Forum V: Archive
Compiled: Tues, Jan 09, 2001 at 22:39:49 (GMT)
From: Dec 20, 2000 To: Jan 09, 2001 Page: 2 Of: 5


Yves -:- I had my name legally changed -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:47:22 (GMT)
__ Thelma -:- Apologies to all and request for name change -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:28:25 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- I still don't understand -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:43:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- The sober and serious account of the suicide -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:49:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- Thanks for clarifying that, Frank (nt) -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 02:22:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Frank -:- Thanks for clarifying that, Jim -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 03:47:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ To Thelma / Frank: -:- I wouldn't buy a used car from you (nt) -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 17:34:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Another anonymous ignorant bully. (nt) -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 19:18:33 (GMT)
__ __ Bazza -:- Welcome Frank /and some OT -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:13:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- Thanks -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:36:04 (GMT)
__ __ Roger eDrek -:- Our respectable anti-guru site - gone now! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 23:20:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- Our respectable anti-guru site - gone now! -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:41:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ JHB -:- That's disgusting... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 23:29:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- That's disgusting... -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:42:58 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ JHB -:- That's disgusting... -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 14:09:27 (GMT)
__ __ Thelma -:- Apologies to all and request for name change -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:31:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ Bazza -:- HTML 101 /OT -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:33:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- HTML 101 /OT -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:45:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Bazza -:- ah shit /OT -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:36:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- ah shit /OT -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:46:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Bazza -:- Ot= Off Topic, ie not related to cult issues /NT -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:55:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- TA, NT, OT and think PTL (Jim Bakker) -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:16:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ JHB -:- Excellent Site! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:56:22 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- Shit shovelling -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:48:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ JHB -:- Shit shovelling -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 14:05:56 (GMT)
__ Noshhhit -:- I had my name legally changed -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 21:07:29 (GMT)
__ bill -:- Makes it hard on the kids!-nt -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:59:19 (GMT)
__ __ Frank /Thelma -:- Makes it hard on the kids! -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:21:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ bill -:- Nice work Frank/Thelma-nt -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 18:19:43 (GMT)

Bazza -:- A Journey from my old buddy John -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:02:51 (GMT)
__ Katie -:- Hey Barry (and/or Big John)! -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 17:10:10 (GMT)
__ __ Bazza -:- I'll take care of that NT -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 01:54:39 (GMT)
__ suchabanana -:- Reality of: 'The Abuser and his Co-dependents' (nt -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 07:06:28 (GMT)
__ Joe -:- The recurrence of anger. -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:14:41 (GMT)
__ JHB -:- Excellent Journey -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:39:30 (GMT)
__ Way -:- Thanks -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:29:47 (GMT)

hamzen -:- What would you like to hear gm say? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:15:47 (GMT)
__ Lesley -:- What would you like to hear gm say? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:06:03 (GMT)
__ Thelma -:- What would you like to hear gm say? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:57:27 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- Some bed talk..nt -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:51:21 (GMT)
__ __ Oliver -:- Would you like my watch collection---(NT) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:14:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ bill -:- care to dance? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 21:03:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Cynthia -:- Hi bill! -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 20:46:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ bill -:- Hi Cynthia -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 18:23:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ such -:- m should sing 'Do ya think I'm sexy' (nt -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 07:11:38 (GMT)

Way -:- OT question to Nigel -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:03:32 (GMT)
__ Nigel -:- Nobby Lewis (ot) -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 20:48:59 (GMT)
__ bill -:- How about a link to your site Nigel:)-nt -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 21:00:38 (GMT)
__ Thelma -:- OT question to Nigel -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:48:22 (GMT)

Oliver -:- See Anything Goes (OT) nt -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 11:44:09 (GMT)
__ Oliver -:- See Anything Goes....... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:18:38 (GMT)

TED Farkel -:- Mr.eDrek-DAVID SMITH loves the boob site... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:42:39 (GMT)
__ David Smith -:- I do not love the boob site! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:53:06 (GMT)
__ __ Gordon Showcase -:- Don't fret dear instructor Smith -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:59:52 (GMT)
__ Roger eDrek -:- Mr.eDrek-DAVID SMITH loves the boob site... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:49:36 (GMT)
__ __ TED Farkel -:- Mr.eDrek-Bolie to you too,son!List is on the waynt -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 05:41:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- Good news! Synchronization from Malibu! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:18:04 (GMT)

Fact -:- Maharaji's irresponsability. Example -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:24:36 (GMT)
__ Pauline Premie -:- Love's Glue -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 23:59:20 (GMT)
__ __ Fact -:- Love's Glue? hahahahah -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 14:47:19 (GMT)
__ __ C.G. -:- Love Glue Chuckle - Best Of the Forum Vote -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 08:21:14 (GMT)
__ __ Frank /Thelma -:- Love's Glue -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:00:27 (GMT)
__ __ Roger eDrek -:- Pauline, would you like to give satsang at TED's? -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:51:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ TED Farkel -:- Oh GOD,Mr. eDrek,I'm in LOVE,and I'm all shook up! -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:04:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- Good god, man! Don't FALL in love! -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 03:14:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- TED, one last idea - a personal mtg with D. Smith -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:48:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ C.G. -:- i was intimidated by D. Smith recently -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 08:33:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Fact -:- Is called control: David Smith sucks!! NT -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 14:49:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- Good god, man! -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:41:25 (GMT)
__ Wish -:- Depends Who this poem refers to -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:11:43 (GMT)
__ __ Way -:- No, it's bad either way. -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 21:52:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ Deputy Dog -:- Way IMO your post hits the nail right on the head! -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:55:05 (GMT)
__ __ SB -:- But you know better, don't you? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:16:02 (GMT)
__ Joy -:- What Absolute Drivel -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 07:32:16 (GMT)
__ __ Gregg -:- Maybe it was better in the original Hindi...(nt) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:04:01 (GMT)
__ Scott T. -:- Can't see it -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:30:16 (GMT)
__ Larkin -:- M's poetry? - it's good stuff, really it is... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:23:08 (GMT)
__ __ AJW -:- Brilliant Larkin -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:44:23 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- Nice (nt) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:59:37 (GMT)
__ __ Fact/sb -:- Maestro: Where have u been? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:09:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ C.G. -:- M's two new poems as bad as ever for 2001 -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 08:40:39 (GMT)
__ __ Steve Quint -:- The Poet Laureate Of Exland Does It Again nt -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:53:01 (GMT)
__ Nigel -:- Typical - the bastard disables your 'back' button. -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:36:08 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- THIS is the version you should all read -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:20:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- Sorry, I didn't get it -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:35:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Oliver -:- Dumb Shit! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:26:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- OK, got it (nt) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 05:49:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Oliver -:- Bullshit!!! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:33:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Fact -:- That is not nice at all!! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:53:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ hamzen -:- It might have been 'nice' but..... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:14:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ SB -:- Lovely variation!! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:26:30 (GMT)
__ __ Fact/SB -:- Here is the quoted poem -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:02:54 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- Here it is -- Maharaji's shining glory -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:57:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ TD -:- It must be translated directly from his Hindi.... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:17:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Fact -:- The guy has an imaginary friend -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:22:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- Thanks EVERYBODY, but Sir Dave's is the best -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:23:36 (GMT)
__ Maurice -:- Class Action. -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:54:59 (GMT)
__ __ Fact/SB -:- Class Action. SUIT -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:51:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ Tim G -:- Class Action. SUIT -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:16:57 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ SB/Fact -:- This medium -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:31:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Oliver -:- Re: This medium -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:32:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Tim G -:- Zipping along good-o -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:30:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- I get you but, -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:13:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ Steve Quint -:- A Simple Question -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:07:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ fact/sb -:- A Simple Question -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:05:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Steve Quint -:- Wouldn't An Injunction Be Appropriate? nt -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:10:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ Thelma -:- Class Action. SUIT -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:05:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ SB -:- Class Action. SUIT -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:25:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Scott T. -:- You'll be surprised to learn... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:59:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- He's in hospital now, by the way -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:41:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Fact -:- Sorry, who is in the hospital? NT -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:02:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- It's at the end of my above post (nt) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:18:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- I see -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:21:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ sb -:- Scott -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:03:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Scott T. -:- Scott -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:22:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Thanks :) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:34:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Oliver -:- Re: You'll be surprised to learn... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 09:25:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Scott T. -:- You missed the point. -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:59:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Oliver -:- Re: You missed the point. -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:07:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ fact -:- We are the government as provided by the -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:15:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Scott -:- We are the government as provided by the -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:35:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ sb -:- I read here that -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:48:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Scott T. -:- I read here that -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:30:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Oliver -:- I have read in Aussie press that......... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:24:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- I have read in the Canadian press that......... -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 03:23:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Frank /Thelma -:- Good riddance to all fakirs NT -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:45:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Depends on how you define 'fakers' and ... -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 15:01:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Frank -:- Depends on how you define 'fakers' and ... -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 18:51:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Depends on how you define 'fakers' and ... -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 19:23:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Frank -:- Unpremie v expremie -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 20:28:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Yes, ham and Gerry are great! -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 01:46:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Frank -:- Yes, ham and Gerry are great! -:- Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 03:45:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Thelma -:- Class Action. SUIT -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:45:58 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ such -:- Hey, you SUITS. Mum's the word rt now... (nt -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:19:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Thelma -:- Mum's the word rt now... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 09:03:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Fact -:- Demonized is not the right word, but -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:09:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Joy -:- Great Post, Thelma -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:48:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Thelma -:- shell game -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:43:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Fact -:- It HAS NO PRICE (nt) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:10:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Tim G -:- Thanks Thelma -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:27:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Nevertheless, responsible for his actions. -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:12:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Fact -:- Say what? LOL What was that? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:24:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ such -:- don't you know our 'attorney Bernie'? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 08:47:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Disculta -:- To Fact/SB -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:39:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Fact -:- To Fact/SB -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:36:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- What books -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:24:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Thelma -:- Friends and allies -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:34:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Of course -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 05:30:38 (GMT)
__ blood -:- trapped in mahaland -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:51:51 (GMT)

Thelma -:- has this been tried? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:02:20 (GMT)
__ Maurice -:- Good Thinking,Thelma. -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:57:42 (GMT)
__ __ Thelma -:- Good idea Maurice -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 01:34:27 (GMT)

eBay Alert -:- Aliens From Spaceship Earth -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 20:54:01 (GMT)
__ bazza -:- Could be a bootleg -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 21:01:44 (GMT)
__ __ bazza -:- Wrong link, duh -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 22:28:15 (GMT)

Bazza -:- Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 15:42:50 (GMT)
__ Frank /Thelma -:- see new thread -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:33:23 (GMT)
__ Cynthia -:- Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:53:00 (GMT)
__ __ Thelma -:- Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:12:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ Cynthia -:- Frank/Thelma; No sweat:))) -:- Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 17:41:57 (GMT)
__ Big John -:- Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 21:33:15 (GMT)
__ __ Bazza -:- Hey Big John/OT -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 22:43:01 (GMT)
__ Thelma -:- Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 20:21:06 (GMT)
__ __ sb -:- Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:30:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ Thelma -:- We all want to skewer the Holy Cow -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:38:39 (GMT)
__ __ Bazza -:- Hey its cool Thelma -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 20:58:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ Thelma -:- You're a gentleman -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 21:16:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Kelly -:- Thelma, be gentle with yourself -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 22:07:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Thelma -:- be gentle with yourself -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 22:42:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ gerry -:- be gentle with yourself -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:10:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Thelma -:- is that you, my little libertarian pumpkin? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:18:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Nigel -:- Strong feelings don't happen in a void... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:06:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Thelma -:- Strong feelings don't happen in a void... -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:57:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Salam -:- Yes Belgarath!! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:42:16 (GMT)
__ Disculta -:- Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 16:56:12 (GMT)
__ __ Salam -:- Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 17:50:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ such -:- sucha sad story,yes.[see my response 2u below] (nt -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 20:53:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Salam -:- Read it. -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:07:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ ham -:- Understand your view, don't completely agree -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 19:15:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ SB -:- OT -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:00:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ ham -:- Apologies sb, been a bit distracted of late -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:25:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Yes! -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:01:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Salam -:- Is this something we should know about? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:45:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ ham -:- Only in the Russian house scene -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:51:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ ham -:- SB/Salam/House sites on the net -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:35:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Thanks!! Hey Salam, -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:14:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Salam -:- glad u do -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:10:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ Oliver -:- Re: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 18:02:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Fact -:- Re: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday? -:- Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 21:57:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Great post, Fact, (and a small request) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 00:32:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ SB/Fact -:- Great post, Fact, (and a small request) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:08:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Forum Administrator -:- Multi-alias posting. -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:13:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Bazza -:- Well here's a few for you -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:11:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Multi-alias posting. -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:28:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Salam -:- Great post, Fact, (and a small request) -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:39:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Fact -:- A Prince kissed me and I am awake now -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 05:37:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Salam -:- Vaya, como pajaros abajo del sol? -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:17:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Fact -:- Correcto ROFL -:- Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:51:25 (GMT)


Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:47:22 (GMT)
From: Yves
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: I had my name legally changed
Message:
I was christened Jim LaShit.

I am now legally named Yves LaShit.

It feels much better.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:28:25 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: all
Subject: Apologies to all and request for name change
Message:
My request for a name change and apologies to all from Frank formerly known as 'Thelma the Thunderstealing Bitch.'

Every time someone comes onto the forum for the first time in a while it seems that they get upset by my 'suicide' posting under the name of 'Thelma' and I have to offer an apology so I'm writing an apology to all of you and requesting a name change.

When I first found this forum over a year ago I was still under the Rev Ratguru Rawat's sinister spell and found it tedious and whiny. Last week, after renouncing the Ratguru finally, I came back for another look and was hooked. I read all the posts and found myself laughing at your irreverent humor more than I had in months and, on the spur of the moment, decided to join in the fun.

Usually I would visit the forum after dinner, during which I always make sure I get plenty of the fifth food-group, wine. Dinner is usually followed by a fat doobie and a bit of net-surfing. Like a fool I posted the suicide story, knowing full well that it was a stupid thing to do.

With hind-sight I realize that I was trying, in my drunken stupor, to draw attention to myself and make myself feel like I 'belonged' here with you guys. You know: 'Oh, look at me. I'm also one of you.' Well, it's not the first time I've made an idiot of myself when drunk and not the first time I have had to apologise either. It's the price you pay for getting drunk but also the whole point of getting drunk in the first place.

This drunkeness also made me choose, again rashly, to post under the name of 'Thelma the Thunderstealing Bitch' (which is a satirical online pseudonym I use for a pornography web ring that I do.) It seemed that so many of you were indulging in campy humor that it would not be out of place. But it again was a stupid decision because no one knew me and the whole point of having a satirical alter-ego is that people also know you more serious side.

I now wish to change the name under which I post in order to set things straight and let you see the real side of me first. I just hope that I may be allowed occassionally to wax satirically and probably drunkenly under the name of 'Thelma' but I guess I will have to remain sober for a while still until people trust me.

I will be posting as 'Frank' short for Francois La Motte and you can check my bona fides by going to my colostomy bag site if you want and email me from there and I will answer you. But please don't go there if you do not have a strong stomach or a morbid curiosity or a scatological sense of humor or you have an ostomy. I guess now whenever I enter the forum you will all be grossed out, start sniffing surreptitiously and I won't get anymore hugs.

Some of you will recognise a few names in the Guest Book section of the site. It is badly designed (only the second one that I did) and klunky and not worth looking at unless you are an ostomate. But it serves a purpose and has made me friends all over the world.

For instance I got this email today:

'My teenage son just had surgery and now wears a urostomy bag. Well, he thinks he can wear it over his jeans! I tell him to tuck it in underwear and pants fit perfect over that. He wont listen. I saw his shirt was up and I can see the bag. Any idea on how to explain not to wear like this?'

I answered:

Kids don't care about quite the same things as we do. If he is not embarrassed by the bag there's not much you can do except keep telling him that most people don't want to see it and some will be grossed out by it. But it's not as ugly as a colostomy bag full of feces and his teen friends are probably not bothered by it. As he gets older and more interested in girls, he'll probably get a bit embarrassed. But I just wish we were all as free and easy with it. Meantime buy him LONG tee shirts.'

So goodbye Thelma and good riddance. You made an absolute fool of me and upset a lot of the finest, sincerest and most conscientious people I have had the pleasure to meet. The only thunder you ever stole was a storm of outrage.

DON'T GO HERE IF YOU HAVE A QUEASY STOMACH:

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:43:03 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Thelma
Subject: I still don't understand
Message:
Was the account of the recent suicide of the aspirant true or a completely made-up story?

You haven't given this the seriousness it deserves. You have yet to explain exactly what happened and whether you just made up a stupid cock-and-bull story of fiction or whether you were being serious.

Suicide is not a joke and it's in very poor taste to make light of it.

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:49:56 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: The sober and serious account of the suicide
Message:
I also feel that I owe everyone a sober and serious version of the 'suicide' story. Here it is:

The guy (whom I shall call the Darshan Drip) who had introduced the victim to the Ratguru had only recently returned to the premie fold. He was an unreconstructed hippie and, like Rip van Winkle, lived in the past where the Ratguru was Krishna and premies had darshan dreams and all the other hindu claptrap from the seventies. The industrial-strength church-ladies in the community feared and loathed him but were nonplussed as to what to do with him.

The rest of us (a raggle-taggle of counter-culture types) at first found the Darshan Drip amusing after all the church-ladies' politically correct cult bullshit. He began to 'propagate' his version of Knowledge to his stoned hippie-hindu friends one of whom was the victim, a young man who had a long history of psychotic episodes.

I warned the Darshan Drip not to get this kid involved but they had known each other for a long time and I had to back off and mind my own business. I was not able to talk to the kid myself because I had only met him once and he had taken an instant dislike to me because I'm a fag and he was rabidly homophobic. (I have since found out that part of his mental problems were caused by sexual molestation as a child.)

A few months ago the youngster 'fell' off the roof of his mother's house. It was attributed to a a bad LSD trip and he was admitted to hospital for a month for treatment of a 'psychotic episode.' When he got out he decided that the Ratguru was a conman but the Darshan Drip and another idiot hippie-type premie got hold of him and told him he was just going through youthful confusion and the Rev Rawat was fine and holy. They were probably all stoned on weed at the time.

A few days ago the youngster jumped from his mother's roof and killed himself. The way I found out was by a phone call from the Darshan Drip. At the time I was writing a posting to the forum about a spat I had with a premie whom I have known for 30 years. I was drunk and having fun on the forum. The Darshan Drip proceeded to disguise his real feelings about the suicide by spouting nonsense about going to a 'higher plain.' I was so angry that I hung up on him and fired off a nasty email to him and sat down and posted the story on the forum.

The topic was introduced in an inappropriate manner (drunk and angry) and with an inapproriate tone of voice (the smarminess of the satirical pseudonym I was using - Thelma.) It was a very bad mistake on my part and I have tried to make sure that everyone knows that I am very sorry for what I did.

I have since learned that the youngster's mother (also an unreconstructed hippie) has denied that it was suicide and has blamed her son's death on an 'accident caused by a psychotic episode induced by LSD.' End of story for me because the truth has now been denied by the one person who could have helped blow the lid off the Darshan Drip's delusions.

I originally told the story on the forum simply to illustrate what I regarded as the insanity and irresponsibility of the premies not as a new 'piece of dirt' to pin on the cult. I knew that that angle was not an option because the industrial-strength church-ladies here would simply say that the Darshan Drip was acting without the approval of the church or the Rev Rawat; that the victim was a nut and that it was brought about by drugs which we all know the Holy Mother Church of the Very Reverend Ratguru Rawat 'does not approve of.'

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 02:22:47 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Frank /Thelma
Subject: Thanks for clarifying that, Frank (nt)
Message:
fffffff
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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 03:47:43 (GMT)
From: Frank
Email: f_lamotte@hotmail.com
To: Jim
Subject: Thanks for clarifying that, Jim
Message:
You are a gentleman.
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 17:34:30 (GMT)
From: To Thelma / Frank:
Email: None
To: Frank /Thelma
Subject: I wouldn't buy a used car from you (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 19:18:33 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: To Thelma / Frank:
Subject: Another anonymous ignorant bully. (nt)
Message:
fuck 'em
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:13:11 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Frank
Subject: Welcome Frank /and some OT
Message:
Well as your main antagonist below now I feel like a right arsehole (no pun intended), but I think we've cleared the air (there I go again) between us here and in our emails today.

When I first came out here about 2 months ago, I received a very heartfelt welcome from everyone and I trust you will be similarly treated.

I think anyone who has undergone such radical modfications to their anatomy as you have deserves to get drunk and stoned every night, and if that means Thelma has to have a little rant, that's fine too.

I did visit your ostomy site (AND that *other* one - Yikes, that's scarier by a long shout;);)) and have to aplaud the work you're trying to do. I'm not squeamish about it in the least. As a videographer I've had to film many stoma operations, investigative colonoscopies, prolapse repairs, you name it, I've had my camera up it! I confess when it comes to surgery shoots, I do prefer cardiac repairs, but you get used to it all in time.

Seriously though, I think its wonderful what you are trying to achieve with your website, and with your permission, I'll make sure it gets a mention at the next Colorectal Diseases Symposium I go to film, which should be later this year. Also, if you need help developing the site, I'll pitch in and maybe some others will. (best done via email)

Well that's all I wanted to say, dont want to hog your spotlight.

all the best

bazza

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:36:04 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: Thanks
Message:
I'll look for those nude pics from Playgirl and scan them for you.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 23:20:17 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Thelma
Subject: Our respectable anti-guru site - gone now!
Message:
We're trying to run a respectable anti-guru site here. And now look what you've done, Thelma-Frank.

We've never had any kind of personal outbursts, cat fights, mudslinging or any other screw-ups and now this!

Frank, you need to stare at this for 10 minutes and then get back to us with a full report.

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:41:30 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Our respectable anti-guru site - gone now!
Message:
Hi Drekmeister. My husband already showed me your disgusting and heretical works of pornography. I hope you are ashamed of yourself for giving his Holiness the Very Reverend Ratguru Rawat such pretty titties.

Seriously: I have often wondered if we need two sites. One for Thelma, the Drekmeister and Pauline Premie etc and another for the sort of serious stuf we would like the IRS to investigate. We don't want them to think that we are just a bunch of very happy, silly, creative types now do we?

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 23:29:04 (GMT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: That's disgusting...
Message:
... Frank/Thelma's site is much better.....

John.

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:42:58 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: That's disgusting...
Message:
What's disgusting the colostomy site or the Porn Nun Web Ring?
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 14:09:27 (GMT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Frank /Thelma
Subject: That's disgusting...
Message:
Neither - Roger's site with that fat guy with the big tits in the stupid costume:-)

John.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:31:24 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: all
Subject: Apologies to all and request for name change
Message:
Why didn't the link show up? Here it is without the html code:

http://www.geocities.com/f_lamotte.geo/index.htm

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:33:15 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Frank
Subject: HTML 101 /OT
Message:
Hey Frank,

You didn't put any text between the and the marks, so there was nothing there to click on.

bazza

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:45:39 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: HTML 101 /OT
Message:
Thanks. I see. Got to stop posting when I'm stoned or drunk. Shit next it'll be like a fucking 'participation' meeting.
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:36:13 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Frank
Subject: ah shit /OT
Message:
OK so you can't put in ampersand code for brackets. Oh well. What i meant to say was that you didnt put any text in between the two halves of the 'a href=' code for your link, thats all.
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:46:48 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: ah shit /OT
Message:
What's OT stand for?
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:55:56 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Frank /Thelma
Subject: Ot= Off Topic, ie not related to cult issues /NT
Message:
NT= No Text, ie said all I wanted to say in the subject line(figured you'd ask that next!!)
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:16:28 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: TA, NT, OT and think PTL (Jim Bakker)
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:56:22 (GMT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Excellent Site!
Message:
The real world is always more refreshing than Maharaji's illusion:-)

John the shit shoveller (horseshit that is!)

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:48:31 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: Shit shovelling
Message:
Hi fellow shit shoveller - got to do a lot of that with a fucking colostomy.
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 14:05:56 (GMT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Frank /Thelma
Subject: Shit shovelling
Message:
I sympathise - I'll take my three horses worth of shit any day over your colostomy:-)

All the best and a belated welcome to the forum.

Regarding mutual acquaintances, I didn't know too many of the premies from Manchester, as I lived in Leeds in the late 70s, where I knew George Blodwell and Jon Cainer.

John.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 21:07:29 (GMT)
From: Noshhhit
Email: None
To: Yves
Subject: I had my name legally changed
Message:
Mr. LaShit, congratlations! LOL Shit? You could have done better than that but maybe you have reasons I can't figure out.

For real? If yes, How did you do it?

My son was to change his and I don't even know where rto start. Another thing. If you DID change it. Where at? We are in the US and if you are not here is no use of course for you to explain the way to do it.

:)

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:59:19 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Yves
Subject: Makes it hard on the kids!-nt
Message:
rdtj
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:21:25 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: all
Subject: Makes it hard on the kids!
Message:
Yes I know. My heart goes out to you Wadi, Daya, Hansi and Amaroo or Garam-masala or whatever your name is, sweetie darling.

On my second tipsy tour through this forum I found the Dalai Lama's chain letter. Of course I emailed it to 18 people before I read the rest of the thread. You did too? And you? Were you tipsy too or don't you need an excuse?

That was before I realized that most ex-premies do the fifth technique a lot. Now, the fifth technique is only revealed to the Very Rev's in-crowd, the guys who 'donate' money to the Rev from special accounts, better known as the Malibu Mob, you know the guys who get on the yacht. But it is often revealed by closely watching the Very Rev Rawat. The fifth technique is accomplished by placing the tongue in one's cheek and giving a sly half-smile. He does it a lot and is a great rishi.

This is what Lama Thelma the Thunderstealing Bitch has to say for the coming Far East Asian New Year, the year of the Snake. (With apologies for using that sweet dear Dalai Lama's chain letter.)

(NB: If you've got an old tattered copy of Chinese astrolgy - left over from the days when you were clutching at straws because the Very Rev Ratguru Rawat was leaving you in the dark - read what it says the Year of the Snake means for a Rooster (the year in which the Very Rev was born.) Our worries are over and the worries of many others will soon be over but, according to Chinese sages, the Rev's worries are only about to begin. I hope they are wrong. I don't like to see anyone suffer. That doesn't mean I don't like to watch but I promise not to gloat and to try to feel detached and blissed out the way the sainted Pauline Premie has taught us to.)

Instructions for Life in the Year of the Snake for a Ratguru born in the year of the Rooster (see above - and apologies to any nice Roosters):

1. Take into account that great love and great achievements involve great risk. No, sorry, 'great love' does not include juvenile self-infatuation.

2. When you lose, don't lose the lesson. If you learn your lesson and come clean and take responsibility maybe we'll let you back into the human race again one day.

3. Follow the three Rs: Respect for self, respect for others
responsibility for all your actions. See above 1) re self-respect v self-infatuation and 2) responsibility.

4. Remember that not getting what you want is sometimes a wonderful stroke of luck. The day you don't get what you want will be the best day you have had since you became the Ratguru and have been given everything that you ever wanted with a mere snap of your holy fingers at poor blissed-out bhakti-infatuated Pauline Premie.

5. Learn the rules so you know how to break them properly. I can't add much to that one because you never even bothered to learn the basic rules of civilization,honesty, decency and modesty (yes, the opposite of hubris - oh, you need to look that word up, sorry.)

6. Don't let a little dispute injure a great friendship. No, I'm forgiving so come and have a drink with me after the court case and we'll see if anything develops. But I must warn you I'm a fat, old, grey, balding fag with a colostomy bag. Oh? You only like young blonde females. Oops, silly me.

7. When you realize you've made a mistake, take immediate steps to correct it. We're waiting.

8. Spend some time alone every day. That means with no 'voices' that once told you that you were THE ONE or your dear departed daddy's ghostly gibberish.

9. Open your arms to change, but don't let go of your values. The last word needs to be changed to 'valuables' for you since you have more of them. But, if I were you, I would hold onto the family jewels because they will be your most valuable asset one day - perhaps your only asset.

10. Remember that silence is sometimes the best answer. Except when you are speaking before a democratically constituted jury of your peers. It'll be bigger than OJ's trial because your peers are rich and famous.

11. Live a good, honorable life. Then when you get older and think back, you'll be able to enjoy it a second time. 'THINK' - now what does that word mean?

12. A loving atmosphere in your home is the foundation for your life. I wish this for all human beings. I hope your family sticks by you. No one else will.

13. In disagreements with loved ones, deal only with the current
situation. Don't bring up the past. Exactly. Those of us who know what's happening now do not need to bring up your past. You are lying and scamming people by billing yourself as 'THE Master' with special powers which must remain un-nameable and secret. These powers are conveyed by your speechless devotees to astonished strangers by means of a 'propagation package consisting of video and audio tapes of YOU. Yes, you've silenced the servants finally haven't you? So, your devoted and sadly sincere church-ladies must convey their 'Master's' secret powers by doing the fifth technique (see above) and the old nudge, nudge, wink, wink, clutch your heart and roll your eyes in bliss routine. And you are skimming donations from a 'non-profit education corporation' via an elaborate shell game. These donations are being solicited from well-meaning people for purposes of 'education' but are being used insincerely and deceitfully. No we don't have to and won't bring up the past.

14. Share your knowledge. It's a way to achieve immortality. Immortality does not mean oblivion or amnesia. Knowledge means wisdom and learning not the fifth technique.

15. Be gentle with the earth in your last house-plant. It might be all you have left.

16. Once a year, go someplace you've never been before, like the local pub and see how long you last.

17. Remember that the best relationship is one in which your love for each other exceeds your need for each other. I hope the Malibu Mob loves you more than they need you and vice versa.

18. Judge your success by what you had to give up in order to get it. Couldn't have said it better. If you give it all up, confess your ignorance and stupidity and give the loot back I promise you peace of mind.

19. Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon. Did you write that one? Cute but not up to your usual style. Wouldn't you have written, 'with longing that is so deep it will never be filled.' And it never was. Kept your word there.

Do not keep this message. Use your delete button immediately. This mumbo-jumbo must leave your hands within 96 hours. You will get a very pleasant surprise (even if you are not superstitious - but I think you are - just two words 'dead daddy) if you forward this mantra to other people.

0-4 people: Your life will improve slightly.

5-9 people: Your life will improve to your liking.

9-14 people: You will have at least 5 surprises in the next 3 weeks.

15 people and above: Your life will improve drastically and everything you ever dreamed of will begin to take shape - peace of mind, a clear conscience, being liked by the chaps down at the pub. BTW these guys don't play bhakti yoga. Don't even say the word because they'll think you said 'Bugger me' and they're not as clean and cute as you are. Just say cheese - oops, sorry, maybe not.

Thelma has to go back to work (as the local cheap ho with a heart of gold who knows how to party like there's no tomorrow) next week after a week's couch-potatoing and won't have time to play on the net so this will be the last of her drunken sprees on the forum. Thank the muses.

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 18:19:43 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Frank /Thelma
Subject: Nice work Frank/Thelma-nt
Message:
dafdf
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:02:51 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: A Journey from my old buddy John
Message:
I'm posting this on behalf of John Watson aka Big John, because for some reason his posts were rejected (FA - he's using Mandrake Linux). He emailed it to me and said to use it at my discretion. Its a great story, and I guess belongs in the Journey section, but I figured you'd like to read it first. Now I need to get my finger out and write mine!!

********************************************************
First up, let em say I'm glad for the opportunity given to me by telling this story.

This is something that I've sledom thought of in the last ten years, but I've realised that has been as a result suppressing he memories of what happend. The questions I've been asking myself are pretty much the same as those whose stories I've been reading during the past few days since I discoverd the web site.

I became involved with the Divine Light Movement and m in 1975. A childhood, friend Ernie Tyas, had been at the Alexandra Pallace shows in London and received knowledge along with some of his friends from University. He came back to my home town of Guisborough in North Yorkshire and held satsang for all of his friends. I was immediately struck by how ernest and 'blissed-out' he was and began to attend satsang in Stockton a nearby town where there was a premie house.

Looking back i can see that I was the classic cult victim, from a not particularly close, typical, British middle class family, low self esteem, in need of some kind of loving, stabilising, supporting family life.

In the summer of 1976, I passed my A-levels, and started studying music, with the emphasis on singing, at the same University as Ernie in Bangor, North Wales. This became my real introduction to satsang and premie life, (although at that time not a premie myself) and through the premies I met, to Hashish, Maharaja and Psyloscybin (magic mushrooms). Throughout this time I was disturbed by the mental state of some of the premies, for example Witford(Richard) who had more scars on his wrists than anyone I've seen befor or since, and Ernie who suffered (and still does) from depression.

It was amazing how many premies I met who lived in and around Bangor, and how many of them had a serious problem with substance abuse of one form or another. Ironic really considering what our perfect master had been up to!

In the course of that year I used more time on attending an aspirant program in Chester (two hours away by train) and enjoying various mind altering substances than I did studying. So, of course, the inevitable lay in wait, and after I dropped out of the University's Opera three days befor the first
performance to see m at the London Wembly Arena (back in the days when he could pack 'em in) I got sent down (that's thrown out on my arse for you guys in the US).

I attended a selection weekend in Manchester where the mahatma (a Canadian women who I think was called Joyce) told me that if I wanted knowledge then I'd better move to Manchester. This I did in 1977, alienating myself from my family and friends, and began the process of becoming a premie. I lived in several premie houses, (including sharing a flat with Bazzer) and in early 1978 I received knowledge at the Manchester Ashram. Like many have said and written, this was an amazing experience. How much was because of the meditation techniques, and how much because was because the whole aspirant program provides conditioning (roll over Pavlov) so the aspirant will have this amazing experience is open to question. (Incidentaly, at the same selection weekend a certain Jonathan [mad john] Cainer was told that if he wanted knowledge then he'd better marry his
then premie girlfriend....).

Shortly after this, I lost my job when I hitched down to Malaga in southern Spain to see m in a bullring. (Ah the incongruity of it all!) A year of travelling to festivals followed culminating in a trip to Kissimie , Florida, in November. This was an introduction into the harsh realities of how much of a
rip-off culture was (and is) surrounding m.

I moved into a premie flat in Manchester with two premies, Ian Gosling and Chris Gribble and tried to get something out of my life.

After 18 months or so, things began to go very pear shaped, both in my life, but also in the mission. The closure of the ashram (I saw one of the Ashram premies, George Blodwell, on a low budget celebrity show from the US some months ago billed as an Image Consultant- nice work if you can get it!), the later de-Indianising an westernising of the mission to maximise revenues (we all know what happened to all the money from the ashrams don't we. It didn't go towards housing the homeless premies, that's for sure!), all contributed to the general unease and falling-apartness. This of course was always explained as being a problem with the interpretation of what m wanted by the
organisation...this was of course nothing to do with m. (Didn't Nurenburg eradicate this as an excuse?....).

About this time I began to smoke hash again, and when this became known (within a couple of days....premies are such gossips!), I was shunned by a large number of the more holy premies (with the exception of some like for example mad John Cainer who turnd up looking to score one evening....). It was like being shown the cold shoulder by a loved one, hideously painful. In the end I began to move out of the premie circle and eventually moved back to my home town in 1981.

Ernie still lives locally (Saltburn-by-the-sea) but otherwise I've lost touch with all the premies I knew from that time. I was left with a Hash habit that took until 1993 to break. I also had huge problems in personal relationships, I was frightened of rejection and could not accept criticism, which took me years (and cost a fortune in therapy) to get over. I have been a Radiographer (X-Ray tech.) since 1984, and moved to Denmark in 1990. This is not the direction I saw my life leading in 1976.

I haven't sung professionally since 1977.

All in all I've accepted the way my life has turned out, inspite of d.l.m. and m, but I do believe it would have been totally different if I hadn't attended Ern's satsang that evening in 1975. I'm no longer bitter, but I know that I gave up much for a handful of broken promises and unfulfilled dreams.

John Watson
j.watson@wanadoo.dk (John already posted his email address here under 'Big John')
****************************************************
Like I said, John's had a few technical difficulties trying to post, maybe the FA can get in touch and see what's up.

I think this is a great story and want to thank John for taking the time to write it, and thanks for the personal memories it brought back.

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 17:10:10 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: Hey Barry (and/or Big John)!
Message:
Great Journey - but can one of you e-mail it to brian@ex-premie.org so it can get posted in the 'Journey' section of the site? (The FA's don't deal with anything but the forum)

Thanks!
Katie

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 01:54:39 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: I'll take care of that NT
Message:
NT
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 07:06:28 (GMT)
From: suchabanana
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: Reality of: 'The Abuser and his Co-dependents' (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:14:41 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: The recurrence of anger.
Message:
A very heartfelt journey. Probably a fairly typical theme, but with variations from person to person.

When I read this, I get really angry at Maharaji (again). I go through long periods when this is more of a fun, intellectual, interesting exercise. And then I read something like John's Journey and it makes me really angry.

SO MANY LIVES Maharaji ruined. So much loss he caused to so many people. And not just some people. He did it to people who were sincerely searching like John was, who sincerely had needs and believed Maharaji that he could fulfill them. In the meantime, they trashed the lives, things they loved and things that REALLY mattered, chasing after Maharaji's lies.

I guess it puts me in touch with that 'ripped off' feeling. The sense of extreme injustice having been done, and the knowledge that Maharaji has not only not paid for what he did, he hasn't even admitted he did it.

There is s special place in hell for people like Maharaji.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:39:30 (GMT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: Excellent Journey
Message:
To Big John,

I hope you can read here. Good to read your journey, and good to read of a couple of old names. Jon Cainer was renowned in Leeds as the longest serving aspirant. Being turned down for K because he wasn't married contrasts with the earlier attitude where premies were discouraged from getting married. Also interesting to hear about George Blodwell. I'm not surprised to hear he's an Image Consultant - the last time I saw him (in about 1980) he told me he was dressing the rich and famous. Is he still a premie, does anyone know?

John (also a bit too big)

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:29:47 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: Thanks
Message:
Thanks for the story! And thanks for translating 'got sent down', but us guys in the U.S. never say 'arse,' so it would have to be 'thrown out on my ass.'
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:15:47 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: hamzen@hotmail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: What would you like to hear gm say?
Message:
or ham@hamzen.freeserve.co.uk

As I build up a database of individual words from gm's talks, I'll be able to get him saying anything you fancy, so any ideas?
Ohh and please send me recent recordings, in either mp3, aiff, wav or ideally sdII formats,

For those not sure how to transfer cassettes into computer files, it isn't that difficult.

To record onto computer, certainly a mac, you just need standard phono jacks from your amplifier, probably using the cassette out sockets, to a mini jack (3.5mm) to plug into your 'audio in' on your computer.
Phono to mini - jack are easy to pick up from any hi-fi store,
recording onto free sound recorder software, loads of them around, could sort for macs easy, can get hold of for pc's,
and save the files. I can translate them into proper audio files, but better quality sound recordings if you get them into mp3 format.
Think most mp3 players then enable you to save into aiff, wav, or sdII format. If yours doesn't, mp3 files are fine.
Any problems, please e-mail me.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:06:03 (GMT)
From: Lesley
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: What would you like to hear gm say?
Message:
Sorry, I was wrong.

Of course you might have a bit of trouble finding the word sorry, unless he has talked about the sorry state of his devotees!

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:57:27 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: What would you like to hear gm say?
Message:
A grovelling apology and a promise to sell all his expensive tchochkes and give it back to his victims.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:51:21 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: Some bed talk..nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:14:29 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Would you like my watch collection---(NT)
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 21:03:50 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: care to dance?
Message:
would you like to see me in my pearl mala?
I have great pot!
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 20:46:53 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: bill
Subject: Hi bill!
Message:
Hi bill,

How are ya? Happy New Year!

Gee, what would I like to hear goomraji say?

''I've decided to retire. With that decision, I will sell off all of my worldly possessions, including all my residences, autos, boats, planes, and everything of value, because I am moving to Tibet to become a monk in order to attone for my sins. Any and all victims of Jagdeo will be offered settlements of at least $1 million each, and this will be done with confidentiality and with no questions asked--this can be done by contacting their legal representative, Marianne.

I think it only appropriate that those who slaved...opps, I mean ''worked'' for me at DECA receive full compensation for all hours worked. In addition, I will also compensate all who were in any way physically and/or emotionally injured because of my insatiable greed and ego because in fact, I have been running a cult. As an extra, I will provide any former premies with my many tons of excellent weed, which, of course, is my big secret stash; I am willing relinquish it to those who want any. Oh, yeah, by the way, I'm sorry.''
m

Yes, it's a pipe dream, but that's what I'd like to hear from the fucking bastard.

Love,
Cynthia

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 18:23:48 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Hi Cynthia
Message:
Mike Dettmers is here at present, maybe we should ask him some questions!
I thought of you just yesterday, I heard the Kansas City song on the radio.
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 07:11:38 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: bill
Subject: m should sing 'Do ya think I'm sexy' (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:03:32 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: OT question to Nigel
Message:
Nigel,

I accidentally visited your site a couple days ago. I did a search for +reflexology +cult, and your site was listed. It was quite a surprise to me because I had not visited your site previously. Something caught my eye. Nobby Lewis. I'm not sure I was seeing correctly. Would you mind telling me the story about him? (Thelma might be interested, as well).

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 20:48:59 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Way
Subject: Nobby Lewis (ot)
Message:
The site has been unchanged for 12 months since I stopped paying a subscription to Demon - although I have since added many new entries and completely changed many of those currently on-line. Demon should have taken the thing off-line ages ago, but I have since decided to resume subscriptions and update the site. I'll announce when it's officially reopened (though obviously I can't stop people visiting in the meantime).

The reflexology article is currently just an index entry. The piece is not yet written.

'Nobby Lewis' is the name affectionately given by the locals to the statue positioned above the doorway of 'Lewis's' - Liverpool's largest and oldest department store. Who the naked figure is supposed to represent, I haven't a clue.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 21:00:38 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: How about a link to your site Nigel:)-nt
Message:
adrg
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:48:22 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: OT question to Nigel
Message:
Don't tell me I know all of you! Just emailed Bazza re his post above because of a mutual acquaintance of Big John's, George Blodwell whose ears must be ringing right now.

Guess I'll just have to come out of the closet sooner than expected.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 11:44:09 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: salam
Subject: See Anything Goes (OT) nt
Message:
Shit has happened.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:18:38 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: See Anything Goes.......
Message:
and say hello.

Anything Goes

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:42:39 (GMT)
From: TED Farkel
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Mr.eDrek-DAVID SMITH loves the boob site...
Message:
Hey Mr. eDrek-

Just a quick note for ya, son....wanted to let you know that ole Dave Smith LOVES your boob site.
I caught him takin a peek at it the other night,musta been oh about 3 or 4 in the morning, he got up outa the loft with my 2 blue-tic hounds and went downstairs to take a pee...but me, ole country boy TED, I caught him sneakin a beer outa the fridge (didn't pay for it), and firing up my new dell, and checkin out the dancin boobs for an hour or so...(he was doing something else while he was watching it, but I don't think it's appropriate to talk about that kinda stuff here on the forum...)

But anyway, son, don't let that ole mind get you down,I even heard DAVE tell some of the boys at the shop the other day that he's fightin his mind all the time...I keep tellin him to just put his $1.50/beer in the donation box like everyone else, pop a foamy and kick back and watch 6 or 7 videos(and 6 or 7 brewskies) with us each night, but he's too cheap to kick in the moola...so Dave's strugglin, just like you Mr. eDrek...

It's OK, we're havin fun, and since this is such a hot bed of propagation down here in Mobile, national jus told me that after Dave puts in his 2 weeks here, we're gettin raja ji down here next, to prepare the aspirants for the first DV auto knowledge sessions...

Got to go, Mr. eDrek, sorry you missed the NY eve bash, it was right devotional, and a lot of fun too.(Dave got a little 'tipsy'...he had a few foamies, and got to doing some break dancin underneath the psychedelic mirror ball on the ceiling while we had the flashing green toilet bowls and boob site flashin on the wall...it was quite a scene, Mr.e Drek,specially when we got to playin a little down home country music out back by the outhouse...Dave was playin the spoons and banging on a 55 gallon oil drum like it was a bongo drum, late into the night...had to be there, I guess...)

TED Farkel
(Dave sends his best, but isn't quite sure that he knows you..)

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:53:06 (GMT)
From: David Smith
Email: None
To: TED Farkel
Subject: I do not love the boob site!
Message:
This is untrue. I do not love the boob site, in fact, I hardly ever look at it, not more than a few times a week, but only because I am an official monitor of this dung heap for Maharaji, the Master, yeah, that's right, a monitor the the Master, whom I no longer think of in terms of God. I do not, ping, sputter, repeat, I do not, ping, sputter, repeat, it is all just about enjoying life, beep, rewind, it is just about enjoyinglife, beep, rewind, it is just about boobs, boobs, boobs, God Maharaji, I want to fuck you, beep, sputter, crash, meltdown.....!
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:59:52 (GMT)
From: Gordon Showcase
Email: None
To: David Smith
Subject: Don't fret dear instructor Smith
Message:
I have a job lot of blow-up Maharaji dolls with the big bouncing boobs and these are made from super strong latex and are just like the real thing!

We can have one dressed in a mala for you, red Krishna costume, expensive suit, leather flying gear or anything you want. We also have a job lot of plastic crowns which were originally for a Barbi convention but they can be altered with suitable peacock feathers and plastic jewels to look just like a Krishna cown.

Of course, these blow-up Maharaji dolls have all working parts - vibrating anus, vibrating penis and they give head too!

You can also buy our delux model which yells at you and insults you in a screaching voice as you lovingly roger it. Buy one now, Mr Instructor Smith and you'll be able to have guilt free sex with darshan for the first time in your life!

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:49:36 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: TED Farkel
Subject: Mr.eDrek-DAVID SMITH loves the boob site...
Message:
Well, TED, I'm so very proud of you for doing such a great job for our Lord, the Maharaji! And I'm so grateful that you've been reaping the benefits of Auto-Knowledge so quickly. And I'm really glad that David Smith likes the House of Maharaji Drek Maharaji dancing tribute page. If David Smith has a credit card I could show him so much more.

You are very fortunate, indeed. Our Lord, Maharaji, must be taking a shining to you to bless you with so much so quickly! Imagine having, so soon, the most high and most devoted David Smith staying with you helping with a very synchronized propagation effort. And Raja Ji, too! Raja is one cut-up of a prankster. Give him a few drinks and he'll get on down with you and tell it like it is. Make sure that you've got a decent single malt scotch on hand because Raja doesn't like blends.

Me, I'm not doing so good here in Carmarillo, CA. While Southern California is one mighty fine place to be, it's a little pretentious. The premies here sure know how to make things prim and proper to the point where I'd often stay home and watch the ol' boob site myself. Foamies? You think these fancy pants premies in Westlake Village know how well a nice cold one goes down while listening to the Lord? Not hardly, not ever, no way!

I've tried introducing myself to the premies but when I do they get all stand offish and act like they've been deeply offended in the worst way imaginable. I don't know what's going on with them. I suppose maybe they feel that my efforts to help the Lord are not exactly synchronized or something. Like I said, TED, California is one mighty fine place, but there's nothing like having Georgia on my mind.

You know, TED, the Lord used to say 'keep it simple' and I think that you are doing just that and that's why you are having so much success in bringing new folks to the Lord's Auto-Knowledge. TED, can you supply me with a list of the aspirant's names and how many videos and how many foamies they've actually paid for? I think if I have some good numbers to bring to the Event Synchronization Managers they might not treat me as such a carpetbagger.

Hell, I'm trying to do the same thing they are - propagate the Lord's message. It's just that their ideas of synchronization don't quite jibe with my ideas. TED, why can't they see I'm just trying to help. They call me a bongo and I get followed around everywhere. Even when I go out back for a big red Marlboro there they are - watching me watching them watching me. Why can't they just leave me alone? What have I ever done to them? I'm just trying to help my Lord.

Aw, I'm sorry TED. I shouldn't trouble you with my trials and tribulations. It's just that I love my Lord so much and I need to show him that love somehow, you know? Kinda like when there's that new special philly in town and you just can't stop yourself from making phone calls and hanging up and you park your car across the street and watch for her all night long. Ok, it's my own special love and it's not like everybody else's, but what's wrong with that?

And, TED, why do we all have to just sit quietly in the dark watching the video of our Lord here in California? Why can't I hoot and holler at the good parts? Why do I have to sneak a swig from my flask when I want to proudly hold up a glass and offer a toast to my Lord? And why can't I writhe around on the floor and moan when the spirit is really moving me?

TED, the propagation, if it's gonna ever again happen, is gonna happen in the hinterlands and there you are in at the ground floor. Maharaji is watching your bold, yet simple, effort and that's why he's sending in the big guns like David Smith and Raja Ji. Maharaji knows that he's got to get something going here in the bottom of the 9th inning with bases loaded, 2 outs, 3 balls and 2 strikes. This is the World Series with everybody's soul's at stake, TED, and you are the pinch hitter that the coach, Maharaji, has put into the game. You've got to knock the ball out of the park, TED. The Lord needs a homerun, TED, and he's counting on you.

TED, you are truly graced! There's no doubt about it. I can see the day when Maharaji drives up to the shop in his motorhome and tells you that he wants a complete rebuild, including a gold-plated transmission. That's gonna be your big payoff, TED. Price will be no object, TED. It will be a beautiful, beautiful synchronized effort guided and managed by Lord. All the new premies and aspirants in Mobile will be have a golden opportunity to serve their new Lord.

And you know what, TED? It's just the beginning of a long and wonderful relationship with the Lord.

Bhole Shri Satguru Dev Maharaj Ki Jai, TED!

Jai Satchitanand!

P.S. Have you got your SmartCard yet? I just used mine to reserve a seat at the Oxnard program. Ask David Smith if it would be ok for you to attend. I'm sure he'll understand how important it would be for you to further cement your relationship with our Lord at this early stage in your development.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 05:41:52 (GMT)
From: TED Farkel
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Mr.eDrek-Bolie to you too,son!List is on the waynt
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 22:18:04 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: TED Farkel
Subject: Good news! Synchronization from Malibu!
Message:
TED,

I just got out of a conference call with the Event Resource Manager, Event Synchronization Manager, Attendee Relations Manager, Facilities Manger, and the International Event Communication coordinator, all members of the Participation Team (PT). They all expressed their appreciation for your commendable selfless efforts to help spread the message of Maharaji, our Lord.

However, they are concerned that there is not enough synchronization and that you might be operating outside any real established guidelines created by the Participation Team, all volunteers and not employees or brainwashed slaves of a cult. Because your operation is the only propagation effort in all of the industrialized First World that is showing an increase in attendance by aspirants the Participation Team is willing to allow a more relaxed adherence to their official synchronized guidelines. And such guidelines include the ratio of Ushers to People With Knowledge (PWKs) and Ushers to the General Public, as well as dress code and lighting, seating, and other facility related matters including creating and maintaining the proper atmosphere that is appropriate to hear the message of the Master.

So, TED, I'm offering my services to help synchronize your efforts with the needs of the Participation Team. I bring a lot of good experience to qualify me for this volunteer participation position. I often sorted jumble at the Divine Sales in Denver back in the '70s and I knew many of the Denver IHQ volunteers - well, not personally but I knew who they were.

What I'm hoping here, TED, is that I can help, once again, serve my Lord and eventually move up the organizational ladder and eventually become X-Rated. Of course, the Participation Team is somewhat leery of my efforts to help spread the message of our Lord and they express concerns that my website House of Maharaji might be inappropriate. But, TED, the Participation Team is desperate - I mean they are desperate to help our Lord spread his Knowledge. Therefore, they are willing to overlook our eccentricities and our variance from the party line.

As far as counting the number of people attending videos at the shop the Participation Team is willing to accept almost any method of counting that you wish to use. So, TED, it sounds to me that you can continue to count people each time they return from the outhouse. It's dark and how can you really know if it's someone who just left or someone coming in off the streets for the first time. To help our Lord we can be generous on this.

Now as far as David Smith goes and the visit by Raja Ji it would appear that the Participation Team is a little more than concerned about reports about David Smith's behavior. Apparently, David Smith has never acted like this before. It's as if he is acting out after many years of very intense self-repression. I tried to assure the PT that David Smith was only blissing out because of the intensely devotional atmosphere at the shop and the good time 1970's style community participation. TED, maybe you should cut him off after six foamies.

Nevertheless, the PT is skeptical and the visit by Raja Ji is for the purpose of determining whether David Smith's mission needs to be terminated. Raja Ji, in case you didn't know, was in charge of the World Peace Corp (WPC) and was known for his rough tactics. My advice, TED, on dealing with Raja Ji, uh, I mean helping Raja Ji see that everything is on the up and up is to acquire some Peruvian Marching Powder and leave it laying out for Raja Ji to find. In no time at all, Raja Ji will quickly see how important and valuable your propagation efforts are.

One final thing, TED, the Participation Team wants me to collect your concessions profits. They also suggested that you offer draft beer and call it Micro-Brewed and raise the price to $3.00 per 12 ounces - no pints here, mate. Be sure to get a beer tap with a lock because the PT is suspecting some irregularities going on after hours.

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:24:36 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Maharaji's irresponsability. Example
Message:
Here is a link from a poem at Lard's site, from the Poetry section. Notice how M put a line there saying: 'I have nobody no one else to call.'

I Have No One Else To Call

I own many video where he says same exact thing, in devotional songs is said too, which shwos his desire to control you to the point that you beging to think taht nobody cares about you but him.

This particular manipulation touches home, because I was at many times very close to comitting suicide, by not being able to love him enough to surrender my life to him.

The excuses some people use to let Lard of the hook here is simply enervant! Who else then put the wrong words in people's heads, followers, than the cult leader himself? He should begin to acknoledge taht peple are dying because of his greedy trip.

Let's take the emotions that this deaths provoque in us ex-premies and for the good, good writters around here: Can someone try to address the media asking to investigate? If one member of the media publishes information I am sure angry families of the death ones may come forward.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 23:59:20 (GMT)
From: Pauline Premie
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: Love's Glue
Message:
I especially am blissed out and filled with the synchronized gift of gratitude when Maharaji said:

Fasten me close to yourself with love's glue

Someone lacking that gift of that understanding might be asking themselves, 'what is love's glue?'

It's like one time I was making a mala for Maharaji when I was doing participation at an event, working 52 hours straight, putting 322,000 small sequints on this beautiful mala with Super Glue. Those premies doing participation referred to Super Glue, as 'love's glue.' It was so beautiful.

Well, at one point I got so in my mind, and was just so unfocused, I had to go to the bathroom, and I was so unsynchronized, and about to soil my pants, that I ran, without first getting Love's Glue off my hands, into the Port-A-Let, that Maharaji so lovingly provided for us. After gagging for a few minutes because of the smell, I sat down, and immediately fell asleep, because my mind did not want me to experience that love. I was so unfocused and filled with the impurities of this world. When I woke up, I found that I could not get up from the seat in the Port-A-Let, because I attached by 'love's glue.' I must have touched myself in inappropriate places, because I was so confused and in my mind. The mind is strongest, the closer you are to Maharaji, you know. That's why so many people around Maharaji, are insane, or mindless robots like David Smith. I hope and pray to Maharaji to one day be like them, but I digress.

I know that was just Maharaji's lila to teach me to be both synchronized and not give into my mind or bodily functions, and the strength of Love's Glue. Finally, they broke the door down and Dr. John Horton got me removed from the seat, but I have to say, he seemed to touch me in a lot of unnecessary places first, but I'm sure that was just my mind, because Dr. John Horton is not a sex-crazed monster, but an evolved, and very high, instructor, who Maharaji loves deeply.

I hope one day, all you confused ex-premies can experience 'Love's Glue' the way I have, and the way Maharaji describes it in his beautiful and very literary, poem.

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 14:47:19 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Love's Glue? hahahahah
Message:
Pauline, darling, keep up your good work. Is nothink like stating facts, specially when it comes to reveal what an adorable considerate master we all follow/ed?

All nighters? Yap. I did them too, by the glory of the greedy living bastard, sorry, master. His grace is so great. I have so many memories...Yack!

Praise the truth: Mahalard sucks.

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 08:21:14 (GMT)
From: C.G.
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Love Glue Chuckle - Best Of the Forum Vote
Message:
She does it again. Who is she? Do you think she is male or female?

She's damn funny.

Curious George

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:00:27 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Love's Glue
Message:
I need some of that 'love's glue' to keep my fucking colostomy bag from falling off when I get so blissed out that I break into a sweat and it melts.
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 00:51:15 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Pauline, would you like to give satsang at TED's?
Message:
Pauline,

That was really, really beautiful. You're satsang really inspired me and I was feeling Holy Name so strongly that I had to shut my eyes because the waves of bliss were so strong, you know?

Pauline, I'm helping with the Synchronization between the Participation Team of unpaid volunteers, who are not members of a cult, and TED Farkel's Transmission Repair and Auto-Knowledge Centre (TRAC) formerly known as Farkel's Transmission Repair Shop (TRS). TRAC is located in beautiful rural Alabama just 23 miles south of Mobile, which, BTW, is a lot like Amaroo because both are hot and have dangerous snakes everywhere.

At TRAC videos of our Lord are shown every night and bottled beer is only $1.50 and the new Micro-Brews are a reasonable $3.00.

Currently in residence is Instructor and X-Rated David Smith. David is absolutely so, so very blissed out at the number of aspirants that come to the videos that he is having a difficult time containing himself.

TED suggests that a Tuesday night would be the best night for your special satsang because Tuesday is Ladies Night at the TRAC and beer is free for all ladies arriving unaccompanied.

So, what do you say, Pauline? Can you help our Lord, the Maharaji, by helping spread your selfless love and cheerful bliss at Farkel's TRAC, the Aspirant Magnet of the West where devotion gets going at half past midnight every night 365 days a year?

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:04:45 (GMT)
From: TED Farkel
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Oh GOD,Mr. eDrek,I'm in LOVE,and I'm all shook up!
Message:
Dear Mr. e Drek-

Son, ya gotta help ole country boy TED Farkel....I mean it, this is no time for wise crackin or funny stories...I'm guilty, and it's love in the first degree!

Let me explain...

See, I was tryin, I was really tryin, real hard, to do it just like Ole David Smith does it, you know, the horny celibate and cold shower routine...

It was goin OK, cos well let's face it, I'm just a grease monkey down here in Shaft, and between spreading the divine knowledge of our lord, and fixin transmissions, ole TED doesn't have time for too much else....usually...

But then, you know, that ole mind rears it's ugly head, I get some of them carnal desires, and it's off to the races...(or showers,like Dave does), if you follow my drift...

So, OK, I've had a real hankerin for Janice Wilson, I make no bones about it...I don't care if Jim Heller has a crush on her or not, I'm just crazy for premie wild women with that crazy devotional streak and hot poetry comin outa their mouth all the time, like Janice...

But Janice don't respond to my e-mails, and she even made fun of my poetry that I sent her, so hell with Janice...

But that Pauline, why she can spin a satsang like nobody's business, she's always right on the money and always protecting our lord from those vicious mind induced attacks from those burnt out ex/hippie/premies...

Well, Mr.eDrek, I'm fallin, and I'm fallin fast...I'm in love and I want the whole site to know...

But tell me, she's so devotional, will she give a guy like TED Farkel a chance?
Would she come down to Shaft, Alabama for a beer/video?
You're right,Tues. would be best...ladies night,free beer...(I'll
take her outa the shop when the boys do the wet T-shirt contest after the videos....don't want to freak her out or anything...)

But would a gal with premie pedigree like Pauline give me the time of day?

Can you help me son?
I'd be forever indebted, and could probably make you chief jumbler for the Divine Sales we're opening up outside the shop next month....
National's tryin to bring in a synchronized jumbling team just freshly trained from the yacht on the east coast, but like you say, ole TED's got some clout, cos of all the prachar, or propagation going down here, so I'm thinkin I could tell em to send the team, but make you the senior consultant and jumblin synchronizer for the Mobile Jumblers...don't worry, you won't be 'Down in Mobile with the Memphis Blues again' like Bobby Dylan was last time he came by the shop..(BTW,that boy was always in his mind)...
So, Mr. eDrek, put in a kind word for ole TED, will ya? I'd be right greatful for a date with Miss Pauline, and promise to do nothin more than S&M on the first date....

OK,later
TED Farkel
(chillin with Dave)

PS:Will work on arrangements later tonight re: Malibu numbers etc...(maybe my people can meet with your people at the pig pickin tonite...it's pert near full moon...see your folks back behind the outhouse...we'll be banging oil drums till the sun comes up..)

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 03:14:01 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: TED Farkel
Subject: Good god, man! Don't FALL in love!
Message:
TED, I think we've had this conversation before, haven't we? You know, the one about falling in love and how when you fall in love bad things can happen to ya like falling off of the devotional path and getting eaten up by the mind. In fact, TED, the mind wants you to fall in love so that the mind can get a toe hold back into your life. And when the mind gets an inch it stretches that into a foot and then like a hungry bayou crocodile it's got ya!

And, TED, wasn't Pauline Premie the object of your desire last time, too? I think so.

Take it from me, TED, you fall in love and then you fall out of love and the next thing you know that sow wallowing in the mud behind the outhouse starts looking mighty good. Lust and desire are of this world, TED. Where Maharaji, our Lord, wants to take you is so, so, so far beyond what you've ever experienced in this world. It is like eating a mango, TED. I can tell you about that mango, I can show you color photos of a mango, I can even show you movies of a mango being eaten, BUT! it is only when you and YOU alone eat the mango when you will understand the sublime joy and beauty of that mango. Do understand that analogy, TED? If you don't understand it I can repeat it in a different way. The analogy of the mango is most basic and most essential to your understanding (e.g. 'stand under') of this Knowledge and the Master, the Maharaji. If we can't get past this then there is nowhere to proceed.

And, of course, we cannot proceed down the path of devotion unless you are fully aware of the consequences of falling off the path or more likely being fooled by old Mr. Mind, who appears to be residing right now in your lowest chakra - down in your pants, TED. So, learn from your brother, David Smith. Learn to love the stinging sobering refreshment of a long cold shower. Make note on how you are more alert and less likely to fall asleep during meditation. And just because you're under the sheets don't think that our Lord doesn't notice when you touch yourself inappropriately. Omniscient and omnipresent is our Lord.

TED, here is a picture of Pauline Premie. Yes, she is quite the so, so beautiful devotee of our Lord. I can hardly fault you for being so driven nearly mad by your desire. Ok, let's see if we can convince Pauline to make the trip down to Shaft to give a beautiful satsang to all the new aspirants. I'm sure she'll want to have everyone dressed up for the occasion. TED, do you have a three piece disco suit from the '70s? I think that would look nice and Pauline could see that you are sincere. Maybe sending her a picture of yourself.

Listen, TED, I appreciate the offer to be senior jumbler consultant down there in the Shaft, but I've got other plans, TED, big plans if you know what I mean. So, get me the list of aspirants and send me a check for the concession profits as soon as you can. The Boss (as we call him out here in California) has put out the word that he has a great new idea for propagation and he might do a national tour where he drives around the country in his mobile home and stops in small towns and speaks at small intimate venues like libraries and high schools. And, you know, TED, these tours cost money and we certainly can't have Maharaji staying at anything less than a 5 star hotel.

This could be it, TED. This could be when Maharaji really reveals his power and rips open the universe and blows the doors off of everything that isn't nailed down. Are you with me, TED? I sure hope so. Now get that check in the mail so I can get it to our Lord so he can do his work. It's a very bad thing to keep the Lord waiting. He's heard about the profits from the beer/video nights and he is making great plans that will affect all of us. Don't let Mr. Mind delay. Remember our Lord says, 'Do not put off today what you can do tomorrow.'

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:48:25 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: TED, one last idea - a personal mtg with D. Smith
Message:
TED,

Back in the good old days whenever we felt the Mind starting to confuse us or we were seeking direction in our lives, many of us would make appointments with initiators, Mahatmas, General Secretaries, DUO Directors or anybody with the any kind of official title.

These meetings would be held in a formal and quiet place where the exalted one would have complete power over the situation and we would (I suppose I should just speak for myself here, huh?) feel rather small and quite intimidated.

So, TED, maybe you need a personal appointment with David Smith to clear up this falling in love with Pauline Premie maya. Hopefully, David Smith when in his position of absolute intimidating power will snap back to his former self and he will humiliate you and set you straight all at the same time.

At the very least if David Smith doesn't make you feel bad about yourself you will need to give me a phone call and I'm going to have to call up the hill (that's what we say here at the Trancas Market where I'm a bag boy) to see about getting an extraction operation to get David Smith outta there. Can I count on you, TED? This is important. The PAMs have passed word on down that the Boss is getting a little worried about the Shaft Experiment and he might have to send David Smith on a grueling tour to India where David always gets so sick with dysentery.

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 08:33:36 (GMT)
From: C.G.
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: i was intimidated by D. Smith recently
Message:
Notice the small i. i am nothing but what ever pauline premie says i am!

I picked up three instructors quite recently and they all tried to intimidate me in their own little ways. i could go into detail but i don't want to bother. Attempts were also made to intimidate me when i went to Long Beach to do some service.

i could think i have an inferiority complex which i'm sure they would all agree with - only I don't feel this way with any of my friends. So why do they all do this. Any ideas? They all need to go to the put-down corner. i think they know they are doing things wrong and have to make other people feel wrong to make themselves feel right or something weird like that.

C.G.

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 14:49:23 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: C.G.
Subject: Is called control: David Smith sucks!! NT
Message:
he really does.
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:41:25 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Good god, man!
Message:
Poor old Rev Rawat. He doesn't know what he's up against. If he could have seen into the future like a 'guru who is greater than god' the poor sod would have stayed in India.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:11:43 (GMT)
From: Wish
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: Depends Who this poem refers to
Message:
If premies read this and address it to m himself they are in deep shit. But when I was a premie and read that, I always thought it was directed to God, within or outside, and in that sense it's a kind of devotion to yourself, which isn't all that bad actually.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 21:52:53 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Wish
Subject: No, it's bad either way.
Message:
Rawat's poem presents the same question as does Arti. Do we sing Arti to God, or to the guru? We sang Arti to God, but focused on Maharaji's face. The theory is that finite human beings cannot love the Infinite directly. They need a human representative to learn that perfect love. The theory goes on to say that as long as the guru is permanently in God-consciousness, then the devotee loves God as he loves the guru.

I suppose that the theory would work out to everybody's satisfaction is there were indeed some such perfect representative. But the problem is: how do you tell if you are singing Arti to God or to some bozo. The answer is: you can't. You cannot tell what is the consciousness of another person.

The question also arises' if we sing Arti to God directly, does that song become valid? The words say, basically: 'you are my all,' (just as Rawat's poem says). If a person parrots the words to Arti as merely words he has learned, then they are of course meaningless. In reality, people of fundmentalist religious persuasion do sing such words and attempt to give their love exclusively to God, and reject all other loves. Loving God in such a way is just as bad as loving God through a guru.

Rawat has always blurred the line between God and guru. His poetry, therefore, must be rejected. (It's painfully bad as art, but that's not the point). It must be rejected also because it calls for a love that goes to God alone, rejecting all others. God, if IT exists, is all-inclusive Oneness, by definition. It isn't gained by a process of rejection. If Rawat were a realized soul, his poetry would express God in all, not God instead of all.

The guru says: 'Let me be the face of God for you.' And 'get your God only from me'. We must say no to that proposition. But this does not mean that we cannot manifest God for each other. In the film 'Dead Man Walking,' (based on a true story), a nun befriends a man condemned to death. He invites her to be present at his execution, which she accepts. She tells him to look at her while he is dying. She says: 'Let me be the face of love for you.' It is a powerful and moving scene in the movie, and it represents a possibility that all humans have with each other. But we must remember that we can only express the love that is within us all equally. We can never ever represent that love as if we are the exclusive source of that love.

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:55:05 (GMT)
From: Deputy Dog
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Way IMO your post hits the nail right on the head!
Message:
How can you tell if you are singing 'Arti' to God or just to some bozo? Way, I consider this an incredible and profound statement! Hey, we can’t. So why bother. Why take the chance. That’s why I’m so impressed with Buddhism.

I invite all exes and premies alike who enjoy meditating to investigate Buddhism, because finite human beings can love the infinite directly. The theory that they can't was probably made up by someone who had a vested interest in people thinking that way.

Buddha taught only one thing – suffering and the end of suffering. The goal of Buddhism is sunyata or emptiness. By using Knowledge and by learning mindfulness or vipassana from a reputable Buddhist meditation teacher you can make yourself as a space without meaning or content. It’s kinda like “Stop the world, I want to get off . . . .at least for a while.” They call the state of emptiness “original mind.” No self, no problem!

We don't need to have a face of God.

Two mirrors reflect each other.
There is no image in between!

Being nothing, you are everything. Our thoughts are our karma, and through mindfulness we step out of the mind-spin. Wiping the slate clean brings relaxation and relief.

We can transcend our mind by experiencing it directly. An old and well used koan is “Mind is Buddha.”

The goal of Buddhism is to experience that part of you that existed before your parents were born. The Buddha Nature is the perfect representative! Worshipping form is limited. There is no room for form junkies here. If Gautama Siddhartha (i.e. Buddha) could see people bowing to statues of him, he would think it was hilarious. He would definitely agree with the statement “If you meet the Buddha on the road . . . . .”

To illustrate this there is the famous story of a venerated Zen master who died, and decided to visit his monastery as a ghost. He appeared in the steam coming off a pot of stew, and much to his chagrin the old monk he wanted to impress waved his ladle through the steam to make the apparition disappear. That is the spirit of Buddhism

The following poem by Kuleki sums up Buddhism for me.
“After almost 50 years I seem, at last, to be ready to be a nobody. What a long journey! What a lot of trouble! Especially considering I was there all the time.”

Sorry if I'm coming across as a Buddhist / Jehovah’s Witness, but there are a lot of hurting exes here and if this post can help interested exes to get into something I consider of value, then I’ve done my good deed of the day. Or do I just want exes to think of Deputy Dog as a “Wonderful Guy!”

Okay, so maybe I’m not a 100 percent Buddha. Just come from love and let the good times roll.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:16:02 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Wish
Subject: But you know better, don't you?
Message:
We cannot denied the shhhhit he pulled on us.

Devotion, appreciation toward the master, gratittude, to name a few.

I left a year a go. When did you exit the evil claws? Just curious, then I respond according to your answer.

c ya

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 07:32:16 (GMT)
From: Joy
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: What Absolute Drivel
Message:
It doesn't rhyme, the syncopation (is that the right word? alliteration?) is totally sloppy, it's clunky to read.

My 12 year old niece could write better poetry! My friend Kathy is a real poet and writes some killer good stuff, and she's just an ordinary human being.

But what really gets me is the infuriating subject matter. It's the same sly game he always used to play. Hinting around and playing coy footsy with the idea that he's somehow divine. This is just incredibly ballsy, to insinuate that he is somehow omniscient and can hear one's cry from the heart?

'Hear me for I call out to you
You alone must hear my plea'

'Bless me with nothing less'

. . . implying that he has the power to bless one? To hear one's heart's call?

Get real! Does the man's ego know any limits???

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:04:01 (GMT)
From: Gregg
Email: None
To: Joy
Subject: Maybe it was better in the original Hindi...(nt)
Message:
x
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:30:16 (GMT)
From: Scott T.
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: Can't see it
Message:
This is virtually the only site on the internet that I've encountered so far that won't open the page unless you accept a cookie, and once you get to the lame 'accepting a cookie will in no way compromise your genetic code' page they won't let you employ the back button unless you accept a cookie again. It's a cult, alright.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:23:08 (GMT)
From: Larkin
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: M's poetry? - it's good stuff, really it is...
Message:
Humpty wrote:

>>>>
In silence I learn to listen
In simple joy I begin to glisten
All thoughts seem so distant
Want to feel only the instant
The clever in me wants to fear
The heart in me wants the dear
Conflict is, but will be over
Heart will win, I will be sober

What he meant to write was:

>
In silence I learn to listen
But I hear no children scream
In simple joy I begin to glisten
I overdid the Brylcreme
All thoughts seem so distant
Really, thinking's such a pain
Want to feel only the instant
gratification once again
The clever in me wants to fear
Hey, what's this crap I'm scribbling?
The heart in me wants the dear
Oh Christ, I've started dribbling...
Conflict is, but will be over
They'll call me the new Gandhi
Heart will win, I will be sober
Now, where did I put that brandy..?

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:44:23 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Larkin
Subject: Brilliant Larkin
Message:
Give up the day job.

Anth who rhymnes sometimes.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:59:37 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Larkin
Subject: Nice (nt)
Message:
ffffff
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:09:53 (GMT)
From: Fact/sb
Email: None
To: Larkin
Subject: Maestro: Where have u been?
Message:
Please, don't forget us. Laughs are always welcome specially when are the result of your poems. Hilarious, always.

thanks,

sb

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 08:40:39 (GMT)
From: C.G.
Email: None
To: Fact/sb
Subject: M's two new poems as bad as ever for 2001
Message:
He sure like the word bosoms....Reminds me of a naughty schoolboy that we all know he is. I think hes been peeping at himself on Sir Dave's site.

When I read his poetry I hear that sickly voice he read his bad poetry with.. yuk I feel sick.

C.G.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:53:01 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Larkin
Subject: The Poet Laureate Of Exland Does It Again nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:36:08 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Fact
Subject: Typical - the bastard disables your 'back' button.
Message:
And no way will I click on any sort of legal agreement with the Tubster to access his divine wisdom. I did that years ago and he reneged on the deal.

Any chance you could quote the poem here to save others the hassle?

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:20:26 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: THIS is the version you should all read
Message:
I've got it looking just lovely.

Click here for Maharaji's ILLUSTRATED divine poem

Do you think that Maharaji will be pleased?

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:35:32 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Sorry, I didn't get it
Message:
Something supposed to be different? I can't see it.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:26:47 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Dumb Shit!
Message:
Your opponent, in the end, is never really the player on the
other side of the net, or the swimmer in the next lane, or
the team on the other side of the field, or even the bar you
must high-jump. Your opponent is yourself, your negative
internal voices, your level of determination.
--- Grace Lichtenstein
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 05:49:27 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: OK, got it (nt)
Message:
gggggggg
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:33:08 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Bullshit!!!
Message:
Fuck off Heller. This was a nice place during your absence.

Fuck Off!!!

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:53:41 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: That is not nice at all!!
Message:
Common. How can you say taht and feel you can say it???

He has the right to be here. Learn to accept that everybody has the right to post here.

So what you don't like his personality.

I am glad Jim is back. People ARE ALWAYS BUGGING HIM AND I AM SICK OF IT!!

I know he doesn't need me to say that. I like him lots and you guys who get aggressive with him have to look at your real motives why you dislike him. Does he reminds you of your father?

Love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:14:48 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: It might have been 'nice' but.....
Message:
I for one was nearly driven away, since I don't have his stamina, even though I was sorely tempted at times.......

Jim being back, albeit in reduced mode has chirped me up no end.

Now not trying to start a barney with you Oliver, but different horses for different courses eh, all the flavours of the rainbow etc etc

As long as we all remember why we're here, most of the time at least, etc etc

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:26:30 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Lovely variation!!
Message:
You are the best. Thanks for the laughs.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:02:54 (GMT)
From: Fact/SB
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: Here is the quoted poem
Message:
Just You

'Sun shines in the sky
As you do in my life
I feel the warmth of love
Your love that melts the strife.

The sound of your call
Pierces deep within
Within my bossom, my heart
Calls out to you; the thirst deepens

Hear me because I call out to you
You alone must hear my plea
I have no one else to call
No one else will hear me

Bless me with nothing less
Fasten me close to yourself with love's glue
For this time I seek nothing else
But just you.'

m (as he signs his poem in his web site)

SB/Fact

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:57:34 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: Here it is -- Maharaji's shining glory
Message:
Just You

Sun Shines in the Sky
As you do in my life
I feel the warmth of love
Your love that melts all strife

The sound of your call
Pierces deem within
Within my bosom, my heart
Calls out to you; the thirst deepens

Hear me, for I call out to you
You alone must hear my plea
I have no one else to call
No one else will hear me

Bless me with nothing less
Fasten me close to yourself with love's glue
For this time I see nothing else
But just you

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:17:37 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: It must be translated directly from his Hindi....
Message:
...because it doesn't make any sense in English.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:22:05 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: TD
Subject: The guy has an imaginary friend
Message:
in his head.The guy want EVERYBODY to have one too.

The guy drinks to much wiskey.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:23:36 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Jim
Subject: Thanks EVERYBODY, but Sir Dave's is the best
Message:
Sir Dave made the poem extra special and I felt its deep meaning the most.
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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:54:59 (GMT)
From: Maurice
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: Class Action.
Message:

Legal action seems to be the way forward or the death toll will surely rise. Things are tough enough without being led into an emotional vacuum by M. and the unfortunate victims he surrounds himself with. There are also the Xrated ones who are also responsible as they know full well that his dirty deeds are beeing cleaned up by them every day. It amazes me that these people are so gready and willing to risk their own sense of right and wrong to cover up the kind of shit that bastard is laying waste all around himself and they in a court of law, will be seen as colluding with a criminal because of their own emptyheadedness. As much as so many mindless people get led into crime by bullying little Hitlers like him. So lets fuck him with the law, now.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:51:30 (GMT)
From: Fact/SB
Email: None
To: Maurice
Subject: Class Action. SUIT
Message:
Maurice,

Since I began to read and later on write in this forum my personal interest has been/is to stop maharaji and his crew from operating such a dangerous cult as his is and from damaging more people's lives, families and from causing more deaths by driving some sensitive people insane enough for them to take their own lives.

Since I left Maharaji at the end of 99'innumerables times I had a very difficult time coping with what the 25 years of involvement with him left me with causing VERY painful moments. I had tried to take my own life and I have been under psychiatric help for more than a decade. My life and that of my son, an my presently premie ex-husband were practicly destroyed by the cult. How?

I am not going to talk for my ex-husband who is still a premie, but I can add that he almost committed suicide and was hospitalized four times with severe depression.

When a person deeply involved as much as I was, with the service to learn the content of his videos to 'help' the aspirants learn and prepare for Knowledge, I found myself in a position to have to listen over and over his endoctrination. I received monthly 9-12 videos part of the Video Subscription Elan Vital sent to communities throught the world from the headquarters of Visions International, the trinquet center of his cult, for many years. I

I realize now after I learned the way the mental manipulation was done that he must be stopped, and the quicker the better, more today taht I read here that another person has died. From the beginning here I mentioned my intentions that in some point, when my health was better, I wanted to do something to bring justice to light. I have been left by my intense involvement with very few fighting tools because maharaji's voice often, still is louder than my own. He undermined my confidence and trust in my own feelings and personal capacity to act like a whole adult with his brainwashing and I was left to deal with life in its own terms and I resent that.

My life became very difficult after living him, especially because it created a very weird relationship with my teenager son, young, who began to resent a lot of what his premie father and me put him through, his father still does. My son never received K but went many times to see him,M, but also, because of my mentioned service with the video library my son had to hear a lot that I wish he never did. His mind is sick as well, distrusting all that has to do with God, in fact, he has said he hates him/her. (Yeah Jim, laugh. Some of us has to believe in something. I call it today Universe, Way, but is real to me) My son has become as a result of me living the cult a very angry confused young teenager, because even in his youth he understand that in one more of my suicide attempts I may succeed and he will end up alone, i.e., he fears the future and he fears me.

He had to witness a depression episode I had which lasted 12 days, both of us under the same roof and now his trust in me for his well being and security are uncertain. He was affected by the last episode, and he doesn't remember the old ones, when he was a child, but I do, and is very painful to witness as a mother and I want to comfort him, but I can't. My mind can snap again.

I look back and after long years of psychoteraphy and soul searching blame in a huge part to Maharaji's irresponsability for the pain I caused myself and also what I put my family and friends through. I can vomit in the guy: I detest him. Often my still somewhat sick mind invites me to come back to the cult. When is this going to end?

I had trouble making ends meet because of my sickness and there he is, sending his crew around asking for more money because he has come out with some other desire to fulfill: It makes me sick everytime I think about the hard times I went through! Will them ever go away? Twenty five years...of abuse.

I don't know what to tell you. I don't know the best way to do it. I suggested here in the past that we send the Attorney General of California an explanation why a deep investigation needs to be initiated, signed by as many ex-premies as possible, and nobody thought it was a good idea. I was ignored. This can be done possibly through the Internet. All Attorneys Generals have a web site. Maybe Dave, or someone can create some type of page, not to be accessed but by password where a person can sign their names and the results can be sent to complain about Rawat's work to the Ca. Attorney Gral. Is just an idea.

Rawat's wrongdoing: His Mental Manipulation against a person's direct will must stop. His practices are beyond freedom of religion because maharaji's story has changed so much over the years and I have cassettes from the seventies, and 350-400 videos with his own voice bulshitting people, and that can prove clearly how the trick works.

Love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:16:57 (GMT)
From: Tim G
Email: timgitti@indigo.ie
To: Fact/SB
Subject: Class Action. SUIT
Message:
Hi Fact/SB
Thanks for your moving and poignant post. I send you much love and support. You are very well placed to help when the big moment comes, and I think it will be soon.Hold onto those videos.
I really hope that a healing can evolve wiyh your son and ex hubbie. The teenage years will pass and a new clarity may well dawn.
Th important thing is to be real kind to yourself. You are ten times more precious than that poor deluded egomaniac.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:31:23 (GMT)
From: SB/Fact
Email: None
To: Tim G
Subject: This medium
Message:
Thanks for your kind words! It means a lot to me.

You say:

Th important thing is to be real kind to yourself. You are ten times more precious than that poor deluded egomaniac.

That is just what I am doing.

Should I state here irrelevant stuff as naming what my everyday life really is so I don't look like my life is TOTALLY miserable? I try to stay on the subject here, more, because I don't always have, latelly, much time to be here.

I sometimes post to some people here and my hidden parts are shown. Maybe you didn't read those posts. I do have a life, I always had it, even when I was with Lard. I have beautiful friends, a good man in my life, I go camping and enjoy nature, music (1500 songs from Napster :0 ) reading, cooking, art, etc., etc., nevertheless a part of me so very fhuq up by the cultish mentality and I want to help stop Lard VERY bad. People don't need to died confused and sad.I know you know that.

The videos are not going anywhere. Lard's mistake was to think that he has so much power over me that by him asking me to do something I was going to just do it. I am aware that he knows well that what I am saying is true and that must be scary for him, but hey, he brought it to himself. He was hungry for power and his greediness (a word) took him too far. Now is up to him. I am sorry for him. He is pathetic.

The only thing Rawat can do is to get honest with himself and back off from his god trip and we are helping him everyday do so by being here. He is such a little person that the is afraid of his own liberation which will come ONLY when he accepts that he blew it, perhaps long a go, when Bob Mishler told him that what he was doing was wrong. He was young and stupid, read, ignorant. But he is 43 years old now. Now is time for him to spill the beans and to free his premies and we are going to, we are giving him a hand because the coward cannot do it himself.

PEOPLE DO HAVE RIGHTS! he violated them.

Love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:32:49 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: SB/Fact
Subject: Re: This medium
Message:
My two years out of the cult has proved to be the best time of my life. Never have I been stronger, happier and, God willing, saner.

We will overcome.

The Krishnamurti solution is the Lard's ONLY way out, followed by redistribution of his wealth to the victims and other deserving persons.

Give it up Lard, the gigs up.

Oliver.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:30:47 (GMT)
From: Tim G
Email: usual
To: SB/Fact
Subject: Zipping along good-o
Message:
Thanx for your post and it's good to hear of the parts of your life where you are zipping along good-o. Sounds grand. Actually I hate that phrase 'parts of your life'..it reminds me of those awful tedious satsangs where the speaker started with 'one part of me.......'. Talk about the divided self! What a downer.
Art , Music and Nature are food for my soul too BTW.
Love
Tim
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:13:11 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Tim G
Subject: I get you but,
Message:
I am most of the time a either lazy writter, or I cannot find better words, or not much free time, also, do you know that English is my second language?

How can I say it then. Areas on my life instead of parts? LOL

From where I come from there is a saying: 'An understanding person doesn't need too many words' but hey, is my own fault. Why at times I think everybody can understand my lazy writting? Augggghh

sb

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:07:32 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: A Simple Question
Message:
How the hell can m still be getting away with the same old shit with all the exes coming out of the woodwork with attempted and completed suicide stories and with all the fucking lawyers around here?

Steve

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:05:16 (GMT)
From: fact/sb
Email: None
To: Steve Quint
Subject: A Simple Question
Message:
we talk about this before. I don't know what is stopping us either from going for the yugular. I hear the roaring louder now...

The lawyers here cannot sue because the statue of limitation: Left long a go.

It is up to us, the ones that left not long a go to do it. I am preparing myself.

:)

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:10:30 (GMT)
From: Steve Quint
Email: the_avenger55@hotmail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: Wouldn't An Injunction Be Appropriate? nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:05:43 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: Fact/SB
Subject: Class Action. SUIT
Message:
Every one of your words came through loud and clear. I have a 28 year old son, who thinks the Scared Cow is a conman. He also was the product of a broken premie marriage and was unhappy and miserable for quite a while but not much more so than his peers. Your son had your mental problems to deal with too so he needs lots of therapy. Nothing like talking things out with the RIGHT person.

Your ideas for stopping the sacred Cow are worth talking about.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:25:04 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Class Action. SUIT
Message:
I hear you, Psychotherapy. My point is taht I do have a realistic personality and just the though of what is awaiting for me seems to be more heavy hard times.

I think what is left of my life is always going to evolve around the fat rat and I will have to be there to remember how it happens. Just painful. Resentment is not even the word. I haven't found it.

Here I was told to forget about the pain, as if it was a button that I can turn on and off, but I cannot manage my subconscient mind, my son cannot either. The compartments there are not quite that simple, so, if I will always be affected by Rawat, the least I can do, as revenge, or pay, is do what I can to dismantle his kingdom. That will give me a real satisfaction. Call me weird, but, honestly it will.

Love,

sb

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:59:30 (GMT)
From: Scott T.
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: You'll be surprised to learn...
Message:
SB:

I think what is left of my life is always going to evolve around the fat rat and I will have to be there to remember how it happens. Just painful. Resentment is not even the word. I haven't found it.

I don't see how that could happen. I barely think about him, and the topic seems incredibly redundant. I communicate with people here, because I find them thoughtful, sincere, and engaging... but have a terrible time staying on topic. I'd much rather discuss politics, bicycles or rowing. I can't even carry on a conversation with Dettmers. In fact I can barely maintain my interest long enough to skim through his posts, because all he talks about is Maharaji. The cult business wears off, and starts to sound like an IBM service manual. But I suppose it's like being sprayed by a skunk. Takes awhile. All the best.

--Scott

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:41:51 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Scott T.
Subject: He's in hospital now, by the way
Message:
I guess the longer in - the longer it takes to forget. Of course, this forum doesn't help what with all the talk about Haharaji.

Damn it - I'd completely forgotten about all this stuff until I started reading ex-premie posts on the net in 1997.

How do we do this without mentioning boring Maharaji and K?

Maybe use a code or something. But you're right - Margarini does get just very boring after a while. I liked the US President election threads for a while until I lost track of what was happening. Did you know that Saddam Hussain is in hospital with a stroke, by the way?

.. Dave

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:02:31 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Sorry, who is in the hospital? NT
Message:
NT
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:18:09 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: It's at the end of my above post (nt)
Message:
q
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:21:11 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: I see
Message:
I thought you were being funny and lard was the one in the hospital...thanks.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:03:34 (GMT)
From: sb
Email: None
To: Scott T.
Subject: Scott
Message:
We come from different circumstances and I am speaking from mine. I don't expect people to understand my dumb posts when I tried to work out my problems through writting but the fact is that I STILL haven't believe what other tell me directly or indirectly taht all is going to get better.

I appreciate your encouragement. I only know my sick parts and what goes on in my home, you can only imagine them.

Of course I want to recover but some people never do, correct?

I come here to confront my demons, the ones I allowed (?) to exists and I loved taht man too much.

I have been out for only a year and things did get somewhat better. My frustration comes when I see old patterns surfacing again when I thought I had worked it out. But hey, I am a positive person, even if I can come acrossed as very depressed and sad. I do have fun in my life, nevertheless, the ugliness is there too, very ugly.

Can you relate? I don't expect you but appreciate you writting and encouraging me.

Love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:22:15 (GMT)
From: Scott T.
Email: None
To: sb
Subject: Scott
Message:
SB:

I wasn't under the spell for as long as you, that's for sure. And my experience of the cult itself took place in a different era when, perhaps, it was less destructive. I missed the big crackdown in 1978. I actually have had more trouble recovering from broken relationships than recovering from the cult thing, although perhaps that was related. I didn't relate very well to people because I tended to relate to a mental construct of people that derived from the cult experience. It was pretty far off the mark. But, I think the effects do wear off over time, and you gain more healthy obsessions. I have never felt as good under the Maharaji spell as I have after a really good exercise session that launched a flood of endorphines. Someone once ssid that the best revenge is to live a good life. That's true.

Best of luck,

--Scott

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:34:21 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Scott T.
Subject: Thanks :)
Message:
Self love is the main key. I agree.

I am making tamales today. hahahaha...Lots of work but the end results entice me to want to stay in the kitchen for a while. Why eat meat and potatoes. LOL

Love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 09:25:11 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Scott T.
Subject: Re: You'll be surprised to learn...
Message:
But surely the point is that a class action would be just one more strategy to get at the bastard. Publicity alone from an action like this would be enough to save many aspirants from bothering.

It's all very nice to have a place to come and have stimulating communication with people who share a similar past , BUT, Rawat still sucks and must be stopped.

If your not interested in this aspect of EPO I suggest you get on your bike and ride off into the sunset.

~~Oliver

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:59:48 (GMT)
From: Scott T.
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: You missed the point.
Message:
Oliver:

The points I made addressed the issue of SB's concern that she would be plagued by thoughts and remembrances of Maharaji for the rest of her life. I just don't think that's true, based on my own experience. As for a class action suit, what precedents are there for such an action? I can't think of *any* even against such obviously scurrilous individuals as Duh Freejohn, etc. who seems even more exploitive than Maharaji. I wouldn't mind a successful suit, but an action that is just dismissed would be more demoralizing than it's probably worth. And if you are thinking that there's anything to gain for an Attorney General prosecuting such a case, then you should consider their political situation more carefully. These are political animals, and I don't see the advantage of pressing an un-winnable case against an obscure Guru that most of the world forgot about 20 years ago. A prosecution on tax or racketeering charges seems far more likely. But even there, you'll have to make a strong political case that it's worth someone's time.

--Scott

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:07:44 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Scott T.
Subject: Re: You missed the point.
Message:
*But even there, you'll have to make a strong political case that it's worth someone's time.*

I don't have to do anything other than give the Lard and his lads a hard time. That's how I get my rocks off at present in this tiny niche of my life.

Mind you I'd rather back a winner and earn a dollar from that as it is FUN.

Rawat still sucks and I'll ride the fat prick until he drops. I have bad memories and don't ride a bike.

~~Oliver.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:15:09 (GMT)
From: fact
Email: None
To: Scott T.
Subject: We are the government as provided by the
Message:
Constitution and officials work for the people. Pressure on taht fact can bring results. SOmetimes a big pressure is needed, big noice but I have seen taht it work.

I am involved at this time, for few months, in a matter requesting the a branch of our government to do their job protecting people's rights in my community. It has been a hell of work but results have been achieved and more good is still to come.

The way I see it is that a lot of the problems in society exist because people are to fucking lazy to do something about it: Most think that tsomebody else will do it.

At the end, is all about personalities. I like camping and hiking but I enjoy also been a responsible citizen. Is a conscience thing to me. I don't expect you to think like me. You are you.

Love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:35:00 (GMT)
From: Scott
Email: None
To: fact
Subject: We are the government as provided by the
Message:
SB:

It's still a formidable challenge. What's the legal case? Have you discussed anything with a lawyer? I can't seem to get the League of American Bicyclists to put pressure an Attorneys General to prosecute cases of vehicular manslaughter, and that seems a lot higher priority than an anti-Guru class action... and there are statutes already on the books that support those prosecutions. But, I don't know anything about this issue. I'm just asking. What is the statute and precedent? It's important to be practical. And don't give up on the tax and racketeering angles. There are definitely precendents and statutes that govern those actions. He has covered his ass pretty well, but he's not perfect and may have missed something. Besides, he's too arrogant to always take advice... so may not have always acted in his own long term security interest. AGs have lots of incentives to prosecute racketeering, especially if it's under the guise of religion. Just a thought.

--Scott

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:48:51 (GMT)
From: sb
Email: None
To: Scott
Subject: I read here that
Message:
In France a new law was passed not long a go to protect the rights of their citizens against cult mental manipulation. It is now against the law to be a guru and to manipulate people's minds. Rawat falls in that category. Trust me that you missed a good part of Lard's endoctrination. I just left. Ouch...

About AG, my point is, you say that you had a hard time fighting manslaughter I assume of a biker dying, but Scott, people are dying because their minds have gotten sick to high limits, which some people DO GET INTO that state of mind, I did, Selene did, Salam, Oliver, my ex-husband, and so many others I know. Not all got badly affected by the cult, but for the ones that do, changes in laws are needed.

I didn't say that it would be easy, but it can be a new approach to stop him from hurting people and families. Maybe the AG of Ca. hate gurus and we get lucky. hahahaha.Chau. Have a great day.

Love, sb

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 19:30:27 (GMT)
From: Scott T.
Email: None
To: sb
Subject: I read here that
Message:
SB:

The point about the vehicular manslaughter is not that people haven't died as a result of Maha's manipulation, but that if AGs can't be motivated to prosecute people who run over folks with a 2000 lb machine they're going to have a difficult time grasping the subtle significance of cultic mind control. I'm surprised they ever got a handle on the tobacco industry, and that's responsible for far more deaths than Maharaji, or all the 'Maharaji's' combined, for that matter.

Hope the tamales turned out well.

--Scott

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:24:13 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Scott T.
Subject: I have read in Aussie press that.........
Message:
the federal government has discussed the question of cults operating in this country.

If everyone is apathetic regarding this subject, NOTHING WILL COME OF IT.

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 03:23:37 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: I have read in the Canadian press that.........
Message:
WRT Sai Baba, 'Glen Meloy, a retired management consultant in California who was a follower of Sai Baba for 26 years, is now bomarding the politicians, the White House, Indian newspapers and the u.S. Federal Bureau of Investigation with allegations of abuse by the Indian spiritual leader.'

Yes, Oliver, 'If everyone is apathetic regarding this subject, NOTHING WILL COME OF IT.' And I might add that perhaps joining forces with others towards this goal could help all concerned.

Anna

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 05:45:18 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Good riddance to all fakirs NT
Message:
or is that fakers?
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 15:01:50 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Frank /Thelma
Subject: Depends on how you define 'fakers' and ...
Message:
Greetings Frank!

Depends on how you define 'fakers' and what/who they claim to be, and what they do with whatever they 'have'!

Your web site is as great as your indomitable spirit, Frank! You must be helping a lot of people with it, and it's good to know that sites like yours are out there. I noticed your name, and wonder if you might be in, or from, Quebec?

And I do think that uniting into a common front in the quest to expose fake gurus might be the best way to go.

Happy New Year, Frank!

Love,

Anna

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 18:51:45 (GMT)
From: Frank
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Depends on how you define 'fakers' and ...
Message:
Hi Stonor,

Thanks. Like your style too. In fact it was you who made me decide to just go ahead and call myself an ex rather than my pussy-footing variation 'un-premie.'

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 19:23:48 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Frank
Subject: Depends on how you define 'fakers' and ...
Message:
Hi Frank,

How? You've really surprised me with this one!

(Anna)Stonor, the 'non-anything' who took a LOT of shit for that and for 'coming out' officially as a woman even though the family name I use is gender neutral and I never said I was a man - people just assumed.

Bullyitis is a nast,y highly contagious disease.

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 20:28:00 (GMT)
From: Frank
Email: f_lamotte@hotmail.com
To: Stonor
Subject: Unpremie v expremie
Message:
When I first started looking at FV (maybe a year or two ago) I couldn't stand it - seemed so whiny and vindictive. Came back recently and found it more confident and satirical; found a link to Life's afoot. That's easier to follow. Followed your posts there. Came back here, found you here, followed your posts again. Then you answered my virgin post (in which I mentioned Life'a a Foot) by saying LAF had more exes than uns or nons. Checked it again and found you were right.

Had been using un-premie to describe myself and other fringe-stoner-premies (no pun) till now because I still enjoyed meditating and tolerated the Rev Rawat because of my libertarian views. Your little answer made me think and say to myself, 'Nice sensible people calling themslevs exes. I'm not ashamed to keep their company.'

Also you are a gardener and I always trust most other gardeners. I guess it was a compounding of things about you that made me feel in good company and ready to say I was an ex. You and Ham and Gerry were the first people to talk to me here.

And, yes, as a sissy-fag, I also hate bullies especially when they post with the anonyms instead of pseudonyms.

Thank the muses that I was using my my agressive, vain and egotistical alter-ego, Thelma, when I first posted. (BTW Thelma is chagrinned that no one has looked the posting at the end of thread; 'It's hard on the children.') If I had come out as the sissy-fag that I really am the I would have been eaten alive.

Are the boys always so hard on newcomers? There are hundreds if not thousands of 'unpremies' reading this forum who would love to put in their two-cents worth but feel like christians entering the Colisseum. I asked for what I got and could handle it but I fear for all the more delicate souls out there reading this who would need more nurturing and encouragement to wean themselves from the Holy Reverend Rawat's titties.

PS No, I'm not from Quebec. From South Africa, French Huguenots (protestants not RC) went there 350 years ago.

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 01:46:03 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Frank
Subject: Yes, ham and Gerry are great!
Message:
Yeah Frank, gotta agree with you, the exes are great - they're the reason why I've hung around so long! I've had a few premie friends, and their smug covert-aggressiveness know-it-allnes is quite hard to take at times, and sad to see.

I hesitated a long time before I posted about L aF to you, but I wasn't sure why you were mentioning, really. You've got me worried now, wondering which of those posts are still there, and which ones you've read! ;-)

You're into gardening too? I've planted a garden everywhere I've had an opportunity. Found a great place to plant the invasive perennials that were taking over by garden around the school I used to work at, with the help (and a car) of a few students. My garden is organic, and getting bigger every year. I had my first peaches and apricots this summer!

I still don't regret posting as Stonor at the beginning, even if my former premie e-mail friend figured it out before everyone else except Katie - and he was the one I was mostly worried about. But I also found it rather aggressive and sexist. Stonor is my Dad's middle name - as I told you, I think, I don't use it - but I felt a bit like my big Viking Dad was with me and I dare you to call me a sissy! My grandmother was a Doucet - her family came to Quebec in the 1500's - Acadian, not Huguenot. It's great to meet someone of French origin from South Africa, I'd never heard that some had gone there. I have a friend who's spent quite a bit of time down there setting up a masters program for students at Uniqwa. Have you ever heard of it?

There are actually a few gay men posting here regularly, but they don't seem to be around at the moment. You'll enjoy meeting them, I'm sure.

'Duh Boys' do seem to be generally a bit rough on newcomers, but it does vary, and things generally do seem to be changing for the better, as you've noticed. I agree with you that this forum is far more effective with less aggression in helping people to leave m.

It's been good talking with you and getting to know you. I hope you find the time to post occasionally, even after you get back to work - you've got a great sense of humour, and although I haven't read too much of Thelma, and can tell that she does too! And don't be surprised if you get an email from me sometime, I'm just a bit behind on them at the moment. I'd love to hear a bit more about your gardening interests, and I'll send you a few pics of mine - just learning how to do all this stuff. BTW, Katie works in the horicultural department at a university. And Salam, Oliver and Mister Bubblehead are also into gardening and do it in Australia which is quite a bit closer to your climate zone than Quebec!

Big hugs to the stylish guy in the flower-power cummerbund!

Anna

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Date: Sun, Jan 07, 2001 at 03:45:01 (GMT)
From: Frank
Email: f_lamotte@hotmail.com
To: Stonor
Subject: Yes, ham and Gerry are great!
Message:
That was a lovely letter. Thank you. So personal I felt it was email. I'll put my email address here again just in case. Life is indeed sweet.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:45:58 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: Class Action. SUIT
Message:
One of the most irresponsible thing that the mooooo did was encourage people to feel helpless and passive. It is very hard to overcome pessimism without feeling total self-confidence. He lied when he told people to 'just meditate and ignore the mind.' The mind is the product of many things not least of which the cruel cold parts of the world in which we live. But most of my misery came from placing blame and indulging in self-pity. I chose about ten years ago, when I was very sick, to 'think positive thoughts' as my mother had taught me. It's hard work but it slowly works and one day you see that you can choose exactly how you think and feel and this has nothing to do with Knowledge. Knowledge was 'taught' in such as superficial and insouciant way and still is - it's mostly still a matter of brainwashing into believing the 'Master' bullshit. But I won't go into that. Knowledge has got fuck-all to do with mental health. And, since I've always been a do-it-yourself-if-you-want-it-done-properly kind opf person, I did it myself - I practice mental health, good thoughts etc. It takes a lot of practice but it's cheaper than a shrink.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:19:52 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: Thelma,Maurice,Fact
Subject: Hey, you SUITS. Mum's the word rt now... (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 09:03:54 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: such
Subject: Mum's the word rt now...
Message:
I'm glad to hear that. I just hope all the eggs aren't being put in one basket. How about tackling both the cult-dirt AND the disgruntled donors to EV angle.

A few thoughts and then I'm going to just watch for a while.

Those of you who dropped out of premiedom a while back, definitely dropped out of a cult. But those of us who have only recently dropped out, dropped out of a church.

The difference in the eyes of the law in a capitalist society is that a cult does not have enough money to pay lawyers to protect them. Churches do.

All churches are mind-bending cults but they aren't called cults because they have been around for a while and have money for lawyers.

Yes, the Rev Rawat's scam has been sanitized sufficiently by the church-ladies to appear to most people as a fairly harmless operation, no longer a cult but a church.

Just a speculation but I also think that trying to demonize the Rev Rawat is not an option unless he does something incontrovertibly criminal in the west. A surer bet would be that disgruntled donors demand to see Elan Vitals books. All of us who ever gave money to EV can co-operate to do that.

The reason that he cannot be demonized is becasue he is not a demon. He is merely stupid, lazy and selfish. He reminds me of the unfortunate Winnie Mandela. They both came from unsophisticated backgrounds in the Third World.

Everyone told them how wonderful and smart they were and gave them a lot of money and both of them were too dumb to handle power and responsibility. Winnie and her football club of paid thugs were tried and convicted of killing a little boy but none of them went to prison.

Mrs Winnie still holds a position of power in the new South African government. Everyone knows she wasn't evil even when she told the school kids to set fire to their enemies with gasoline. She was just stupid and irresponsible.

Most of the nasty things that have happened around the Rev Rawat have been caused by his bottomless stupidity, infantile solispsism and insouciance. The man is as shrewdy as trailer trash and just as dumb.

I know I can kick myself that I fell for his primitive and superstitous claptrap and mumbo-jumbo. Why didn't I trust my intellectual snobbery that was telling me right from the day I heard of him that he was beneath my dignity? Because I was miserable and wanted peace of mind.

Remember that's what he promised: 'Give me your love and I will give you peace.' When he was a teenager it was not so difficult to try to like him and I tried and tried and tried and at times succeeded enough to fool myself that I loved him.

He was a cute and mischievous and playful teenager and he has never grown up. He has had sycophants sucking up to him for 30 years. The man is stunted in his growth, trapped in the mind of a teenager. He still milks the cute factor for all its worth eventhough he has grown jowly and scowly with arrogance and greed while the church-ladies (of both genders) quiver in tune to his wobbling jowls and swoon.

No, demonizing him won't work. That makes him bigger than we are. Let's bring him down to size, our size, and demand that he be held to the standards of democratic decency and accountability. Those of you who want to bring him down lower than ourselves - beware. It is best just to bring the mighty down to our own level lest we have to stoop too low to place him on a lower level than us.

Let's just sue the greedy jumped up spoilt brat and teach him that he is not special, just ordinary, and has to abide by ordinary decent democratic standards of fair play and honesty.

It just needs money I guess and that is where we will have diffficulties because all of us feel burnt by giving so much to such an ungrateful worm and don't want to be suckered into any money-grubbing scams again. I hope there are some rich and bored lawyers here who want to volunteer.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:09:04 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Demonized is not the right word, but
Message:
You say:
The reason that he cannot be demonized is becasue he is not a demon. He is merely stupid, lazy and selfish. He reminds me of the unfortunate Winnie Mandela. They both came from unsophisticated backgrounds in the Third World.

He is not a demon but he is above all responsible for his own actions and words and since he has had plenty of advice and disregarded the facts, in my book, he is a bad person. He choses badness for people by being irresponsible. People are dying. I almost did.

Because? I kept shooting, aiming for his advice: K must be the most important thing in your life. Service to the master, etc., etc. I almost killed myself because I couldn't be what 'GOD' was telling me I should be. He is bad!

Love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:48:17 (GMT)
From: Joy
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Great Post, Thelma
Message:
You're a very entertaining writer!

I particularly liked the paragraph:

'He was a cute and mischievous and playful teenager and he has never grown up. He has had sycophants sucking up to him for 30 years. The man is stunted in his growth, trapped in the mind of a teenager. He still milks the cute factor for all its worth eventhough he has grown jowly and scowly with arrogance and greed while the church-ladies (of both genders) quiver in tune to his wobbling jowls and swoon.'

Perhaps you could give M some poetry lessons?

Good luck to all of you in whatever Merry Prankster-ish escapades you're all up to, with regards lawsuits or whatever. I've always wanted to sue M in some capacity. Count me in on any class action stuff, though I didn't exactly give away an inheritance, just my family's gold jewelry, after much harassment and hounding by the official DLM representative. But ten years of my life and mind are another story . . . How can anybody ever put a monetary value on that?

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:43:00 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: Joy
Subject: shell game
Message:
Thanks. What I want to know is: How the hell did poor little mealie-mouthed Jim Bakker end up in prison for the penny-ante scam that he was running when the Rev Rawat is running an elaborate shell-game?

Perhaps all former donors to EV need to co-operate to write to the relevant bureaucrat at the IRS with a complaint that we have been donating money to an organization that we thought was working to bring peace into this world but since have found that our money was being used to bring pieces (blonde) into the Rev Rawat's bed etc.

I call him the Rev Rawat because I see him as just another piece of trailer trash with a relgious con-game a la Bakker and the other second generation hogfuckers who make money spouting bullshit.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:10:50 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Joy
Subject: It HAS NO PRICE (nt)
Message:
no
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 12:27:01 (GMT)
From: Tim G
Email: usual
To: Thelma
Subject: Thanks Thelma
Message:
Thelma...that's spot on. He is a small time victim with a big plate full of opportunity. Thanks.
Tim
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:12:24 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Tim G
Subject: Nevertheless, responsible for his actions.
Message:
He is all grown up now. Don't forget.

:)

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:24:16 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: such
Subject: Say what? LOL What was that?
Message:
English is not my first language: I miss on the slangish speech.

Can you clarify please?

Thanks.

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 08:47:30 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: don't you know our 'attorney Bernie'?
Message:
Fact,

Dude, thanks -- there are already people networking on various things. This forum is clearly NOT the appropriate place to openly discuss legal strategy. SShhh.

Don't worry -- when the facts and evidence are finally weighed, the scales will vindicate and heal the abused, innocent hearts of thousands of (ex)premies.

Peace,

PS To Everyone: If you have any evidence or testimony to present, please email the forum administrator.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:39:39 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: such
Subject: To Fact/SB
Message:
If you were asking about LOL, it means 'laughing out loud' or 'lots of laughs' I think.

Which is your first language?

Love Disculta

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:36:08 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: To Fact/SB
Message:
I am from downnnn south.

I know LOL, you silly. :)

ROFL.

More love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:24:37 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: What books
Message:
may I have not read?...

What I think taht makes the difference how people gets affected is the intensity of the involvement as well as the personality of the person, and in my case, as much as I am strong he did a fine number on me. I watch too many videos? Yack.

Glad to see you strong. I am at times too but the fatso gets always in the middle of my best circumstances, intrusive, aughhhh...lol Thanks for the indirect advice. I am working on just remebering what he taught me. Don't listen to the (sick part of my )mind. Life is too short. Cliche here and there, I am still here, fighting the demons. I won. I am out. Struggling at times, but out.

I met this incredible guy whom I will marry in some point, soon. We want our wedding to be different and that needs work, right? He is a total incredible fun, adorable,loving person and the guy has to take my BS???? Thanks god that he is such a man because other would have run away long a go. It pisses me off. As you said:

One of the most irresponsible thing that the mooooo did was encourage people to feel helpless and passive. It is very hard to overcome pessimism without feeling total self-confidence.

That is where it hurts. To know that you have no reason to feel the way you do and see it surface here and there, messing all up, is too much. Again, I am a very sensitive person, bordeline insecure? Rawat's complimet, the bastardo....hahahaha.

Good night. My TV is waiting for me.

sb

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:34:09 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: Friends and allies
Message:
I'm glad you found a good friend and ally. I could not have done it without my partner of 19 years. It was he who encourage me to do affirmations when I was sick. My mind rebelled against anything so New Age spiritual and quasi-religious. But doing some silly 'positive thinking' exercises helped me to eventually find my own words and thoughts to do my own positive affirmations and become well again. Now it's mostly like housekeeping - tedious but worth the results. Sweep out the cobwebs, darling, put new sheets on your bed and lie down and enjoy being clean and comfortable.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 05:30:38 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Of course
Message:
I enjoy that too! Downy or what other one? LOL

You are trully lucky to have a 19 years relationship. Bloob made my ex and me forget about those important things that keep people together and we threw it all away. Loving and serving Lard was more important. What a joke.

Affirmations are good and work! New info over the old one, eventually the new one wins. I should do them more often.

Take care Thelma!

:) SB

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:51:51 (GMT)
From: blood
Email: None
To: everyone
Subject: trapped in mahaland
Message:
I haven't bothered to go look at his sight for quite a while, who even cares, but I did follow your link into it. Only to find there is no real content there. Just like the supposed knowledge he offers. Just so many pixels spread across the ocean of life. Trouble is once you are in to his site...it is difficult to get out. Back buttons don't work. Just like in life... once you have swallowed the hook it is a little difficult to spit it back out.

I think that is the main thrust of this site. Everyone trying to spit the hook back out after it was swallowed. Only trouble is all of the barbs on the hook.

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:02:20 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: thunderstealing@hotmail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: has this been tried?
Message:
Being new to all this I don't know what you guys have tried using to expose mooooraji in the past. I imagine a few have written to the tax collectors and complained that money that you have donated to EV is being used NOT for the charitable purposes of bringing peace to the world but to provide the Holy Cow with more gewgaws. But has a co-ordinated petition been signed by a large number of people to send to the tax man. All of us who have ever donated any money to EV are in their data-base and that can be verified by the tax man. A charity will be investigated if enough complaints by bona fide donors is registered. I know it's more boring than creative sabotage and digging for dirt but, if it hasn't been tried yet, it's worth a shot.
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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:57:42 (GMT)
From: Maurice
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Good Thinking,Thelma.
Message:
nt.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 01:34:27 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: Maurice
Subject: Good idea Maurice
Message:
See Maurice: Class Action Suit above.

But, in our new Bushbaby Banana Republic, Mooraji will be seen as a libertarian at best and a libertine at worst but not as a criminal. To dig that kind of dirt you need a dirty mind or a strong stomach or both and I have neither. I'd rather try the tax angle or something involving a 'civil' suit. Let's keep it civilized and cooool.

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 20:54:01 (GMT)
From: eBay Alert
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Aliens From Spaceship Earth
Message:
I stumbled upon this today on Ebay:

Maharaji on Ebay

It is a video: the description reads as follows:

Are there other worlds more highly evolved then ours. Are there beings from an othere civilizations that have inhabited this planet for hundreds of millions of years. Starring: Baba Muktananda, Swami Satchidanans, A.C. Bhakivedanta, Guru Maharaji, Yogi Bhajan, Sri Sathya Sal Baba, Maharishi Yogi, Father Vod, Elizabeth Clare Prophet and Baba Ram Dass. Music by DONOVAN and THE SEEKERS. running time 97 min, PG, Previously viewed. Movie in good condition. Clamshell cover is worn. Buyer to pay S/H of $3.80 Priority mail ONLY. Check or M.O. (checks need to clear before shipment), BIDPAY or PAYPAL. Save on shipping by bidding on my other auctions. Each additional order only $1 each on shipping. International shipping extra. Insurance extra. Thanks for Looking!
Is this our famous boy wonder and did he ever give satsang regarding extraterrestrial beings. Could be damaging to ones credibility now couldn’t it?

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 21:01:44 (GMT)
From: bazza
Email: None
To: eBay Alert
Subject: Could be a bootleg
Message:
This was on ebay a while ago, in fact I bid on it myself. Then someone emailed me to warn me that this seller has a history of selling home-dub bootlegs. Besides which the bidding went over $22 and I was outbid.

The good news is, its available on amazon.com - my copy is on its way already.

Here's a link:

Aliens from Spaceship Earth

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 22:28:15 (GMT)
From: bazza
Email: None
To: bazza
Subject: Wrong link, duh
Message:
I know, I know, that took you to the Lord of the Universe video. Hey buy that too, its hilarious!

This should be the right link to:

Aliens from Spaceship Earth

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 15:42:50 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
Please everyone read the thread below started by Thelma, called 'Two Anecdotes'. Thelma, whomever he or she might be, claims that yesterday an aspirant committed suicide in his/her community becuase he thought m. was a conman, but Thelma won't say where.

Anyway read the thread for yourselves. I'd like to know if you think I overreacted by pressing for information, being new here thats entirely possible I did. If so I'm sorry, but it struck a very emotional chord with me.

Thanks

Barry

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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 02:33:23 (GMT)
From: Frank /Thelma
Email: None
To: all
Subject: see new thread
Message:
For clarification of this incident see the new thread above 'Just had my name changed legally.'
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:53:00 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
Hi Bazza,

I finally caught up on all of the active threads and the one which Thelma started was definitely bizzare. I experienced the loss through suicide of a young ashram sister with whom I lived in Hartford, CT.

She jumped off a bridge in New York.

Bazza, I don't think you overreacted by asking Thelma for information. Had I been on the forum when that thread was posted, I would have been pressing on with you. Without specificity about such a dreadful allegation, the announcement of an aspirant suicide will draw great attention here at the forum, not only because we exes are interested in the damage which Maharaji does/has done to those he brainwashes, but also because of our own experiences.

I've stated before that I am not an expert in psychology. I don't know what will drive someone to that ultimate end. It's always tragic, especially for those left behind.

Yet, I don't understand Thelma's anger at you (I know you've made up) when she so flippantly added the piece about the suicide after a few lengthy paragraphs regarding something else.

I don't think investigating this would do any more harm to the mother of this person than already has been done. Her child is now gone and no amount of time will heal that, albeit, her wounds are raw now.

Bazza, I've been around here for a while, an ex for a couple of years now. You have contributed very much here and I agree with both you and Jim about reporting this to the police. Btw, I believe that whether or not this aspirant was ''mentally unstable'' prior to exposure to Maharaji is irrelevant. There is obviously something fishy going on for Thelma to post about it then try to withdraw the information and get angry for those wanting to take action. Particularly after she/he?? has been posting about law suits, etc.

I do, however, understand some of her missdirected anger toward you. You were the dumpee this time, friend. Believe me, I've been there.

Yet, suicide is very serious. If a brainwashed premie tried to counsel this aspirant, knew that person was having suicidal ideations and did nothing to help other than to give satsang (which they're not supposed to do anyway), then I believe an official investigation is in order.

If I had a child who committed suicide, I would want to know why; the ''why'' of suicide is most often the most painful part for the survivors/victims of suicide. And if Maharaji's cult had anything in the slightest to do with it, I would want to know, and at least have the option to pursue action, whatever that may be.

I saw nothing in your posts to Thelma which deserved so much negative reaction to you.

To Thelma I will add this: your account of an aspirant suicide had better be true (regardless if you give details or not) or your ass will be grass on this forum).

To all others: please try to stick to one alias or name. It's really hard to keep track of everybody, especially when it's not possible to read and post on the forum every day.

Some consideration is requested here, please.

Best to all,
Love,
Cynthia

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 20:12:05 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
Yes, I know my post was as you say 'definitely bizzare.' My only excuse, as I have said, was that I was drunk. Sorry. As for my cornered cat reaction - there were also quite a few very intimidating emails that you did not see that brought about that over-reaction.
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Date: Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 17:41:57 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Frank/Thelma; No sweat:)))
Message:
nt
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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 21:33:15 (GMT)
From: Big John
Email: j.watson@wanadoo.dk
To: Bazza
Subject: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
I'm sure we all remember what happend with the girl who commited suicide in England after m's marriage. Thia was smotthed over by everybody as a problem with her mind.No spokesperson from the mission was available for comment to the British press. I wonder if the same thig will happen again here?
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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 22:43:01 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: bshaw8@bellsouth.net
To: Big John
Subject: Hey Big John/OT
Message:
Didn't we room together for a while in Manchester, back in 77/78 some time? It was a flat somewhere in Didsbury if I remember rightly. Wonder if you are the same John? Email me if you are. (What the heck you doing in Denmark?)

Barry Shaw
aka bazza

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 20:21:06 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
First, at Jim's suggestion, I do need to apologize to you for my ad hominems. My only excuse is that I began to get that creepy feeling that I was back at school or the Palace of Peace and the bullies were trying to squash the little queer. What really got me was when you used that typical bully tactic of calling over your shoulder to Jim for help to squash the little fag? Reminds me of one of my dogs. She hates the cat but is a total coward and will only join in any group attacks made by the other dogs.

I didn't jump out of one co-ercive cult last week to join another one this week. Always been a loner and always stirred up the shit because I'm famous for leaping before I look. You can't learn if you don't make mistakes and I make plenty as you saw. Instead of just dealing with this on my own turf I decided to show off and post it. Bad mistake. That does not mean I will just blow it off. I will see that the truth is told but I will do it in my own little community and in my own way. It is a very delicate situation and it's better done without any snarling Rottweillers for back up.

To summarize:

1) I apologize to Bazza for calling him names.

2) I admit that I posted the story in a fit of stupidity and the desire to show-off.

3) I need to deal with this quietly and locally as it is too complex to make neat sound-bytes in the press and is not clearcut enough to provide fodder for a Mooraji expose.

4) I won't post anything more about it now but will keep those of you who have contacted me by email apprised of the situation.

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:30:05 (GMT)
From: sb
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
Here is a link from a poem at Lard's site, from the Poetry section. Notice how M put a line there saying: 'I have nobody no one else to call.'

I Have No One Else To Call

Don't forget Thelma that we as ex-premies can help. What you know needs to be known here, for people to learn what they get into when they hear mahalard proposition=possible death.

SB, who almost didn't survive the big exit.

Thanks.

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:38:39 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: sb
Subject: We all want to skewer the Holy Cow
Message:
but this particular incident is not a big enough shish to stick up the Holy Kabob.
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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 20:58:05 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Hey its cool Thelma
Message:
I didn't really take any of your little jabs personally, how could I, I don't know you - least not by the name Thelma. besides I'm too old and friggin ornery to have my feelings hurt by name-calling.

Anyway I was a bit too keen perhaps, so I'll say sorry too that you got so upset, and let the truth come out as and when.

Hopefully you can see my side of it, that its quite a significant story to throw in after only appearing here 4 days ago. I only exited the cult myself about 2 months ago, so a lot of my emotions are still in upheaval too, but I made the resolve to come completely out in the open about it. That was the main reason I was asking for Jim's opinion, because he's been around these parts since the gitgo. The rest was all in your own head.

I do know what you are saying about having to live and maybe work among premies - the same does apply to me too, I just made the choice to be true to myself and take what came of it.

FYI I was never around in Palace of Peace/WPC days, only got K in 1977 and I am definately not homophobic. I was involved in Productions, not security, my only involvement with security started in Brussels 1989 when I helped install the first CCTV surveillance cameras in the roof overlooking the main event, Divine Sales and the food areas, and from time to time since then.

Having said all this, you must appreciate that no-one is any the wiser as to how true this all is, maybe you could give some verifying info to someone you feel comfortable with via email, and let them just post saying 'yes it really happened'. Just a suggestion, but would go a long way toward proving you were right and I was wrong, which I said Id have no problem acceeding to apologising about.

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 21:16:31 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: You're a gentleman
Message:
I hope you really do forgive me because I did over-react like a cornered poofter - nails and all. And thank you for taking the time to write such a long and detailed posting to me, a total stranger.

This is happening a bit fast for me. I resigned from the local premie 'service' team two weeks ago just fed up with the church-ladies. A week later I decided I really couldn't stomach the Holy Cow, Mooraji, a moment longer. Never liked him but was superstitious (for lack of a better word.)

I am still dealing with the firestorm I have created in our close-knit community by renouncing the Lard and having to deal with being feared and loathed instead of being respected and loved.

I am still feeling so exhilirated by finding how many people there are on this forum that I would actually enjoy being friends with instead of simply tolerating, pitying and humoring as I have had to do with the church-ladies.

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 22:07:35 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Thelma, be gentle with yourself
Message:
Hi Thelma and welcome to the forum,
I am new here also, and still in the early stages of extricating myself from the cult(for want of a better word) I too am really excited to find this forum of free speech and thought and expression, and I too have got over-excited and imbibed too much wine at dinner and posted rashly and regretted it. You have really had a baptism of fire, and have taken a lot of flak, I hope it doesn't put you off.
It can be quite frightening, some of these guys are uncompromisingly confrontational,and I am only just beginning to appreciate this approach. I too have got my tough side, enough, hopefully to keep me afloat here, but I hope I can let my gentler nature have its expression too. One thing I am sure of, is that all viewpoints are welcome here, I think that is the essence of this forum,

Love kelly

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 22:42:39 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: thunderstealing@hotmail.com
To: Kelly
Subject: be gentle with yourself
Message:
Thanks Kelly. Eventhough I felt bullied I had asked for it. The confrontationalness is actually most enjoyable. There are some hot-tempered people here and many really loving, kind and caring people too. Probably the most exciting thing is that at least these guys here have REAL emotions and opinions not the pitiful politically correct pap that we have had to put up with from the church-ladies. I will keep your sweet thoughts in mind.
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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:10:20 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: gkl1@techline.com
To: Thelma
Subject: be gentle with yourself
Message:
Thelma, you are a riot--'Holy Cow,church ladies...' I'm still laughing. Glad you're here. I really like when new people show up. Especially smart and witty ones.

There are some hot-tempered people here and many really loving, kind and caring people too.

I hope you understand that the two qualities are not mutually exclusive (of course you do.)

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 23:18:31 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: is that you, my little libertarian pumpkin?
Message:
I blame my libertarian views for putting up with the Holy Cow's excesses for so long - figured one man's meat is another man's plane, limo, yacht, blonde etc.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:06:32 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Thelma
Subject: Strong feelings don't happen in a void...
Message:
Like you said, Thelma, some exes can be confrontational for very good reason. But don't worry: they were spun a load of bullshit either long ago or more recently, and in most cases I think the anger comes from a genuine caring about the truth. And they're caring people, too.

I have now met six exes in real life (and spoken on the phone to a few more) from different countries - mostly well-known voices on this forum - and they are all definitely the nicest, most honest people I have ever met. So different nowadays from the church ladies they probably used to be ;)

Take it easy, Thelma, and do stick around. It's healthy. Unpicking the yarn can be big fun. Have you read the 'Journeys' section yet?

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 02:57:12 (GMT)
From: Thelma
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: Strong feelings don't happen in a void...
Message:
Yes, I have read the journeys section and intend to post mine one day. And I must tell you that I know that this is a very interesting and exciting forum with people who care more about the kinds of things I care about than any of the church-ladies I have ever known. I am very happy to have the opportunity to get to know you. Meeting people who have been through the premie mill and survived as emotional and opinionated individuals instead of being cloned into Stepford Wives is eye-opening.

Thank the muses (or whatever - I'm an atheist so don't use the god word) for emotions running high but, eventhough I've never liked the Sacred Cow in all the 28 years I have known him, neither do I want to plot and scheme against the man. It makes me feel all hot and bothered and at my age, 54, what with high blood pressure and the glue coming loose on my colostomy bag. That's too fatiguing. I've mellowed into a fat, grey, balding old buddha and I'm probably having the best time of my life and enjoy being comfortable.

I've meditated all that time and still find it interesting enough to continue - always been a gambler - and in fact am now enjoying it much more thanks to you guys on the forum and your refreshing anarchy. I've rid myself of the final CONCEPT - pretending to worship the Sacred Cow out of superstition.

In fact I would highly recommend to any premies out there who may still be interested in 'making progress in Knowledge' (I just call it 'getting high') to come here and enjoy our democratic anarchy and free yourself from your retro-feudal fantasy of Master and servant. Come and joing us and be free again even if you don't agree with everything that's been said here.

As I've said before: In that land of socalled enlightment, India, they worship sacred cows and gurus. In the west we eat cows and require gurus to behave in a decent democratic way.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 03:42:16 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Thelma
Subject: Yes Belgarath!!
Message:
You remind me of the wolf in David Eddings story, something about him, the synical wolf always laughing at humans. You should dig him up.
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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 16:56:12 (GMT)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Bazza
Subject: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
Sure you're overreacting, buddy! We get aspirant suicides a dime a dozen here - no biggy!

Actually, I think it's definitely worth probing. I wouldn't jump to any conclusions about someone committing suicide - he was possibly very unbalanced already. However, what stinks a bit to me is that he was apparently heavily programmed by two premies trying to make him toe the line, but apparently unaware of his problems - or typically, premotically insensitive to them. If it could be proven that he was coerced or pressured a lot prior to offing himself, then I think we would have another very sad scandal.

Getting jaded would not be a virtue, Bazza-Ji!

Love Disculta

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 17:50:38 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Disculta
Subject: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
Bazza,

I do not think you are wroung in asking. I found the story a bit outragous and Thelmas' attitude strange. It sound like that other monkey bjorne or bimbo.

The boy may have been unstable and suicidal, but that does not deny the fact that he got in contact with people that haven't got a clue as to how close he was to jumping of that building.

I do not agree with sir Dave at all. I think he is only talking of the top of his without knowledge of what a sucidal person goes through. To say it is a statistic is like saying war is invetable, that is wrong.

The kid went to that slug of the universe thinking that he can find a way out of his problems, a major mistake, when he discovered that m was a nothing, it was the last straw, there was no reason to live. What really hurt me is that Thelma never got to send him the letter, what a pitty.

If anything, I belive the mother is the one that should act and bring a law suit against the premies that dealt with her son. It is a clear cut case.

The boy could be alive if instead he received medical and counciling help by professionals rather than a bunch of rifraf brainwashed cult members.

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 20:53:28 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: sucha sad story,yes.[see my response 2u below] (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:07:41 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: such
Subject: Read it.
Message:
What really amazes me about these suicide cases (and in refrence to Jims' post below), is the relevance of what Marianne said re the pac suicide. Can not remember what the figure was in the incident that took place in Central America, but it looks to me when all the numbers of premie/aspirant suicide are added, they are becoming pretty close to it. If one looks at the whole picture, adding other cases from different movements the number are frightiningly high compared to that of the general population.

And what is being done about it. Fucking zilch. Millions are spent in Australia for example to minimise the toll death during the holliday season, so as to prevent the death of 50 to 70 motorists, I like to know what is being spent to prevent cuilt suicide, anyone knows. I have a guess. Another zilch. The only people that are doing anything about it, is in places like this site and others, started by individuals, but then correct me if am wrong,

Now ya hear me you dozen of people reading this site all the time, take the blind off your eyes and unplug your ears you morons, time is up. Rawat sucks

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 19:15:46 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Understand your view, don't completely agree
Message:
If my daughter went through the same situation, I would want a few weeks at least, to absorb, reflect,
think about the good memories, and THEN start doing something when I'd completely accepted her death
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:00:55 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: OT
Message:
I didn't know until a month a go taht it was possible to buy underground music. I have been missing so much good music. Why didn't you tell me??? LOL

Hi!!

sb

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:25:37 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: ham@hamzen.freeserve.co.uk
To: SB
Subject: Apologies sb, been a bit distracted of late
Message:
I have got you high on my list for posting, promise, fancy e-mailing again.

The amount of 'underground' house stuff is massive, and has been for 10 years plus, the quality level is really high, quite hair raisingly shivery, in my experience.

Fancy e-mailing, since I think I've bored everyone sick here with that one, hardly a popular topic pointing out how doris dayish most peoples taste are here!
When you e-mail, could you tell us your favourite tracks and music of all time, whatever the type. It makes it a lot easier what to choose, HUGE database here of stuff, slow to fast (max 185bpm), gorgeous and sweet to phat and dirty, instrumental, vocal, black or white based, you get the drift

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:01:02 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: Yes!
Message:
I will. We can have a ball!!

I will when that interest of mine is allowed to surface more. I am busy like hell doing other very important things as fighting for my rights which were violated, intensely. No. No Rat, Other stuff. I'll tell you when I write, e-mail.

I sometimes take more than what I can handle. :0

My new boyfriend is totally into music, he is musician and a graphic artist, between many other things, and has introduced me to music that simply blew my mind away, read, I totally love it.
I didn't know that there was a black market of music until I went to his home and he started to pull his music out. I feel I am in heaven because music is my favorite hobby, #1! But again, I right now don't have too much time to spend on that, but I will.

We can later on exchange artists names and I am sure he has stuff that you may not know and we can recommend to you. I have talked to him about you already. Coming to the U.S.?

Love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:45:49 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: salam_au@iprimus.com.au
To: ham
Subject: Is this something we should know about?
Message:
What's going on here. Some mafia job? I want to know.
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 15:51:09 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Only in the Russian house scene
Message:
and of course the chemikals business, otherwise completely kosher, will e-mail
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:35:46 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: SB/Salam/House sites on the net
Message:
http://interface.pirate-radio.co.uk/
For real underground stuff

http://www.bigchill.net/
For those into chilling & rollin a fat one

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/inside_r1/schedules.shtml
The Dreem Teem Presents - especially for the ladeez, hip movingly sexy

Gilles Peterson - jazz, hard bop, jazz funk, brazilian, mellow house

Fabio & Grooverider- fast & in your face, drum & bass

Essential Mix - different types of house

Annie Nightingale - chill out house, VERY mellow, slow
09:00

RnB Chart - as it says, new school r&b

Judge Jules - commercial house

Danny Rampling 16:00 - good vibes house

Pete Tong's Essential Selection 21:00 - mish mash of all house types

Westwood - hip-hop

Dance Anthems - Dave Pearce
 
Trevor Nelson - soul/r&b

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 18:14:23 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: Thanks!! Hey Salam,
Message:
it's about music. Ham and me like music.

:)

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:10:01 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: ham
Subject: glad u do
Message:
Otherwise u'll be in a cult.
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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 18:02:14 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Re: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
>The boy could be alive if instead he received medical and >counciling help by professionals rather than a bunch of rifraf >brainwashed cult members.

Been there, done that, BUT, thanks too the real Lord, I am still here to tell the tale.

BTW Salam, I found your e-m address. It was under my table. ;)))

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Date: Thurs, Jan 04, 2001 at 21:57:05 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: Re: Has anyone heard about this suicide yesterday?
Message:
One time as a premie, living few block from lard's residence at Alton Rd., I got very sick mentally: I didn't sleep for a very long time, not even a minute, for over a month. Premies and maharaji's doctor, Ed recommended that I meditate, thing that I couldn't do, because at that time my sickness has developed in a strong desire to kill myself and I couldn't concentrate at all. I was never taken to a doctor/shrink and I was advised NOT to see one.

If it wasn't because one day I called my mother, in a moment of lucidity, and explaing what my thoughts were at the time, and because the very next day somebody came and gave me a plane ticket to fly to this Psychiatrist home where I stay for three months to recover I was going to be another number.

I have no doubts that what prompted me to get sick initially was the fact that maharaji in those days would THREATEN US WITH THE VEGETABLE SATSNAG, and I wanted out, but I was scared to death of the outcome of me leaving The Perfect Master.

I wanted to leave the cult because I was not a 'good premie'. I wanted more for my life than what a premie was in those days be ready to be: A devotee, and it hasn't change today, yet. His need to be adored is hidden all over his messages. I had hard times loving the pig and overlooking the realities that I got to know about his personal life, and that of the ones close to him also, i.e., lack of humanitarian love toward me. i wrote to Lard and he never answered me.

Maharaji has never denied the validity of his past statements and many want out and are afraid.

His is a very dangerous cult, since the amount of brainwashing is simply too much' Weekly satellite events, videos, cassettes, music...it takes over the lives of many sensitive souls like my self, and death seems the only way out to stop the pain sometimes, because at one point one can be stripped of his/her individuality and deffense mechanisms.

I hear you salam. This is your friend, S.

Lard, you are a ignorant piece of shhhhit.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 00:32:52 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: Great post, Fact, (and a small request)
Message:
Fact,

Welcome aboard and yes, just as happened with you, many premies' mental breakdowns and even suicides are attributable to Maharaji, exactly as you described. Sure, maybe you or others had some sort of latent sensitivity or something but so what? Maharaji should know that his high-pressure program of surrendering one's life -- while one's living it -- to the living Lord of the The Universe is heavy shit for all and too much for some. Kind of like giving acid to people back in the old dose-'em-at-the-water-cooler days. Maybe many could handle the trip and some might even really enjoy it. But the 'doser' is indisputably responsible for all the reactions, even the unpleasant or tragic ones.

There were five suicides, if not more, in the small Vancouver / Victoria premie community back in '74 and '75. Per capita it was through the roof. I mean, we're really only talking about a population of a couple of hundred people. And these weren't just coincidences. Far from it. Maharaji and the pressure of the cult were prime causative factors in every instance. As I've mentioned many times before, one poor guy, Dave Wener, lived with me in the ashram and even came to see me for some sort of counsel the day before he hung himself. All I could tell him was to ignore his mind and meditate. You know, break on through the sound barrier, call the mind's bluff, blah, blah, blah .....

Maharaji has blood on his hands. And while that might be figurative it's not hyperbolic.

Oh yeah, the request. If you're going to post under a pseudonym, can't you pick one that won't needlessly confuse? You know, some people have used names here that seem designed to confuse just like in that old Abbott and Costello routine, 'Who's on first?' (i.e. 'Who' is the name of one of the players. As is 'I don't know who', etc. It's cute but confusing.)

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:08:11 (GMT)
From: SB/Fact
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Great post, Fact, (and a small request)
Message:
There was a time while i was more involved here when I was deeply upset by the name/nicks changes, but hey, today? I am just glad to be alive and taht I even can think somewhat again. You know, the anxiety doesn't shake me anymore, I can brush my teeth everyday, I can have healthy sex, etc. That is improvement. LOL.

From now on when I want you to exchange few words with me I'll create another new nick, because otherwise you always ignore me. Just kidding. I know that it upsets you. My journal is in its way and I plan from then on to post with my real name. Beside, I didn't think that it was a big deal. While you were gone one FA posted that the rules of posting with more than one name was not seeing as bad anymore as before.

Now to your ego, not that I think you need it... To ME, you are such an important voice here that I want to say seriously: I AM GLAD YOU ARE BACK!!

Sometimes I truly think that is not important that SB or other mes (ME, PLURAL: lol) (:) write the stuff, BUT THAT I CAN POST WITHOUT FEARS. I dare fatso to come and denied that what I say is true.

I know that some don't like you: I am one of your groopies. LOL You have my kind of humor. I hope to meet you some time. I was really sick and busy when you came to Toronto. Next time?

Love,

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:13:02 (GMT)
From: Forum Administrator
Email: None
To: SB/Fact
Subject: Multi-alias posting.
Message:
Yes, a while back I said I'd try easing the rules about multi-alias posting. Second names can be pain to monitor, so the rule was becoming unworkable. In general it still helps if people can keep to one alias - it makes the nuisance posts easier to spot - but if applied too strictly, the forum would lose Mr Farkel, Ms P. Premie, Mr/Mrs E. Vital, Larkin etc.

I still reserve the right to reveal a poster's previous aliases if it appears their name change is a deliberate attempt to confuse - which doesn't apply in your case, SB.

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:11:32 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Forum Administrator
Subject: Well here's a few for you
Message:
OWL
youdiditagain
No Statute of Limitations
LOL
Iamnottelling
Mirror
Think4yourself
Interferring

Think you'll find they're all one and the same, you any to add to that list?

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 06:28:56 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Forum Administrator
Subject: Multi-alias posting.
Message:
Thanks. I posted under Fact because simply I was attempting to state one, and then, when people responded I did say that it was me.

I like when for a change a FA is nice to me. I wonder who you are. LOL

Bless your heart for your dedication darling, whoever you are, honestly. Your 'service' is greatly appreciated.

SB

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 04:39:18 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: SB/Fact
Subject: Great post, Fact, (and a small request)
Message:
I thought that was you but could not figure out what the 'fact' was. You are also sounding different, more composed, stable and your English seems to have gone from that of an obraro to much better than mine. Waz up?
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 05:37:29 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: A Prince kissed me and I am awake now
Message:
Good morning to you. I am going to bed soon.

I want to live, that is what is happening. And I can think better because I am not so stressed out so I can write better.

My son has been with his father for a while and the enviroment at my home is simply adorable, read, I hope he never comes back. :0 Just joking.

How are u? Is the 2001 being kind to you?

Love,

Fact/sb

PS: Jim got mad at me for using more than one nick. While he was gone a FA said that it was ok, remember? ohhhh

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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 16:17:36 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Fact
Subject: Vaya, como pajaros abajo del sol?
Message:
ha aha ahaahahahahah
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Date: Fri, Jan 05, 2001 at 17:51:25 (GMT)
From: Fact
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Correcto ROFL
Message:
Who can be crying 24 hours of a day.

So I heard, everything passes. Oh, divine hope capacity we humans have...

A big hug,

sb

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