocolate sauce and beer, and we have one wild party to celebrate new millenium.

No darshan line in future, my child, only line for Rolling Stone tickets.

Love,

M.B.

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 00:49:18 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: I'm still waiting, Bimbo
Message:
I am waiting for your post telling me which of the articles on my web site are lies. You may email me if you want. Your email will be kept confidential, of course.
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 16:08:42 (GMT)
From: Gail
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Where's Jim?
Message:
It seems strange not to see him doing battle here!
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 17:22:59 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Gail
Subject: Hi Gail!
Message:
Jim is taking a break, much to the consternation of some of the premies (I think they miss him!) I'm glad to see YOU here, though.

Love,
Katie

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 16:22:29 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Gail
Subject: Where's Jim?
Message:
did not you know? We auctioned him a while back.
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 10:44:10 (GMT)
From: FA
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Bimbo is banned (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 14:19:16 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: FA
Subject: Thank you FA!
Message:
Thank you, FA. Bimbo/Bjorn has constantly complained about what a negative influence the forum has been in his life, but he seems unable to stay away from it. I also believe he wants to post here in order to discuss sexual abuse, not Maharaji - which is COMPLETELY inappropriate. And he seems unable to refrain from harassing other people on the forum re sexual abuse - this is unacceptable.

Appreciate it.
Katie

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 15:43:05 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Thank you FA!
Message:
Kaite,

Thank you for your reply on this thread and the one below. Bimbo is strange and I had the felling that I was talking to someone that is tusted. Well he got his chance to stay away and I hope he stay that way.

Talk about premies being lovers of truth, what a joke.

Da u er me Rawat. Ye still sucks.

SALAM GOING CAPS

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 17:21:20 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Thank you FA!
Message:
Hi Salam -
Just so you know 'Bimbo' (also known as Bjorn) has showed up here under at least five different identities and may be back. He's not a very good advertisement for either Maharaji or Knowledge. If I was a member of Elan Vital, I'd be embarassed to have him posting here.

Take care,
Katie

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 15:37:38 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: FA
Subject: Thank you FA! Phew! nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 16:34:38 (GMT)
From: Monmot
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Thank you FA! Phew!
Message:
Glad he's gone. He was a perv hiding behind self-righteous indignation. Contemptible in my eyes.
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 20:58:39 (GMT)
From: Marianne
Email: None
To: Monmot
Subject: Thank you FA!
Message:
And good riddance.
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 11:00:53 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Bimbo
Subject: The only thing necessary, Bimbo
Message:
I personally have no objection to you posting here, Bimbo. I think that comments on the Jagdeo issue should be kept off the forum though and only discussed using email.
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 06:02:06 (GMT)
From: Goregous George
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: I'm still waiting, Bimbo
Message:
may I suggest a recount take it to court
blasphemy
that ghetto sh!t don't ryhme here.
ya hear ? bimbo..
go ahead lies you say
how dare you ?
of all the unmitagated gall.!
ROFLMAO
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Date: Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 23:04:06 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Everyone
Subject: The game's up Danny. Got a photo of you..!
Message:
Take a look at this, folks...

Do I laugh, cry or wet myself?

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 04:13:28 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: Don't wet yourself Nigel, I mean I don't want to
Message:
lay any guilt trips on you or nothing,

cause it really is hard not too dampen oneself.

All that can be said, is 'nuff said'.

;)

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Date: Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 23:25:20 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: Who I think 'Danny' is.....
Message:
Well, obviously, I don't know for sure, but here is my theory.

For those of you who have seen the Lord of the Universe video (available on Amazon.com), you will recall the scene at the Houston Airport, when, after Maharaji comes and speaks, some premies are given some flowers that were around Maharaji's neck and they 'bliss out' on the Airport tarmac.

Anyhow, anybody who saw this video would be unable to forget a premie guy, with dark hair and a beard, acting like a total idiot. Then, after drooling all over himself, he says to the camera operator: 'You know who touched these flowers? The Lord of the Universe.' They he laughs like a maniac and staggers off. Remember that?

Well, that guy is named 'Danny.' A nice guy, really. He also as a 'Lives' entry on enjoyingacultlife.org in which he says that 'the giver is greater than the gift' and that he is currently a 'successful stockbroker' in Los Angeles.

Anyhow, that's my theory. Danny is that you?

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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 01:27:11 (GMT)
From: National Enquirer
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Danny Munter (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Thurs, Nov 30, 2000 at 01:33:30 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: National Enquirer
Subject: That was my guess (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Wed, Nov 29, 2000 at 22:05:03 (GMT)
From: Susan
Email: None
To: Danny
Subject: cmon Danny is Joe right???? (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 23:07:45 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: isn't it strange how they all look alike?
Message:
I swear I have seen that guy everywhere.

And do you think they letting us know they found someone who can write Java applets? way to go Jossi.

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Date: Mon, Nov 27, 2000 at 23:59:16 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Famous forum premies identified
Message:
Some of those faces look very familiar and I've been able to identify one or two.

Click here for famous premies captured on camera

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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 08:07:59 (GMT)
From: cw
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Famous forum premies identified
Message:
No that is not me. I have a moustache a body shirt and a walkie talkie
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Date: Tues, Nov 28, 2000 at 00:08:56 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: and to think
Message:
Long ago and far away when you first posted the pic of Sai Baba on you Many manifestations of God page, I truly thought it was a joke, some kind of morph or something.
Now I know better (except for any pics of me of course we know those will not be real)
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