Pat:C) -:- If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 04:25:20 (EDT)

__ BTDT -:- Re: If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk -:- Fri, Aug 17, 2001 at 19:43:12 (EDT)

__ __ Pat:C) -:- Hi BTDT a a net jihad -:- Sat, Aug 18, 2001 at 13:46:32 (EDT)

__ __ __ BTDT -:- Re: Hi BTDT a a net jihad -:- Sat, Aug 18, 2001 at 14:49:17 (EDT)

__ Ian Dury -:- You are absolutely correct!!! -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 17:51:25 (EDT)

__ Cynthia -:- To: Patsy, Life is Good...a bit o/t -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:49:22 (EDT)

__ Cynthia -:- To: Patsy, Life is Good...a bit o/t -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:46:22 (EDT)

__ __ Cynthia -:- Shit! Why do.... -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:51:52 (EDT)

__ __ __ Pat:C) -:- hi Cynthia......................OT -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 18:54:49 (EDT)

__ Joe -:- Re: If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:38:25 (EDT)

__ __ a0aji -:- Nice post, Joe. [was: 'If you like it..'] [nt] -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 18:07:35 (EDT)

__ __ Pat:C) -:- A quick recap, Joe -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:46:35 (EDT)

__ __ __ Joe -:- Who is PSR? -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 17:38:45 (EDT)

__ __ __ __ Pat:C) -:- PSR = Prempal Singh Rawat [nt] -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 18:57:11 (EDT)

__ __ __ __ __ ji -:- Not pastrami, swiss on rye? [nt] -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 19:04:58 (EDT)

__ __ Joe -:- I'll be Thomas a Becket -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:46:14 (EDT)

__ Patrick Wilson -:- Re: If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:54:49 (EDT)

__ __ Deborah -:- You're right -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 23:37:02 (EDT)

__ __ Pat:C) -:- Good day, Patrick -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:15:40 (EDT)

__ __ Jim -:- Big mistake, Patrick W -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:10:08 (EDT)

__ such -:- miragey's dirty work: by premie proxy -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:43:23 (EDT)

__ __ TED Farkel -:- Mr. banana, ole TED'S a bit confused here... -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:18:11 (EDT)

__ __ __ such -:- will keep it under me turban -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:24:58 (EDT)

__ Jim -:- Great post, Pat -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:14:15 (EDT)

__ __ Pat:C) -:- Excuse me Jim, you do believe in yoga -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:30:32 (EDT)

__ __ __ Jim -:- Yoga? No, not the theory -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:07:08 (EDT)

__ __ __ __ Pat:C) -:- Re: Yoga? I don't disagree -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:19:20 (EDT)

__ Francesca :C) -:- ***BEST OF FORUM*** yeah, baby -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 12:34:06 (EDT)

__ __ Pat:C) -:- Thanks, Francesca for the tip -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:33:01 (EDT)

__ Richard -:- Pat answer to M's 'just walk'. -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 12:33:33 (EDT)

__ Way -:- Nict to read you again, Pat [nt] -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 10:34:25 (EDT)

__ Bob o -:- Re: If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 08:27:30 (EDT)

__ Senor Catweasel -:- If you don't, walk -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 06:52:52 (EDT)

__ __ Bobo -:- Re: If you don't, walk -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 08:31:57 (EDT)

__ __ __ CW -:- Re: If you don't, walk -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 09:26:08 (EDT)

__ __ __ __ Jim -:- That's quite an admission, Cat -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:17:49 (EDT)

__ __ __ __ __ CW -:- Re: That's quite an admission, Cat -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 22:59:50 (EDT)

__ __ __ __ Bobo -:- You make yourself very clear -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:03:31 (EDT)

__ __ __ __ __ such -:- cult-think: 'substance'-abuse [nt] -:- Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:53:16 (EDT)

Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 04:25:20 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: pdconlon@hotmail.com
To: All
Subject: If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk
Message:

Thus spake Miragey, the Speaker formerly known as the Superior Power in Person. (Now, what if you DO like it but you don't like him?)

 

I haven't had much time to visit the forum much lately but I did yesterday and a post here directed me to Lifes (sic) Great where I read a few threads too. It is obvious that the premies are not interested in debating with the exes and would seriously like us to disappear conveniently and quietly up our own arseholes never to be heard from evermore. And I wouldn't be surprised if Rev Rawat is praying to his dead daddy every night to get rid of the exes or at least he is cussing us out when he's in his cups.

 

I also know that the in-crowd of premies (still mostly men like Glen Whitewash Whittaker but with a smattering of women who have the stomach for intrigue and conspiracy - unlike my instructor friend who told me this and more) have heard through the grapevine that Balyouguesswhat has made it clear that exes are his Thomas a Becket. (I wish it were the other way around and that we could say: ''Why won't you rid me of this meddlesome priest?'')

 

As usual the Executive Friend of Elan Vital has let it be known what he REALLY wants the premies to do without putting it in writing or even saying it. He wants a net Jihad against the exes but without actually ordering it and he can later deny it. The way it works is that he says it to his brother who does not merit the title Raja Ji. RJ tells Glen Ji who in turn tells his chums in the cult like Glasser et al. (Knowing how this works is why I was so disgusted by the overtures made through Patrick Wilson. I knew it was spin.) They now know that the spin no longer works for a growing number of premies who read here. So the ad hominems have taken over - ''the exes are insane drug addicts etc.''

 

At first I was absolutely revolted by the in-crowd premies' amoral and infantile behaviour but now I see it as a service because several of my premie friends who have read here have expressed a horror at the premie posters' tactics. Most of my premie friends are just ordinary guys who basically never were in the cult (except psychologically, superstitiously and religiously - a folie a deux, a cult of only two, them and their master.) But I also know two instructors in England and two in Australia. I used to know several in the US but all but one have cut me out of their lives. The one thing that these have in common is that they are fairly sensible and down to earth women and do not like the cloak and dagger stuff that Glen and his good old boys so enjoy.

 

The net Jihad will last as long as the fanatics of the premie in-crowd have got the go-ahead from Rev Rawat. It is actually a blessing in disguise and is upsetting most of my ordinary premie friends. It will not be long before they are driven to make a break out of anger at Rawat's stooges. The net Jihad is making it obvious that it is a cult. Glen and the other forum monitors and their cult pals are doing all of our work for us. Every time Whitla or Glasser (under their mumerous aliases) or any number of other premie ghouls and ghosts makes one of their weird, twisted and irrational posts, another decent premie calls it quits.

 

Like Sir Dave, I had reservations about being called an ex and went so far as to call myself an unpremie. But it's only a label like liberal or green and I feel quite pleased to attach that label to myself. I was once proud to be called a premie. I thought that we were going to serve all human beings and cheer them up and make them happy and give them peace and take care of them and tell them the truth. I think most exes are still doing that and I am now proud to be called an expremie.

 

It is so obvious now that the premies who are following the Jihad by posting here are not lovers (premies) but are self-centered, infantile and immoral. In their twisted minds they are serving their god but in reality they are simply fighting to maintain their delusions. It is a fight for survival for their peace of mind because they know that without their master they cannot come home, that, if they doubt the purity of the master, they will be doomed and lost and abandoned. Heavy!

 

One of my premie friends emailed me and asked, ''Are you sure K works without M?'' Yes, premies, it does. I practiced K in order to get to the point where I felt as full of energy and as strong as I did after darshan. I saw unfortunately that most premies were not interested in developing their own strength but were content to be weak and only get high and feel great when they went to see Rawat. As a result most of the premies in my community are severely mentally unhealthy and often depressed, unbalanced and neurotic.

 

K does not cure mental problems. Those have to be healed with psychological means. The only reason that Rawat has not addressed the mental health issue is because he is crazy. He demonized the mind because he is nuts. He drank himself into a stupor because he was so depressed and ill at ease, dis-eased. K is for releasing energy and developing strength and feeling great. And I like it - as do quite a few expremies. So, how can I ''walk'' as Rawat has advised me to?

 

The fact is that I think that all exes liked ''it'' and that's why we cannot ''walk.'' By ''it'' I mean the energy that was around when we first got K. The enthusiasm, the excitement, the love and happiness. What we don't like is the way that rawat has parlayed that into a money-making scam all the while not even really enjoying ''it'' himself or even making any effort to attain ''it.'' He took our simple hope for serving the human race cheerfully and twisted it into a horrible solipsistic cult whose inner-circle henchmen think nothing of lying and playing infantile games.

 

I'll stop calling myself an expremie and ''walk'' when Rawat tells the truth. I'll walk when he says the following:

 

1) He was ignorant and opportunistic when he first came to the west and filled out heads with nonsense instead of learning from us - and we had a lot to share.

 

2) He is a greedy, materialistic and money-grubbing conman with no real love for human beings and a taste for coarse and low pursuits.

 

3) He knows nothing about kundalini yoga but is using the last four gyanyoga techniques in a superstitious and primitive way as a means of ensnaring people against every ideal that Patanjali ever expressed.

 

4) He will return all the money that he has conned out of people and put it in a fund for reimbursing premies who suffered at his hands or those of his employees such as Jagdeo.

 

5) He will study kundalini under a competent teacher and then explain to his devotees that a guru/master is unnecessary (as Patanjali insisted) and free them from the fear of rotting or going to hell if they ''doubt the purity of the master.''

 

As long he he says things like that last piece of garbage, I will be an ''expremie'' determined to bring him to account and make him atone for his sins against humanity. I detest Rawat because I enjoy what he calls ''Knowledge'' so much. Sorry, premies, but I won't be taking that ''walk'' soon. Rawat knows what I'm talking about. Do you?

 

I noticed that aOaji posted his pic (thanks) and I recently found this bookmark of Bobby's pics of us exes.

 

Expremies Then and Now.

Bloody hell - I hate posting this without reviewing it first to see if the link works. WE NEED A PREVIEW MODE FOR NEW POSTS.

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Date: Fri, Aug 17, 2001 at 19:43:12 (EDT)
From: BTDT
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk
Message:

At the risk of sounding ignorant, what is a 'net jihad'?

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Date: Sat, Aug 18, 2001 at 13:46:32 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: BTDT
Subject: Hi BTDT a a net jihad
Message:

At the risk of sounding ignorant, what is a 'net jihad'?


---

I meant attacking the expremies on the internet. Up until recently premies were told not to engage us on the net. Apparently that order from M has been lifted and since then we've seen premies using the net to attack us (Charles Glasser's website calling us insane drug addicts etc.)

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Date: Sat, Aug 18, 2001 at 14:49:17 (EDT)
From: BTDT
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: Hi BTDT a a net jihad
Message:

Ahhhhh. Well then, that's bit hypocritical isn't it?

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 17:51:25 (EDT)
From: Ian Dury
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: You are absolutely correct!!!
Message:

Ever since Michael Dettmers and Michael Donner began speaking out, a number of inner-circle PAM's were (and still are) actively trying to 'discredit' Dettmers and Donner. Any pwk who has questions about Dettmers and Donners posts are sent to speak with an instructor and are told that Dettmers and Donner are 'disloyal opportunists, with their own hidden agendas' or 'former disgruntled employees who are upset because Maharaji fired them'.

Paranoia runs deep - when you have something to hide.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:49:22 (EDT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: To: Patsy, Life is Good...a bit o/t
Message:

Hi Pat!

Great to see you posting again--I agree with Fran, it's a keeper. How are Andy and Charles? How're the four-legged family members? Giving great darshan I'm sure.

Tell Charles that my cat Clara escaped for five days, and one morning, just as I was telling Tom that the ''dynamics of our cat household seem better with two,'' she came back! Those four-leggeds are a wonder for mental health!

A letter in our local rag by our local humane society lady requested today that everyone ''please leave your pets indoors at night!''

The Fishers are coming out extra early this year and have been spotted in the area where we live....a lot of cats have gone missing.

This is o/t I know....Have a great vacation....and give my love through lots of hugs to your family.

Life is good...
Love,
Cynthia

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:46:22 (EDT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: To: Patsy, Life is Good...a bit o/t
Message:

Hi Pat!

Great to see you posting again--I agree with Fran, it's a keeper. How are Andy and Charles? How're the four-legged family members? Giving great darshan I'm sure.

Tell Charles that my cat Clara escaped for five days, and one morning, just as I was telling Tom that the ''dynamics of our cat household seem better with two,'' she came back! Those four-leggeds are a wonder for mental health!

A letter in our local rag by our local humane society lady requested today that everyone ''please leave your pets indoors at night!''

The Fishers are coming out extra early this year and have been spotted in the area where we live....a lot of cats have gone missing.

This is o/t I know....Have a great vacation....and give my love through lots of hugs to your family.

Life is good...
Love,
Cynthia

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:51:52 (EDT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Shit! Why do....
Message:

my posts appear twice? Ya got me! It's gotta be the fuckin' netscape browser. But IE is worse! Yikes!

My computer is a *#!))))))#*#*#*#*#* pest!

Sorry for taking up the space!

C

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 18:54:49 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: hi Cynthia......................OT
Message:

I will give C and A hugs from you and tell Chuck about your pussies and the fishers. Posting that message got me in trouble because I then just had to read the forum this am and answer and ended up late for the salt mines. But it's great to see all you guys again. Only two more weeks of 14 hour days and I'll be back with a vengeance. Hope you are settled in. Love, Pat

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:38:25 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk
Message:

Pat, very interesting, but I think you're overstating some things. But I don't agree there is a 'jihad' and if Maharaji doesn't like what we are saying, which I don't doubt, are you suggesting that he wants premies to take some kind of violent action to stop people from saying what they are saying? That's ridiculous.

And if by 'jihad' you mean premies trying to counter what exes are saying on the internet, that is a change, but it happened a long time ago when Maharaji gave up on his 'anti-internet' view and put up his own website and EV did the same. That opened the can of worms and was a terrible mistake. Premies, actually anyone, talking about Maharaji in any kind of an open forum is completely detrimental to what he wants.

Charles Glasser Jr., has said some outrageous things, and he has paid the price, and will continue to pay the price if he continues. It destroys his credibility and it makes Maharaji look awful.

I think it was just sooner or later that there would be some kind of response from premies, but as you know they are terrified to address anything specifically, so all we get is, 'I don't care' about Maharaji's past, personal life, and all the rest. If it's a 'jihad' it's about the most inept one I could imagine.

I think you give Rawat more credit than he is due for having some kind of 'plan' to deal with ex-premies. Maharaji has never planned anything much in his life, and is awful at it when he tries. I think he just reacts at the time, obviously uncarring about how that contradicts his earlier statements, positions or 'plans.'

And as for liking 'it,' the enthusiasm around the cult in the 70s, yes I did like some of it for awhile. But I don't want it back, and I'm not looking for that and current premies don't have it either. I think the reason I liked the cult in the beginning is because it relieved stress, gave me a purpose for life, and I liked a lot of the premies. That's why I liked it. But I was a distressed adolescent at the time, so I was susceptible to it. I don't think 'knowledge' or practicing 'knowledge' had anything to do with making me feel good, and never did. And it doesn't for premies now, either. Plus, I don't see much of any 'enthusiasm' among premies now. It's entirely different in that respect. It's just a Maharaji religion now.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 18:07:35 (EDT)
From: a0aji
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Nice post, Joe. [was: 'If you like it..'] [nt]
Message:

[nt]

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:46:35 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: A quick recap, Joe
Message:

Up until a few months ago PSR had told premies not to engage with us on the net. I even posted an email from one of my EV honcho friends saying that people like Whitla were an embarrasment to PSR. (I posted it on AG as it outed DW against FV policies.)

Well, recently the word among the in-crowd premies is that PSR has given the nod to engage us anyway they want. Like you, I don't believe that he is competent enough to make plans and probably said something like, ''Yeah, go get those bastards!'' when he was drunk. But he does have an innate cunning and is shrewdy in a sleazy way.

PS I have watched that Burton/O'Toole movie many times. Suposedly they played rude with each other in their teens and then continued the homoeroticism as adults by bedding the same woman.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 17:38:45 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Who is PSR?
Message:

I really doubt Maharaji says the same thing about much of anything from one day to the next. Only his stage act is relatively consistent -- boring and empty but consistent.

Your EV honcho friends think that posts are embarrassing?

So, will the EV honchos now start 'getting the bastards?' We certainly haven't seen that. It seems it's mostly the bongo fringe that is willing to engage in posts about Maharaji on the internet. Until we see the likes of Linda Gross, and initiators, Glen Whittaker, and the EV establishment posting and defending M in an open forum setting, I won't believe there is some kind of directive from Himself to do that.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 18:57:11 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: PSR = Prempal Singh Rawat [nt]
Message:

[nt]

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 19:04:58 (EDT)
From: ji
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Not pastrami, swiss on rye? [nt]
Message:

[nt]

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:46:14 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: I'll be Thomas a Becket
Message:

Played by Richard Burton of course. It is widely believed that Thomas and Henry were lovers at some point, hence there was a lot of personal business involved, besides church/state concerns. I'd love to be able to excommunicate people who I find annoying.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:54:49 (EDT)
From: Patrick Wilson
Email: patrick@patrickwilson.com
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk
Message:

I also know that the in-crowd of premies...have heard through the grapevine that Balyouguesswhat has made it clear that exes are his Thomas a Becket.

I don't undestand what the parallel is here. Is Maharaji supposed to be like Henry 2nd or what? Please explain, I am mystified about this simile.

He wants a net Jihad against the exes but without actually ordering it and he can later deny it. The way it works is that he says it to his brother who does not merit the title Raja Ji. RJ tells Glen Ji who in turn tells his chums in the cult like Glasser et al. (Knowing how this works is why I was so disgusted by the overtures made through Patrick Wilson. I knew it was spin.)

Without wanting to get too bogged down in this -on the occasion that Michael Dettmers was staying here in Brighton he did indeed speak and subsequently see Raja Ji but it was Michael's idea to call him (since they were old friends) and not Glen's or mine. (although I told Michael that Raji Ji was in town) My part in this was merely to attempt to locate Raja Ji for Michael, to which end I asked Glen for a number. Glen, for your information, did not provide any number and furthermore said that he was of the opinion that Raja Ji would not want to speak with anyone who had spoken against Maharaji in the way Michael had done.
Michael eventually got a message throuygh to Raja Ji through someone else. Raja Ji rung back. Actually no overtures were made through me at all. Raja Ji almost certainly would not have wanted their private meeting to be public knowledge and I think I rather put my foot in it mentioning it . NB. Michael Dettmers has emphasised that their meeting was private and as such he never received any 'spin' message to broadcast. To be honest with you, I have no idea what they talked about. So there was no spin put out on that occasion unless you are suggesting I was the author of the spin.

Actually I hoped that that meeting might give Michael a better chance to get his complaints directly heard by Maharaji via his brother. I don't know what the outcome of their meeting was. From what Dettmer's said it was kind of more or less personal between him and Raja Ji and not about the poilitics of M and exes. OK?

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 23:37:02 (EDT)
From: Deborah
Email: None
To: Patrick Wilson
Subject: You're right
Message:

Michael told me in an email that they had an agreement that he (Michael) would NOT discuss their conversation on forum. Not that they didn't talk about Maha (I can't see how the topic could be avoided) but the meeting was to get together as friends.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:15:40 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Patrick Wilson
Subject: Good day, Patrick
Message:

Yes, I was referring to Henry 11. After Becket was murdered the king punished the assassins and wept and said that he had been misunderstood.

I was not really talking about the Dettmers/RJ meeting. I don't remember the details of the stuff leading up to it but I do recall that Glen said some nice sounding reconciliatory stuff like the expremies concerns are being taken seriously and his holeyness is addressing the issues etc.

At the time I was annoyed that you seem to think that he was sincere and made the mistake of badmouthing you for which I apologised. I wish I could recall the exact dates of those posts because I would like to reread them. My point is that, at the time you and several others seemed to be pleased by Rawat's reconciliatory gestures but that I saw them as cynical spin. I hope I have made myself clear that I do not doubt your sincerity.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:10:08 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Patrick Wilson
Subject: Big mistake, Patrick W
Message:

Raja Ji rung back.

Rang?

Credibility, Patrick. Credibility.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:43:23 (EDT)
From: such
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: miragey's dirty work: by premie proxy
Message:

Ever notice how miragey always has da poor premies do his dirty work for him?

for example, let some innocent premie servant take the rap on the police report after the vehicular manslaughter in India, direct premies to aid and abet the flight of criminal fugitive assassins Fakiranand and Fletcher, get some premies to pass da word along that he would like a new luxury car, get some premies to cajole and lay guilt-trips on each community to fork out dough for a new jet, direct premies to procure blonde young women devotees for his sexual pleasure, get premies to buy his drugs and booze, approve a premie jihad against the heretical brothers and sisters [i.e. 'this is a war'], etc. etc. etc. -- so his own stained hands can publicly appear clean.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:18:11 (EDT)
From: TED Farkel
Email: None
To: such
Subject: Mr. banana, ole TED'S a bit confused here...
Message:

Dear Mr. S-banana-

With all due respect sir, I have to say that your statements about our Lord and master, Prem Pal, are a might bit confusing, son...

See, our Speaker doesn't get anyone to do his dirty work for him...

And that's cos he's his own man, and also cos not a leaf moves without him doing it, which if you studied some of them old satsangs of our Speakers, you would quickly surmise...

So, our Speaker does EVERYTHING in this world, it's just an illusion that we think its all these other dudes doing things....
So its really Prem Pal who's doing all that mischief, and your all caught up in the illuion when you think its the premies doin it for him...

At least that's the way ole Dave Smith explained it to me last night after a half dozen foamies after the nature videos at the end of satsang...

Sincerely,
TED Farkel

PS: Mr. S-banana, Dave told me not to tell too many people that Prem Pal does EVERYTHING (I guess that includes starting and maintaining this site...hmmm..), but jus kinda keep it under your hat, so to speak...
I'm sure you understand.....

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 16:24:58 (EDT)
From: such
Email: None
To: TED Farkel
Subject: will keep it under me turban
Message:

[hush-hush]

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:14:15 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Great post, Pat
Message:

Patrick,

I like your post so much I'm taking the liberty of reposting it on LG. However, because, as you know, I think Kundalini and all like philosophies are bunk, I'm taking the further liberty of excising that part of your post from my repost. Indeed, I feel so strongly about this that I'm taking the even further liberty of replacing that part with the following:

Having exhausted myself instepcting the archaic, pre-scientific philosphical curio cabinet of Indian spirituality, I'm happy to finally report there's no there there. To paraphrase many who traditionally plagiarized each other with great abandon, if you took all the waters in the ocean and converted it to ink, and all the forests in the world and turned them into paper, and wrote all the ideas of God and spirituality that have ever crossed man's mind, you would have completely wasted a hell of a lot of water and a hell of a lot of wood for sweet fuck all.

I'd have run this by you first but I knew you wouldn't mind.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:30:32 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Excuse me Jim, you do believe in yoga
Message:

I thought you had just taken up exercising and are beginning to feel very nice. As Joe pointed out it releases endorphins. Now that's kundalini - the ''coiled energy'' which is released through exercise (or ecstatic devotion or transcendental faith etc.) Rawat's K is a perversion of the yoga mental health techniques to stop people from having nutty ideas about that energy.

 

Anyway I like your rewrite because, eventhough I am a card-carrying breatharian, I don't buy the primitive Hindu BS. I just hope you also repost the doggie darshan link on LG too.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:07:08 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Yoga? No, not the theory
Message:

Pat,

I definitely don't buy into any of the philosphy behind yoga but of course any kind of physical activity like it could be better than nothing and even quite peaceful if it's peacful kind of stuff. Like Tai Chi, I guess. Same thing. Kundalini, though, the whole idea of 'spiritual energy coiled at the base of the spine' which can be 'awakened' is, as far as I know, bunk. Endorphins aren't, to the best of my knowledge, bundled up at the base of one's spine. Nor can esoteric juju practises release a torrent of them in a bold explosion of spiritual empowerment and enlightenment. And I think it's unfair to science and too kind to hindu philosophy to force the endorsement.

That's what I think, anyway.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 15:19:20 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Re: Yoga? I don't disagree
Message:

I hope you realize that I use all those Hindu words because of the audience. Like you I think all the spiritual stuff is pure BS. Actually I am beginning to think that most spiritual stuff came from taking psychedelic drugs and are imaginary.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 12:34:06 (EDT)
From: Francesca :C)
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: ***BEST OF FORUM*** yeah, baby
Message:

Pat,

Just wanted to add that the 'edit this message' function is grand. Just read your message once you've posted it, hit that link and edit away. It will fix the message on the fly. I've even gone to other web pages and come back to F6 and been able to fix it. Not sure if I can do it once I've closed the browser.

So try it, you'll like it. It's almost as good. It just means that the 'mistakes' are posted until you fix em. Not a biggie.

LOVE, Francesca

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:33:01 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Francesca :C)
Subject: Thanks, Francesca for the tip
Message:

about the edit mode. I had used it once before but I wrote my post late last night and was not thinking straight.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 12:33:33 (EDT)
From: Richard
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Pat answer to M's 'just walk'.
Message:

Good going Pat. As I posted to Joy above, I woke up thinking no more forum only to find you've distilled megabytes of forum posts into a statement Martin Luther would have been proud of. 'Just walk' is about as empty, passive agressive and dismissive a slogan as Nancy Reagan's 'Just Say No to Drugs'. I did walk in 1987 but eventually had to return to face the reasons I came to GMJ in the first place and why I walked later. I've concluded - after months of reading, posting and introspection - that all I would like to hear from Prem Pal Singh Rawat (too much dissonance in calling him Maharaji anymore) is his taking personal responsibility beginning with his allowing, through commission or ommission, Jagdeo and others to abuse human beings in the name of SatGuru. Maybe I want to see a bit of humanity from him so I don't have to feel so odd at having believed he was ever divine.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 10:34:25 (EDT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Nict to read you again, Pat [nt]
Message:

[nt]

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 08:27:30 (EDT)
From: Bob o
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: If you like it, fine. If you don't, walk
Message:

Very good and cool post pat!!

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 06:52:52 (EDT)
From: Senor Catweasel
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: If you don't, walk
Message:

Speaking as one who has been around these parts for a while now Pat , amd also as someone every bit as well informed as your spies, let me tell you one simple thing. There is no Jihad. But you will find that many people who do not agree with you wil not allow your opinions to stand with complete impugnity.
Your descriptive narrative is simply the product of your ever over active and creative , if not a little paranoid imagination.
Collectively to a lot of people you lot are a pain in the arse.(Me ? I dont care but I think there is an amazing amount of bullshit spouted here.) So I guess we agree with your spies version of M's feelings. You have safety in numbers here ,that is all. (Dont agree? Chop em down quick Discredit them! . Describe how brainwashed they all are.)
Simple fact is you are the one with the problem. You are the one bitchin . If you dont like... as you say ... WALK

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 08:31:57 (EDT)
From: Bobo
Email: None
To: Senor Catweasel
Subject: Re: If you don't, walk
Message:

Why don't you ever come up with some substance?? Even from my premie years I cannot remember a taboo on that like you seem to have. Does knowledge and 'the master' really erode human features that much???

Or are you just a dumb asshole?

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 09:26:08 (EDT)
From: CW
Email: None
To: Bobo
Subject: Re: If you don't, walk
Message:

This is cyberspace Bobo. You think you are talking to someone. Try and get this. There doesn't need to be substance. This is not Philosopy 3 at Princeton. And Bobo? With a name like that you call for substance. Give me a break!

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:17:49 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: CW
Subject: That's quite an admission, Cat
Message:

It's good to see you admit that you never actually say anything. I wonder what you think you could possobily accomplish this way. Must be just a nervous reaction to the truth, I guess.

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 22:59:50 (EDT)
From: CW
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Re: That's quite an admission, Cat
Message:

Oh but I do sometimes Jim. Yes sometimes I really get down and talk things through. But not with you or any of your minions!

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:03:31 (EDT)
From: Bobo
Email: None
To: CW
Subject: You make yourself very clear
Message:

So I can safely assume your density is a direct consequence of xx years of devotion and practice(?) ?

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Date: Thurs, Aug 16, 2001 at 14:53:16 (EDT)
From: such
Email: None
To: Bobo
Subject: cult-think: 'substance'-abuse [nt]
Message:

hohoho

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