Time for a little
textual exigesis. Here's Brian's post with my
comments:
I read your long post below, and was
interested in your story. All of us who were
involved with Maharaji can personally relate to
parts of it.
Good.
But you don't OWE anyone here an accounting
of your life. Those who feel that you do are as
mistaken on this point as they have repeatedly been
on other points of blame in the past. if you're
attempting to convince them of your 'innocence' of
whatever criminal look they've chosen to paint you
with - it just won't happen.
First question: who is Brian talking about? Who
are these people who are 'as mistaken on this point
as they have repeatedly been on other points of
blame in the past'? Is he talking about you, Nige?
Joe? Katie maybe? Who?
I mean that sounds pretty harsh just out of the
gate. You mean we have a serial blamer here? Scary
stuff.
But then there's Brian jumping in to protect
Michael, I guess. Let's deal with the philosophical
question, though, before it passes us by. Do YOU
agree that neither Michael nor any other PAM owes
us or any one us any accounting of any kind? If so,
then you must think that every last bit of
infmormation Michael's given us so far has all been
gratuitous. The guy headed up our master's cult for
years but no, he doesn't owe us any explanation.
You agree with that or not?
Personally, I think it's hogwash. Tell me, why
do you think Micahel feels as good as he does right
now (yeah it sounds like he feels GREAT!)? Is it
because he just did something superflous, coming
out clearly against the cult as he has? No, of
course not. It's because he's doing the right
thing. And he knows it. And we all know it. And
Brian, bless his heart, is simply wrong about
this.
But that's just my opinion. What's yours?
Most, if not all, of the people who use the
forum have found and chosen to use it on their own,
and for their own reasons. None of them have been
called on the carpet and been subjected to the
accountability that you have.
Oooooh, heaVY! What is this shit, may I ask?
What 'own reasons' is he talking about? And
accountability? For what? Forgetting to write 'OT'?
Well the FA took us to task for that. I agree it
was serious but ... really, where is this going?
Let's see:
But among to many here, unless you are
willing to take some blood-oath of loyalty to what
is perceived by an over-vocal minority here to be
'the rational position' indicating ex-premie
purity, you'll still find yourself wearing a big
red 'P' in their eyes.
Again, who's Brian talking about? Is that you,
Nigel, with your so-called 'rational position'? Are
YOU Robespierre or Calvin or whomever? Who are
these ugly tyrants tar-and-feathering the valiant
religious minorities amongst us? Who's got the red
paint brush, I guess we need to know. SOMEONE'S
GONE TOO FAR AND BRIAN'S JUMPING IN TO STOP A
LYNCHING!
So who's he talking about anyway?
Conversations that you have with these people
will continue to be posted here by them. You have
no 'right' to privacy or confidentiality with them.
Whatever confidences they might choose to keep in
life, they are incapable of respecting your right
and choice to keep confidences.
Bingo! He's talking about me, Nige. But,
know what? I never once posted anything about any
of our conversations without Michael's knowledge
beforehand. He knew what I was about and I never
hid it. SO WHAT IS THIS SHIT, NIGE? I tried to ask
Brian myself in a particularly measured response
but, as Katie herself smirked, Brian never reads my
posts.
This forum was never set up to target
individual premies. Most people use it as a means
of communicating their own feelings with the small
group of people wandering the globe who have gone
through the same 'experience' as they have. For
those undergoing the process of removing themselves
from all the garbage beliefs that got them into and
keep them involved in the cult, it's very
beneficial to be able to read and post anonymously
here.
No argument -- to some extent. As I've said
before, I still think that anyone who uses the cult
to their own advantage, as Michael did when her
first blurbed it onto his resume as he did, is fair
game. That's it. And if that person was extremely
highly-placed in the cult, all the more so. But
then that's my opinion. Again, what's yours?
In the time we were involved together in the
cult, we called each other brother and sister. But,
let's face it - many of the people we shared 'that
experience' with were, are, and will continue to
be, assholes. Most were 'low-ranking' assholes who
wanted to be 'high-ranking' assholes. This forum is
probably the only place in their lives where
they've achieved that illustrious goal.
So you take issue with my slagging Brian a bit.
Well, as a low-ranking asshole who's only interest
in this forum is to make myself seem like a
high-ranking asshole, I resent that. But then who
cares what us assholes think. Brian seems to
know what we think but that's different.
Nigel, how would you like it if someone accused
you of having one agenda here and that being
self-aggrandizement? That's it, one interest.
Others here, like dear sweet ... oh I won't even
mention her name ... they're here for the
right reason. But you, Nigel, well,
we've got your number. Tell me, Nige, how would you
like it?
Next question: do you believe that about me?
Any former members of the cult who ranked
higher than these newly-arrived giants are also
assholes in their sight.
Just ask Dettmers if he ever, for a second, got
the sense that I felt that way about him, even when
he wasn't really talking? This is wholesale
imagined bullshit and you know it. At least about
me, it is.
Okay, so Brian's diatribe wasn't just about me.
I know that. So tell me, Nige, do you think that
this blast fairly applies to anyone? Is that what
Roger, for example, is all about? He wasn't a PAM
so -- FOR THAT REASON -- he hates them? And if not
me or Roger, who would this slam pertain to?
Joe? Is that why Joe was so hard on Dettmers?
What IS your opinion, Nige. I can't have this
discussion with Brian so maybe you can help
explain. If you don't know just make shit up. I
think that's the idea, isn't it?
The common desire here to hold Maharaji
accountable for his actions, lies and theft is
understsndable. But using this forum to supoena
people who ARE NOT Maharaji to an online trial here
is diverting this resource to serve petty personal
agendas.
Let's overlook the hyperbole, shall we? Let's
get down to the 'petty personal agendas'. What are
they, Nigel? Please.
And refusing to respect the efforts of other
ex-members of the cult (whatever their past access
to 'The Lord') to post honestly here without
threats of online reprisals if the content falls
short of a guilty plea is reprehensible.
I'm sure you thought nothing much about this
part of his post. But maybe that's just because
you're one of the lucky ones. You've never BEEN
threatened like that by me or my crew, have you?
We're talking 'online reprisals', Nigel. It isn't
pretty. In fact, there's a moral rottenness to this
revolution. There are bodies on the street that
don't LOOK like they should be there. And where's
all the money gone anyway?
Good for Brian, for sticking up for the true and
righteous, I guess. And aren't I a motherfucker for
slagging him?
You can choose for yourself whether you want
to involve yourself with Jim Heller. He posts under
his own name and has chosen to be held accountable
for his words and anctions online by doing so. I
don't doubt that if you or any other ex-PAM's fart
on the phone to him, we'll all 'get' to smell
it.
Nigel, I'm going to do the very thing that
Brian's accused me of here. I'm going to reveal a
secret of yours. You -- yes YOU, Nigel -- have,
from time to time, emailed me. Yes, that's right.
You have, as recently as a week ago, chosen for
yourself whether you wanted to involve yourself
with me. And here I am telling the world!
How do you feel now, sucker???? Got you, didn't
I?
But 'Roger E. Drek' also has a real name. If
he continues to use this forum (which is paid for
by volunteers who want to support the spreading of
truth online) to ANONYMOUSLY carry on a personal
campaign against you, or to publicise here any
off-site material 'exposing you', feel free to ask
me for it.
Okay, new ground rules. When Joey slagged Roger
-- insanely, I might add -- as a cult operative
(can you imagine a worse accusation for a recent
ex?), pornographer and general devil, Roger outed
him once to the extent that he reported that he was
posting from an internet cafe in Montreal. In fact,
that might have been even because Joey was posting
under some alias then. I can't recall.
Anyway, Brian and Katie treated that little
defensive measure on Roger's part as a profoundly
evil cardinal sin.
Need I say more?
And congratulations on being able to
extricate yourself from the trap we all walked
onto.
Well, I have no disagreement with that last
sentence. In fact, the post would have been
absolutely EXCELLENT if he just hadn't added the
other parts.
Your thoughts?
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